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View Full Version : I am not sure what to think. Sorry for the long post, but please help.



parentof1
03-15-2012, 11:10 AM
I am a mom to a 3 y/o boy and an ECE, so I have some exp. behind both formal and informal, and I don't really know what to do so I am posting here for help.

My son just started at a new dayhome (as I do not think it is a good idea for me to have him at the daycare at which I work so that favoritism, and stuff can be avoided)

Today is his fifth day, and he seems sorta happy to go, but I can't say. I ask him and he doesn't say much, and he is usually a very good communicator and can tell me in his own way when something is wrong.

His provider keeps saying that he doesn't want to follow her instructions, and is hard to handle that his behaviors were and are unacceptable, but when I ask for specifics..she just roles her eyes saying he is hard to handle....So I really don't know how to help her. She just doesn't seem to have patience. It looks like she says something once and if he doesn't do it he's a "unacceptable kid." (her words)

Yesterday I arrived to pick him up and his pants were soaked..like he had an accident, I asked why he wasn't changed as he has wipes, pull ups, and clothing there..Her answer..."He didn't want me to change him, and I didn't want to deal with that." Pardon? He goes to the potty most times, but sometimes it takes him a bit in a new place, and it helps him if they have a potty routine. I don't think she does...And she hasn't asked me how to help her with this.

His 3rd day he was her only daycare child, and yet she said he was "hard to deal with." I have called his other daycares/dayhomes for honest feedback (he has been in 2 others. They say, he can be challenging and wants to do everything for himself, but he eventually comes, and listens when you remind him of consequences, and give him praise for what he does right. He is the same for me.)

WWYD? Should I pull him? She doesn't really highlight any of his good behaviors, only his "bad" ones and its really starting to feel as if she is attacking my parenting...So it's hard to look at this fairly.

michellesmunchkins
03-15-2012, 11:19 AM
As a Mom...go with your gut!!! Yes all kids even the older ones have a transition period but as a daycare provider I would NEVER roll my eyes at a parent when describing their child, that's just rude! As a daycare provider if I feel a child has been inappropriate and unacceptable to the point that I need to tell the parent I ALWAYS give them examples of what happened (ex. Child X smashed his plate on the floor in anger today etc.) You can't help if you don't know what he is doing.

As for the wet clothes...its her JOB to make sure he is safe, secure and clean/dry!!! Even if it means having a 'battle' so to say with the child I would have changed his clothes. Sure he can be independent and what to do everything himself, but there will be times when the provider needs to step in and do her job. For me, as a provider praise and rewards work way better than consequences (ex Child X if you come change your wet clothes we'll be able to do xyz activity or play outside etc.)

As a Mom..my 3 year old daughter was abused in a wee watch home daycare and I went with my gut. She was such an outgoing little girl until she went to this one particular daycare. She totally introverted in just 2 weeks and the provider used to always tell me similar things like she refused to eat or she refused to do such and such. She was 3 at the time too. If it was me, I would pull my child for sure...doesn't sound like this provider respects you or your child very much. Just my opinion....

parentof1
03-15-2012, 11:21 AM
Oh and the last dayhomes closed so that's why he's been at two others.

Michellesmunchkins, she says we have until the end of the month and the SHE will have to terminate him. She is making him sound like Chuckie, when it may just be him testing her because he is new to the home...

Because I have never been a director, or a dayhome owner I may be neglecting to ask the right questions, so what can I ask to make sure that they don't find his type of challenges hard to handle?

Sandbox Sally
03-15-2012, 11:42 AM
I would pull him. You know this isn't right. As Michelle said, I would NEVER tell a parent that their child was a problem unless I could tell them specific incidents. I would also never ever leave a child sitting in his own urine. That's just negligent.

parentof1
03-15-2012, 11:53 AM
@ Alphaghetti So what do my husband and I say if providers ask why we are seeking new care?

Emily3
03-15-2012, 12:02 PM
Please take your little one out of that centre!!!! If the provider can not even be bothered to tell you what her concerns are she certainly can not be bothered making any effort to work through them. You don't owe a new provider a reason for looking for new care. It would probably be helpful to both your family and a new provider to be aware that there are some behaviour issues so you can all work together!!!! Maybe try looking for someone with a Montessori background so that his independence is encouraged within a structured setting.

Momof4
03-15-2012, 12:15 PM
Oh hell yes, I would get him out of there fast! Please don't be discouraged about home daycares but do find someone better. Next time you go out to interview somebody watch carefully how they interact with your son, ask a million questions and get difinitive answers, not wishy-washy crap like this woman dished out to you. When I have a problem with a child I am always specific with the parent or else how can we solve the problem? But it sounds like she isn't doing anything to care for him at all if his pants were all wet and he seems afraid to tell you things. Poor little guy.

parentof1
03-15-2012, 12:16 PM
Ladies,

I just started my job at this daycare center, and I know that I need to find a new place for him, but I am facing a real time crunch here, and cannot afford to take a leave while I find care that works --I know my child comes first and I really want to do what's right but am very stuck, because I do not want to lose my job.

Momof4
03-15-2012, 12:18 PM
I always interview families at night. Get out to some interviews in the evening with your family ASAP and move your son as soon as you find somebody great, hopefully on Monday!

Inspired by Reggio
03-15-2012, 12:32 PM
I always interview families at night. Get out to some interviews in the evening with your family ASAP and move your son as soon as you find somebody great, hopefully on Monday!

Agreed - most of us in 'home daycare' do our interviews in the evening so that strangers are not in the program unless we are SURE they are the match for the program.

I agree I would not be wanting to STAY there ... the rolling of the eyes, the unwillingness to be DIRECT about the behaviour challenges she is finding and the leaving him in wet clothing intentionally are all unprofessional and grounds for termination - your child deserves to thrive!

Is the centre you are employed at a 'one room centre' cause I have worked will lots of peers who were able to have their child in the same centre with them - they just made sure to work in another room and at the times of the day where you 'had' to be in the same room for whatever reason the team agreed that someone ELSE would do any behaviour redirecting of the child and the child was sent the clear message that 'mommy is working right now and her hands have to help ALL the children' type thing to help with any dominating of attention?

Personally as an ECE myself - one of the perks of this job is being able to be CLOSE to our own kids during their early years every centre I have every worked at actually promotes employees to have their children in the program, offers discounts and so forth and if it is 'not working' for the parent or child than they address that at the time - but they always try first cause if it works what a BONUS for you and your child and if it does not work than either the child gets moved to another classroom OR the parent gets temporarily moved to another age group so as to not be working with their own child ... I personally could not place my child at another daycare than where I was working in order to care for others kids :(

Have you talked to your new boss to see if TRYING is an option??

Cadillac
03-15-2012, 12:35 PM
SORRY - but if a kid pees his pants and doesn't want to be changed TOO FREAKING BAD! This is a huge red flag for me. makes me wonder what other things she is not doing. She rolls her eyes at you? ARE YOU KIDDING ME? Pull him! There are plenty of other daycare who would have the better patience, discipline, and knowledge of children to treat your child properly.

It's not uncommon for 3 year old boys to be stubborn or for children to test boundaries when in a new setting

Cadillac
03-15-2012, 12:38 PM
@ Alphaghetti So what do my husband and I say if providers ask why we are seeking new care?

Tell them exactly what happened. Your kid isn't chuckie. he's a 3 yr old boy. You won't make him look bad. you'll make the provider look bad. people will want to help you in this sort of situation

playfelt
03-15-2012, 12:53 PM
I'll take the other side just to give you some feedback. For whatever reason and my family tease me all the time about why can't I just find some "normal" kids for care but I will accept the challenging and give them a chance.

First the caregiver and you have to realize the child is three. By the time my gang are three I can say something and they just do it. All I have to say is lunch is almost ready and they start to clean up and come to the table etc. without me having to say anything but from the time they were one they have been part of that learning. The caregiver needs to remember that she will need to explain everythign to the child. At the same time your child may feel like he is constantly being told what to do when the caregiver is just trying to assist him to integrate. We also forget that other providers do things differently so we can't just assume that they child has done certain things a certain way before. Change isn't easy and if you are used to putting the big trucks under the shelf instead of beside the closet you can forget easily and get in trouble or at least feel that you are.

Your child has already been labelled challenging by other providers who had the benefit of time to train him in their ways so give your next caregiver and your son time too.

I have had an older child that would put up a physical fight to be changed, dressed for outside etc. In the old days this kind of tantrum got a spanking and child usually stopped and obeyed. Now we put them in time out. So if your child didn't want to cooperate to get his wet clothes changed then he is old enough to either do it himself or suffer the chaffing of wet clothes - do not blame the daycare provider. If your child was 18 months that is different we battle through those kinds of tantrums because we can due the size and strength of the child and change them anyway.

I am a little surprised at the number of caregivers that are saying to remove the child. What makes you so sure the child will cooperate any better in another new situation. Time is such a great teacher and neither the new caregiver or the child have had enough to learn to trust each other. I would back off, and give the caregiver space to integrate the child. Remember you said yourself your child was not "perfect" for the other caregivers so some of this behaviour is not out of the norm for him. One of the reasons the caregiver can't give you examples is becuase it is little things like how long it takes the child to respond to a request - too busy to listen, deciding to disobey on purpose - the caregiver hasn't had time to figure that out. She can't tell you because she doesn't know either. Just think about every time your son has tested you at home and realize he is probably acting that same way but multiplied many times worse just to get his point across.

I may be totally wrong as I don't know the caregiver or your son. Yes go with your gut but if your gut tells you that your son can be obstinate when he sets his mind to it then let the caregiver and your son have time to come to an understanding. Then if it is not an agreeable understanding move him.

jec
03-15-2012, 01:05 PM
These ladies are all right ~ go with your gut and get him out of there. Do you have family that will take care of your son for a week or two while you do your interviewing?
As for the question what to say to other providers about why your looking for new care, be honest. You have a gut feeling that things are not right. Mention him being wet at pick up and other concerns that you have. I have one family who met with me and right off the bat told me that their son was a handful ~ when I asked why the parents told me he was not listening and hitting. I told them how I would handle it and through this chat I learned and they learned how we each handle situations. As long as a provider knows that your on the same page as how to correct a behavior then you might just have a fit!
Good luck

sunnydays
03-15-2012, 01:11 PM
I agree with Playfelt on this. I think I would tell the caregiver that you want this to work and would like to help with the process, so if she could make some notes of the types of behaviours she sees in your son, that would help you both come up with a plan for how to deal with them. It is VERY hard as a parent to hear that our child is not a perfect angel, but as Playfelt said, if you see challenging behaviours at home, it is more than likely he is doing them there too. I have a 3 year old son myself and I know he can be challenging at times for me, so don't feel like you are a bad parent because your child misbehaves. If you truly feel that you cannot work with this provider then you should start looking around in the evenings, but you may end up having to address these issues with the next provider as well.

Sandbox Sally
03-15-2012, 01:14 PM
My issue isn't that he is having trouble...it's that the caregiver is rude and refuses to give feedback. Oh, and that a 3 year old was left in a pair of urine soaked pants. Um...no.

Cadillac
03-15-2012, 01:25 PM
1. By the time my gang are three I can say something and they just do it. All I have to say is lunch is almost ready and they start to clean up and come to the table etc. without me having to say anything but from the time they were one they have been part of that learning.

The caregiver needs to remember that she will need to explain everythign to the child. At the same time your child may feel like he is constantly being told what to do when the caregiver is just trying to assist him to integrate. We also forget that other providers do things differently so we can't just assume that they child has done certain things a certain way before. Change isn't easy and if you are used to putting the big trucks under the shelf instead of beside the closet you can forget easily and get in trouble or at least feel that you are.

Your child has already been labelled challenging by other providers who had the benefit of time to train him in their ways so give your next caregiver and your son time too.

I have had an older child that would put up a physical fight to be changed, dressed for outside etc. In the old days this kind of tantrum got a spanking and child usually stopped and obeyed. Now we put them in time out. So if your child didn't want to cooperate to get his wet clothes changed then he is old enough to either do it himself or suffer the chaffing of wet clothes - do not blame the daycare provider. If your child was 18 months that is different we battle through those kinds of tantrums because we can due the size and strength of the child and change them anyway.

I am a little surprised at the number of caregivers that are saying to remove the child. What makes you so sure the child will cooperate any better in another new situation. Time is such a great teacher and neither the new caregiver or the child have had enough to learn to trust each other. I would back off, and give the caregiver space to integrate the child. Remember you said yourself your child was not "perfect" for the other caregivers so some of this behaviour is not out of the norm for him. One of the reasons the caregiver can't give you examples is becuase it is little things like how long it takes the child to respond to a request - too busy to listen, deciding to disobey on purpose - the caregiver hasn't had time to figure that out. She can't tell you because she doesn't know either. Just think about every time your son has tested you at home and realize he is probably acting that same way but multiplied many times worse just to get his point across.

him.

I agree that the child should do what they are told at three . . . . but your also right that they have to be trained. It seems to me that this provider isn't up for that process. rolling her eyes on day three and giving no specific feedback is my concern. not changing a child when he pees his pants is another concern.

Whether its the little things such as listening or picking up a specific toy the provider should be giving those detail. Rolling your eyes and say 'he was just challenging' is NOT an answer.

It takes time an patience to integrate and from what this parent is telling me. This lady is, in no way, smoothing out the process.

I speak for myself when I say that THIS is the reason I would pull him.

gcj
03-15-2012, 01:25 PM
Well, obviously pulling him from there is the best option. As far as finding him a new place....I don't understand why you don't want him with you. You're working with kids all day, why not your own? Is it not allowed? Personally I got started in this business just to be with my kids....not to have someone else raise them. Why don't you take advantage of that?

sunnydays
03-15-2012, 01:28 PM
Although I agree that the rolling of eyes was definitely rude and she should have been able to give some specific examples, I am not sure that the wet pants issue is necessarily pointing to a bad daycare provider. A child 3 years old can be very strong physcially and mentally and if he refused to change the clothes himself and refused to let her help him, the natural consequence would be to remain in the wet clothes. Should she have physically battled him to the ground and stripped his clothes off and wrestled new ones on? Then I think she would be opening herself up to abuse charges. She definitely should have (and likely did) try to get him to do it through incentives etc, but if that all failed (and I have known kids who can be very stubborn), then what?

Inspired by Reggio
03-15-2012, 01:38 PM
My issue isn't that he is having trouble...it's that the caregiver is rude and refuses to give feedback. Oh, and that a 3 year old was left in a pair of urine soaked pants. Um...no.

Agreed ... a transition is to be expected for sure specially with an older child who has not had the benefit of years of your routine and expectations ... but if the provider cannot evenly CLEARLY DEFINE to the parent the issues that are causing him 'trouble' and ROLLS HER EYES WHEN ASKED TO how is the parent suppose to HELP the provider or her child to affect change and set goals ... that is just well sorry for the language but CRAPPY way to handle things?

And sorry if this comes off judgmental but IMO if she is not able to 'define' it to the parent adequately and rolls her eyes about it how does the parent know if she is defining her expectations clearly to the CHILD and this could be the route of the kids 'behaviour' as well in which case the PARENT cannot fix that cause that is the providers issue.

IMO the other reason for considering leaving is that the poster shared that the child needs 'routine' to thrive in potty training and other avenues and this provider is not big on offering one to me that is clearly not a MATCH and best to find a program that IS a match to your parenting philosophy and child's learning style otherwise you are going to be constantly having challenges everytime some new 'stage' is entered ... unfortunately in an ideal world parents would spend more time ensuring a match to stuff like this BEFORE signing on but in their defense sometimes providers will say ANYTHING to get a client in the door and than the parent quickly realizes that what was promised is not what is being offered and they have to pull :(

My other reason for suggesting pulling is my personal passion that children should be WITH their parent whenever possible - the poster works in a field offering childcare and the perk to that should be well providing care to her OWN while he is at least young enough to be in childcare before the school boards scoop them up on us - I personally do no think the concern of 'favoritism' should be a barrier to allowing that cause I have worked with many a provider who can manage their own child and daycare children fairly ... how many of us on this board are doing it as I type ;)

playfelt
03-15-2012, 01:39 PM
If a parent asked you what you meant by challenging and you started rhyming off a list : well lets see he put the truck on the shelf when I asked him to put it by the closet and then the one of the little ones came around the corner and tripped on it which is why I insist the trucks go on the shelf, I called him for lunch and he said just a minute but then got upset because I went ahead and served everyone else and then got upset because he was the last one to finish eating so the last one to move onto to the next course of food, he didnt' want to listen to the story I had chosen for the day and wanted his choice which I promised to read after naptime when we did storytime again but for this morning we needed to read the story that went with the theme for the week, .......I think you get my drift here. Yes the poor caregiver was being accosted at every stage of the day. Nothing major just annoying stuff. With time the child will learn the routine and what to expect when and problem will be solved but till then every time this child opens his mouth to say something it is going to be taken the wrong way since three year olds don't phrase their intentions tactfully most of the time.

There is also something to be said for letting the child fight his own battles so while he needs to know that mom will support him he also needs to learn that she will support the caregiver too and not reward him for misbehaviour. Three year olds can be very outspoken and cheeky and do not like it when we refuse to be spoken to in that way. Just be careful you are not encouraging this kind of independent thinking and talking at home without teaching him that there is a time and place for that and a time and place for acceptance/obedience/remembering his place in the people chain.

gcj
03-15-2012, 01:49 PM
couldn't agree more Inspired By Regio...about children being with their parents whenever possible. Sounds like it is possible!

Emily3
03-15-2012, 01:54 PM
I totally agree with everything you have said playfelt!!! My reason for suggesting op pull her child out was that it "seemed" like the provider was not interested in trying to work it out and that she would give it until the end of the month to sort itself out. Certainly a list of all wrong- doings is not necessarily helpful. We all know children can be difficult but I would hope that the person taking care of my child would put some effort into making things work and obviously want me to work together with her! Of course, it's impossible to tell since we are not the provider....that was just my impression!

parentof1
03-15-2012, 01:58 PM
In the daycare that I work @ now it is one room with infants only...so bringing him would not be an option. And as much as I want to be home with him, and and allow him to thrive. We just can't do it right now. I would love to open a daycare, but we rent and our super's would not allow that, I asked...Plus there is a space issue here. We live in a tiny space.

I said he was challenging because I was trying to be fair in what I posted....

I don't want it to be mis understood--he does know how to follow rules and respect is key for us. Further is 5 days really enough time to be making judgements about how "challenging" he is?

I also did not want to leave out the feedback that previous dayhomes gave because I believe in being fair and honest. They also stated once the transition period (about three weeks had passed that he was a great child and a good helper. One thing I'vee noticed about him is that he needs to be needed. He wants to help with tasks... and I told his new dayhome this and they aren't interested in hearing about anything that will help....they are more interested in making me/him feel bad...IMHO.

Lou
03-15-2012, 02:04 PM
I would absolutely NOT be comfortable leaving my child in the care of someone who can only seem to find negative things to say about my child or dares to roll their eyes at me for asking about his day. Those are red flags for me enough (it's only been 5 days for Pete's sake!), let alone picking my child up in urine soaked pants because she couldn't be bothered to change him. Just my opinion as a mother and a caregiver.

playfelt
03-15-2012, 02:15 PM
I fyou read through the threads on this group there are numerous threads about releasing a child that isnt' settling into care and it is still in the two week integration period so lets be fair here caregivers - many of you would be wanting to terminate too rather than work through the problems.

Intimidation is one issue that you might want to take into consideration. You do work in a daycare centre and you do have ECE training. To some caregivers that makes them very nervous. The rolling of the eyes may be more out of embarassment, feeling vulnerable - rolling the eyes or looking away as in not directly at you - could be open to interpretation.

Some parent suggestions aren't helpful. Likes to help fine but if he is still learning his helping may not be helpful and especially if he has ever said to the caregiver well my "other" caregiver never did that or put that there or whatever. Not sure how long the caregiver has been in business or how much experience with three year olds. Mostly I would just remind them in not always my nicest tone that I am not XXXX and this is not XXXX daycare and at my house we do things this way and then from that point on child would be reminded of the different way to do things - not wrong just different. No one learns any routine in 5 days.

At the same time I think you have made up your mind that this is not working and the caregiver has given you to the end of the month to find someone else. I am going to assume this was not the only caregiver you interviewed when you were looking so start by going back to those you have already interviewed to see if they still have spaces. Just approach the new situation from a different angle. This is not your old caregiver and the old ways and have a talk with your son about that before he starts and what things he can do to help such as asking the caregiver for clarification or asking do you want me to do this or this or following the lead of the other children already there since they have learned the rules and they will help teach him - especially if he is the oldest in the group and thinks that means he gets to take over. Preparing your son for the changes will go a long way to making the next arrangement work out better.

michellesmunchkins
03-15-2012, 02:21 PM
I agree with those who have posted that there needs to be time for a child and daycare provider to build up a rapport. I would hate for my families to ever feel that they should pull their child out of care. I am very honest with my families if I feel something is wrong, not working etc. WE have to work together! If the parents aren't helping me then I can't fix the problem and vice versa. A 3 year old boy can be very challenging. I have a 5 year old son who has put us through the ringer in the last 2 years with behaviours lol...but...I work with him everyday and I would hope that if he was in daycare the provider would work with him as well.

My issue and why I said to pull him is in no way 'knocking' daycare providers because I am one, but if someone was rolling their eyes at me while discussing my child I would be p'd off!!! That just shows disrespect in my opinion. I would never disrespect a parent that way. I also can't imagine leaving a child in urine soaked clothes. I am for sure the tough love kinda person, but that just goes beyond. There has to be some way to get through to him to change his clothes. For sure, he was probably stubborn and trying to push to see how far he can go in a new environment. WE've all had kids like that...but...we also have numerous ways to try to break through that stubborness.

As a provider I will bend over backwards to help a new little one and their family transition and would hope that parents would give me the benefit of the doubt that I will work with them and their child...but....as a Mommy, I'm sorry what you posted just concerned me and if it was my baby boy I would move him...

playfelt
03-15-2012, 02:26 PM
On the issue of the soaked clothes - if you wrestle your own tantruming three year old to the ground and get the clothes off nothing happens. If you do that to a daycare chil dthey are verbal enough to go home and tell the parents who are not going to take the side of the caregiver and tell the child they should have listened and done as they were told they will be pulling the child, filing abuse charges, etc. Just for curiosity for those that work in a daycare centre what is the policy on touching and making a three year old do anything they don't want to do - can you take their arm and redirect them, pick them up and carry them to the intended place, can you wrestle them out of wet clothing, I doubt it. The caregiver protected her butt by leaving the child in wet clothes and we would all be wise to do the same thing next time it happens in our daycare. Do not touch the three year old.

michellesmunchkins
03-15-2012, 02:31 PM
I absolutely agree with Playfelt about NEVER EVER TOUCHING a child! I would not have wrestled him out of his clothes, nor would I have even helped him out of them unless he was stuck or something as a child that age is more than able to do it themselves (unless they have special needs) I would have verbally exhausted anything I could think of to have him change. I agree that we have to do what is safest and cover our own butts in the process because like playfelt said if that child went home and said so and so held me down to change my clothes the parent would always side with the child regardless of the situation.

Crayola kiddies
03-15-2012, 02:39 PM
Props playfelt !!!!

Cocoon
03-15-2012, 03:35 PM
"he needs to be needed. He wants to help with tasks... " Ditto! At this age they want to do stuff by themselves and help! I used to looked after a challenging 3 years old when I was nannying. What I did was asked his "help" :) all the time. "J I can't find my bag, J I can't find my keys etc" My bag or keys were right in front of me and when he came and "found" them he was sooo please. Cause he found them. It gave him great pleasure and laughter. The word "help" was a magic word for me :)

It is OK. to have accidents and it is OK. for him to not to let his caregiver to change him. He probably was embarrassed. Poor thing. She should have give him the chance to change himself rather then her changing him. He doesn't know her to let her change him and there is no bound establish yet. She should know this if she was an experienced caregiver and respect his privacy.

Parentof1, where do you live? Maybe some of us here might be able to help.

Cocoon

Momof4
03-15-2012, 03:40 PM
My issue isn't that he is having trouble...it's that the caregiver is rude and refuses to give feedback. Oh, and that a 3 year old was left in a pair of urine soaked pants. Um...no.

I have to agree with Alpha. The eye roll and vague answers from the caregiver were very inappropriate. When I have a problem with a child I'm telling the parent specifically, exactly what we need to work on to improve behaviour. Sure, the original poster could give the current caregiver another chance, but demand that she explain EXACTLY what is happening and her plan to correct the situation.

I admit that if I had a parent who didn't agree with my methods I would want them to ask me direct questions, but I would definitely give them direct answers, not an eye roll.

parentof1
03-15-2012, 04:02 PM
UPDATE: I just got off the phone with a daycare provider and she seems to be a much better fit. We are meeting with her once my husband gets back from his business trip on the 24th. She said that she understood my son's needs, we had a 45 min conversation about some of the issues my boy and I are facing right now. and she said that she has been doing home daycare for 16 years since she was 23, and would never leave him in wet clothes for an extended period (Meaning she has tried to change him several times). Even if it meant calling me because he refused to change.

This dayhome that my boy is in right now just opened, and I suspect the girls are a bit green. And have no idea how to address this type of thing even if I am not an ECE.

The daycare lady on the phone stated that she always has serious discussions about behavior in person and in no other way, minor things are sent in an email. That she always has examples, and I liked this.

She is also in the same area of his preschool that he is starting next year and if he is still in her care at that point she is willing to take him there, at no extra cost because she has befoore and after school kids already, and plans to con't with that.

Cocoon
03-15-2012, 04:06 PM
Glad you found seem to be a better fit. :)

Momof4
03-15-2012, 04:12 PM
Oh good luck parentof1! I emailed my newest daycare Mom almost daily because I was having picky eating and some other issues with her daughter and she appreciated it so much. It was no problem for me to sit down as the children were falling asleep and send off a quick email to tell her how our day was going and to ask a few quick questions. It eased her mind so much and made her feel like she was still a part of her daughter's transition into the daycare and now she loves me so much, haha.

I have a feeling you need a caregiver who will be wonderful to your son and to you now that you've had a few bad experiences because you are going to need to build a trust with the daycare provider. Don't be afraid to ask questions because your son is the most precious thing in your life and you have a right to be confident with your caregiver.

parentof1
03-15-2012, 04:53 PM
How to say I am done?

Question: I am going to terminate care before she does regardless of how this intrerview goes. I just need next week, because there is no cover off for me. and I don't have relitives here or sick days or anything that I could use..... sadly.

How to tell her CYA?

Play and Learn
03-15-2012, 04:59 PM
How to say I am done?

Question: I am going to terminate care before she does regardless of how this intrerview goes. I just need next week, because there is no cover off for me. and I don't have relitives here or sick days or anything that I could use..... sadly.

How to tell her CYA?

I would just say at drop-off on Monday that your child's last day of care will be until Friday. She doesn't NEED to know why you're leaving. Just be nice and civil about it.

Good luck!

Inspired by Reggio
03-15-2012, 05:08 PM
I also agree that there are lots of threads on here that advice providers to 'terminate' a client during that transition phase however from the ones I have read the provider tends to offer us more information than the kid was 'just challenging' .... generally it is because the child is a danger to themselves or others in some way ... hitting, biting or aggressive in some manner to the others in the program or the poor thing is screaming ALL DAY LONG with no improvement being seen - or the client is just showing red flags of disrespect to the provider around hours, fees, and contract stuff and better to nip that in the bud early!

The truth is we do not have all the 'facts' cause we are not there all we can do is offer advice based on the info provided ... everything shared in the original post is a red flag to me .... poor communication skills, lack of desire to WORK WITH the parent in a concrete manner to help the child with the transition and well disrespect on a number of levels from the rolled eyes and the leaving a child 'soiled' on purpose ... while I normally am one to give people the benefit of the doubt the LAST one is a real deal break for me!

If the original poster arrived and her child was engaged in play and he had an accident and not told the provider and she had not NOTICED and quickly apologized saying 'oh no - I am so sorry he must have just done that and not told me - I will grab his clothes for him' that would be one thing - I admit I have had that happen to me more than once and never had a parent 'angry' over it because it was clear it had JUST happened cause it is usually still warm and so forth - this was not the case from what the poster shared.

If she came in and found her child in wet cloths with DRY ONES, WET WIPES AND A PLASTIC BAG sitting right beside him there as an option to clean up and her child was 'defiant / refusing' to allow her to help him change or to change himself that would be one thing - that would be one thing - but from what the poster shared this was not the case!

BTW I agree I would not WRESTLE a three year old to change their clothes either they are perfectly capable of doing that themselves - but everything they would NEED to do it themselves would be sitting right there beside them while they 'waited to decide to take care of it themselves'. I have had this happen to me as well with my one strong willed kid ... so am confident if a client of mine walked into that situation they would be able to SEE in 10 seconds that it was the child choosing not to allow for my help and choosing to stay in the wet pants out of defiance ... my same strong willed one who is now 5 years old and fully trained still refused to change her pants for me just Tuesday cause they needed to be changed - she was angry because the new ones did not 'match' her top - since not changing was not an option for her she got the choice to change now or go sit in her cot until she 'was ready to change them' but either way they were being changed eventually or she could sit until it was time to go home ... she missed lunch and took the entire nap time of the younger kids sitting there defiantly refusing - no skin off my back cause it meant I got more stuff done without her up doing quiet things - and a natural consequence for her defiance - she finally dressed when she heard the others up having fun without her ;)

parentof1
03-15-2012, 05:16 PM
let me tell you if I arrived and my boy was engaged and peed, and I saw this...I would help her clean up, clean him up say sorry and leave.

Inspired by Reggio
03-15-2012, 05:18 PM
How to say I am done?

Question: I am going to terminate care before she does regardless of how this intrerview goes. I just need next week, because there is no cover off for me. and I don't have relitives here or sick days or anything that I could use..... sadly.

How to tell her CYA?

If you are required to give 'notice' as per any contract I would do that - as Play and Learn suggested just something plain and simple 'As per our contract X's last day of care will be Friday March 23rd"

I had wondered if she was 'green' cause communication skills and conflict resolution are something you have to master QUICK if you want to last long enough in this business to become 'seasoned' ;)

sunnydays
03-15-2012, 05:55 PM
If you are not required to give notice during the trial period, I am not sure that I would give notice on Monday. I would wait until pick-up on Friday and I say this as a parent because I would nto want my child to be with someone who knows he is being taken out on the Friday. If she is unwilling to work with you and you feel it isn't going to work, then I would wait until the end of the week that you need care. i am paranoid as a parent...that's why i opened my own daycare I guess...I just would worry that things might get even worse for my child.

parentof1
03-15-2012, 07:44 PM
I arrived at daycare and his pull up was soaked as were his pants....she had no explination for this I pulled him out of there and left...... and I am not going back EVER..and the last thing she said...you still owe me money for April....

not sory nothing she was just wooeied about her money

Lou
03-15-2012, 07:53 PM
Yuck. Momto Mom, I'm glad you've found a wonderful new fit for your little man!!! Please update us on how he transitions to his new caregiver.

playfelt
03-15-2012, 09:28 PM
Glad that you have found someone that will better meet the needs of your son and what a bonus to have him settled into care and then be able to stay for school.

parentof1
03-15-2012, 10:16 PM
Sorry guys I was very emotional when typing

mom-in-alberta
03-15-2012, 11:06 PM
I hope for you and your son that your next caregiver is exactly what you are looking for. No parent should have to be so concerned about their child, in a scenario where he/she is supposed to be safe, cared for and stimulated.
To get back to the original question/point (I am, once again, late in replying it seems!); I think what it comes down to is whether or not you as a parent and the other woman as a caregiver are BOTH willing to determine what the issues are and improve them.
If a caregiver is dismissive, vague and downright rude- I don't see how they can expect anything but anger and mistrust from the parents.
At the same time, many parents see their children through somewhat rosy colored glasses (my own kids included, lol!). It can be a tough pill to swallow if someone is saying "Listen; we are having some issues with so-and-so's behaviour. This is what's going on."
If I am having difficulties with a child, then the parents hear EXACTLY what is going on, why I am not okay with it, and what I need to see happen.
If a child had peed his pants and then was AGRESSIVELY refusing to change, or what have you, I may choose to leave them in that state. He's 3, not a baby. I presume that at this stage, he knows at least somewhat how to dress himself. If he fights my assistance, I am also not going to rassle him to the floor. However, that would be explained in detail!! I may even have texted them, etc to apprise them of what was going on.
Ultimately, I am glad you are changing caregivers. It does not sound like a good fit.
Best of luck!!!!

parentof1
03-17-2012, 07:25 PM
So as I said to some of you, I arrived to get him on Thursday, and his pants were soaked through again....And as I said I pulled him out right away no questions. All the provider was worried about was money owed. No" sorry" no "that's not true." No "I want to work with you" ...nothing.

My husband came home for the weekend, as he had a break from his business training. As I was very upset I was in no shape to deal with this, and my husband is better at dealing with confrontation and hard things than I am.

He called her saying...

"You've been changing ________ every day right? She stated she was. And you've been using his pull ups correct? His wipes too? I heard her say that was correct. (I was on the extension)

My husband....

"Well that's interesting, his wipes have not been opened, nor have his pull ups, and none of his underwear has been touched eithier. (We are working very hard to get him to use big boy underwear)

She says.....

"Uh uhh mmm "we were using ____'s. He grew out of them so we figured we'd let _______ have them.

What a line.

I have reported her to Child Protection Services, as after questioning my son he told me he did not have morning or afternoon snack as her handbook states and only ever had "swoop" (soup) for lunch. He also stated that she yells a lot.

I have also reported her to early learning as even though she is private, she is still required to obide by the numbers set out by the branch in my province and I know she is over as I have counted at pick up. (in my head) I also know which kids are hers.

If you are providing good care in your home let me make this clear--I would never report any of you..I am not like that..but in this case hell yes. Especially when she outright calls me a liar to my husband's face.

She wants to take me to court for the money, because at this point I am feeling that payment is not owed as I withdrew him due to negligence...(I paid for March she says I owe for April)

Let her I have the rec. for the pull ups, that I bought the day before he started. (I won't open them) I have photos of his wet pants.....I also have messages saying that I do not need to see my contract because I should know what I signed.

Again let me say..I would never screw anybody of money, but in this instance--fight I dare you.

If a court tells me I owe I will pay this winner. I so wish I could warn people about her.

Momof4
03-17-2012, 07:50 PM
Personally, I am very proud of you and want to thank you for reporting this woman. If all of the people who were over their numbers which is breaking the law and giving poor care to these precious children and scamming the parents I think it would be a wonderful thing. The children are the ones who will be scarred for life. I know because that's one thing that happened to my oldest daughter and I was too young and too naive to know what was going on until after the fact. This was back in the day of 'babysitters' only and that's why I get really ticked if I get called that B word!

little rascals
03-17-2012, 08:14 PM
I am so glad you pulled him out of there and went ahead and reported her! As momof4 said it does scar the children. I hope they deal with her the proper way and that you win this case if it ends up going that far. She does not deserve any of the money you have already paid nevermind aprils payment too. This story really bothers me and sorry you had to experience this. At least the worst part is done and he is out of that horrible enviroment.

fruitloop
03-17-2012, 08:31 PM
That is such a horrible thing that your son went through and it's people like THAT that give the rest of us a bad name. You should of marked his pull-up that he was wearing (sorry, couldn't remember if he was wearing any or just underwear) that way you would know for sure if he had been changed, although from the conversation, it doesn't sound like he was. I'm glad you reported her!

parentof1
03-17-2012, 09:21 PM
I did mark it that's how I know... I marked it on thursday morning, I thought you were all going to give me heck cause I refused to pay her or something, would you?

Cadillac
03-17-2012, 09:31 PM
You did the right thing. I'm so very sorry that this is something you have had to deal with. My cousins were in a tough situation once too and it makes me sick to have learned that my one year old cousin was never changed or taken out of his stroller and that their provider was so negligent that other children were able to lock his sister in a closet for hours before her mother found her at pick-up time.

Don't let this discourage you from home care as it can be one of the most wonderful experiences for children with the right caregiver. We are out there. This forum alone is proof.

A good caregiver will tell you EVERYTHING, show love to your child, and your little one will come home brimming with excitement. Wish you were in my area so I could offer temporary care while you found a good permanent placement for your munchkin.

Cadillac
03-17-2012, 09:35 PM
I did mark it that's how I know... I marked it on thursday morning, I thought you were all going to give me heck cause I refused to pay her or something, would you?

I wouldn't pay her either.
You're a smart Mom (marking the diaper) Way to go!

Just so you know. You CAN warn people about her. It's not slander if it's the truth or YOUR truth. Just thought I'd mention it.

playfelt
03-18-2012, 07:01 AM
Good for reporting her. You pulled him out with there still two weeks in March and those two weeks were paid up so it is pay in lieu of written notice. Not sure how much notice was required in your contract but there are certainly extenuating circumstances. By the time she is inspected she won't have the heart to take it to small claims court because she will either be closing her doors or spending all of her time making changes to her daycare to comply with the rules.

Something you might want to do is ask you new caregiver to write down any comment your son makes about his old daycare in the sense of it would just be the random thoughts of a 3 year old but put togehter with what is found might shed some light on what was going on there. She is also an outsider and not him telling you what he things you want to hear. Such at snack time if she just randomly asks him so XXXX what did you used to have for snack at your old caregiver's.

Inspired by Reggio
03-18-2012, 07:32 AM
I agree I would have pulled him as well - I certainly would not be paying for APRIL when there is visible proof that you have grounds for termination without notice.

As a business women while I have never had to deal with a client terminating because they felt my service was inadequate or their child was not adjusting or safe but I would like to think that if I ever had a client who was SO unhappy in my service and felt they were terminating with 'cause' and without notice ....I would be refunding them their security deposit in lieu of notice or if I had not taken a 'security deposit' to protect myself I would not be taking them to court to try to GET notice money from them ... seriously at my core I am a WOMEN and my maternal instincts tell me that no mother should be forced to leave their child in a situation they do not feel is ideal just because of $$$$$ and not being able to afford to pay a notice period to me while putting a new deposit down somewhere else!

Notice period and security deposits are in place to protect the provider from those clients who just pull for NO REASON to give the provider time to fill their space or prepare for the change in income that comes with someone pulling or clients who regularly bounce cheques for service and bolt without wanting to pay ... if you have two weeks up front you are always in a 'credit' for service so to speak to protect from clients like this.

Now if I strongly felt I had done nothing WRONG and the client was just full of unrealistic expectations ... like being pissed cause Little Johnny got finger paint on his designer overalls and rather than making more laundry for mama I just sponge treated it and left him in those pants cause they were still 'dry' or not having read the contract 'clearly' and throwing a fit cause they did not realize they had to pay me for Stat holidays or something cause THAT I would not be accepting as 'cause' ... but if a child was truly unhappy and not thriving I would not want to make that worse for the client.

mom-in-alberta
03-19-2012, 02:50 AM
As a provider, I am GLAD that you have reported her. As other posters (and fellow moms!) have said, these are not trivial issues. Had you been witholding payment over things that Reggio mentioned, we would probably be on the side of the child care provider. But it is her duty and responsibility not only as a provider, but as a decent human being, to care for your son properly.
I hope she has to shut her doors. Somehow, I highly doubt she will end up actually suing you. That takes effort, and all signs here point to LAZY.
Again, I wish you good luck finding a better situation.

Skysue
03-19-2012, 06:44 AM
For me I can't comment fully as there is two sides to every story BUT based on what you are saying & coming from a Mom who had a child previously in care I would have to agree that pulling the child from care was the best decision.

The money issue: why would you pay for an entire month of care if they have been pulled from care.

Good luck and I wish you all the best for your little one!

sunnydays
03-19-2012, 12:27 PM
I'm glad you pulled your child from a situation that did not seem good. We always have to do what we feel is best for our kids and it seems that you have done that. I hope your son will thrive in his new daycare and all of this will be in the past soon.

Lou
03-19-2012, 12:51 PM
So glad that you've pulled him, that's disgusting about the diaper, YUCK! I agree, that you do not owe for April, that's a load of crock and I'd bet a million bucks that she won't dare take you to court anyways. I'm so sorry you had to go through this! Where are you from? If you're from London, ON please message me with her name so I can warn my friends if they are looking for care in the future!

parentof1
03-23-2012, 09:40 PM
So it's been five days.... My son is at his new dayhome and his provider has nothing but good things to say, and says that my boy is a wonderful addition to her group as he seems to want to be "big brother." to some of the younger ones. Shares very well, loves her teen daughters and her husband....

She even went as far to say that she thinks that his previous daycare was trumping any training progress with the toliet as he has been in underwear all week with one pee accident, and some poop accidents, instead of the solied pull ups he was coming home in, which is a relief for me. (pooping is a bit more of a job but we are all working very hard. )

She says it will come as he loves getting jelly belly's for his washroom efforts...(He gets them at home too) She only uses pull ups if they are in the car, or on the bus so it means that they are going through them a lot slower too.

Our previous provider is calling us multiple times daily demanding payment --saying that she believes in her dayhome and we are slandering her--she leaves this in vm as I do not answer the phone.... I know that all of you work very hard for your money, and I WOULD NEVER EVER JIP ANYONE UNDER NORMAL CIRCUMSTANCES.

We have paid upfront for March and she is seeking a 600.00 payment for April even though I withdrew him after 5 days, DUE TO NEGLECT. As previously posted, any advice on how to deal with this hose beast?

Momof4
03-24-2012, 04:50 AM
I'm so happy that you found a great daycare provider! Just let that old crazy lady make all the threats she wants because she's not going to follow through. However, I might send her an email and tell her that you are recording her verbal threats in writing word for word in case you need to take her to court. It's terrible when a bad HDCP gives all of us good ones a bad name!

sunnydays
03-24-2012, 07:27 AM
I am glad you found a provider who is working out for you and your son. It is so important to feel secure and trustful when you drop your child off each day! I am glad you haven't let the one bad apple spoil it for all the good providers out there! As MOMof4 said above, I would document everything in case in comes down to going to court. In fact, I would sit down and write down everything that happened from your first meeting with this woman until now with dates and times if possible (especially things like the wet pants and her comments about it). I would save the messages, but also transcribe them as suggestedf above. I would continue not answering the phone. You don't owe her anything!

Play and Learn
03-24-2012, 07:37 AM
Definitely don't owe her anything. Do the same as above posters noted (just like we do in the daycare centers!).

I would go as far as blocking her phone number(s) and emails. Do you have a receipt from the month of March that you paid? Do you have a copy of the contract that you signed? These are also beneficial for later incase she tries to attack you more. If she does try more, I would personally call the cops. There is no need for this.

And I too am glad that you've found someone that suits your childs needs! :)

jec
03-24-2012, 08:17 AM
The providers gave you some great advice. I would go one step further just to contact the police and make them aware of the situation and it's on file...so if she goes any further and does anything like show up at your house then they know about it.

Skysue
03-24-2012, 09:14 AM
The providers gave you some great advice. I would go one step further just to contact the police and make them aware of the situation and it's on file...so if she goes any further and does anything like show up at your house then they know about it.

Dido and let her know you made a claim with the police! Good to hear your little man is doing well!

Lou
03-24-2012, 07:42 PM
I'm curious as to why she thinks you owe her for April??? You paid for March in full and pulled him out midway through the month. I would make a claim with the police, call her back and say "No, I did not give you notice of withdrawal as I do not need to give notice when my child is being neglected, as neglect is a form of child abuse. I have all of the incidences of abuse documented and photographed and will be turning them in to Children's Protective Services. I also have a report into the police for harrassment. Please stop calling this number as our business with you is long over." CLICK.

I'm so glad that it's working out better with the new provider...I had a bad feeling about the previous one from your last post!

Sandbox Sally
03-26-2012, 01:59 PM
I totally agree. You owe her NOTHING. You paid for the month and then used her services five times? I think she's the one coming out on top. Due to her negligence, you have now paid for two weeks worth of daycare TWICE.

I second what the others said about calling the police. It documents the harassment, and it'd be so nice for you to call her and say, "I am telling you to stop harassing me now. I have filed a complaint with the police. They know all about the circumstances which caused my son to be withdrawn from your care. They will be notified if your phone calls continue.

parentof1
03-29-2012, 01:53 PM
God I think this lady is crazy wth is wrong with her? She has called my home 3x today demanding payment filling my voicemailbox with her nonsense!! Not only that, but behind my back she is sending "nice emails" to my husband basically calling me crazy, saying that I was unreasonable and that everything I said was lies.....

I sent her this email:

Good Morning __________,

I have received your voice mail, and am writing to express for want of a better term, my thoughts on the subject.

_________ had SOAKED PANTS for 2 days in a row. You mentioned it to me the one day, but failed to the second—I turned him around only to discover he pants were soaked and he had been wearing the SAME PULL UP ALL DAY. I know this as it was marked, say what you will but I have people who are willing to back up my statement if needed. Also it is quite interesting that ___________'s pull ups and wipes were never opened, and when you were confronted about this you back peddled, saying __________’s were being used, he was with you for a week and you never opened them once? At home and in his current care situation _________ uses at least one pull up per day.

WE PAID YOU FOR THE MONTH OF MARCH AND WITHDREW HIM BEFORE THE MONTH WAS EVEN OVER. In fact we did so on Friday March 16 2012, our reason for withdrawal was DUE TO THE FACT THAT YOU WERE NOT CHANGING HIM, NOR WERE YOU FOLLOWING A CONSISTENT POTTY ROUTINE and that is considered neglect (not changing him).

After seeking council on this matter we will not be paying you any fees for the month of April. As stated above ________and I withdrew him due to NEGLECT . We used your services for 5 days!!

Please be advised that any further attempts to contact us by phone/email will be documented and reported to the police as it is now considered harassment, as well if you or any your family members or ____-(THE OTHER DAYHOME PROVIDER) and her family members show up on my property, and gain entry, we will call the police to escort you away as you are not welcomed on our property at anytime or under any circumstances. (we live in an apt)

I will no longer speak with you regarding this issue unless required to do so by law.

Thank you,

_______________

She then emails me back saying I am in breech of contract, and that I am coming up with excuses not to pay, is this girl on something?

What do I do if she takes me to court?

How should I handle this?

Please help me....tears are streaming down my face, because I cannot believe that someone would try to tell my husband that I am a liar, and not only that be sneaky about it, does she not think we live in the same home? Or share things?

Lou
03-29-2012, 02:03 PM
Is she threatening to take you to court?

parentof1
03-29-2012, 02:10 PM
not so far, but she probly will, cause she seems that crazy...I cannot believe this!

Crayola kiddies
03-29-2012, 02:32 PM
Have you called the police ? If not maybe it's time

Inspired by Reggio
03-29-2012, 02:37 PM
I will tell you the same thing I would tell a provider being threatened to be sued by a client ... save the emails she sent, save the phone messages to a digital device if possible or leave them on your machine, ask others who've seen or heard her threats and behaviour to document it NOW while fresh in their mind her exact words and claims and so forth, if they saw his soaked pants, unopened wipes and diapers and so forth to record that statement and so forth with the date to keep it 'accurate' in their mind and document and save ALL your correspondence from your end of the deal to back up why you feel 'just' in your termination of the contract.

BTW ... what was your 'contract' with her around termination and grounds? Does it address a 'probation' period or anything where either party can terminate during that time 'without notice' if things are not a match? In absence of that how much notice did it require on your part to terminate? The neglect claim on your part aside .... just wanting to get a feeling for WHY she is thinking she is entitled to an additional MONTHS pay from you if she got paid for the month of March in advance and you pulled him on March 16th ... she already got two weeks PAID notice which seems more than fair if indeed her service was not 'up to standards'???

I realize and so do the courts that there are ALWAYS two sides to every conflict in life which both parties feel passionate about them being 'right' and often somewhere in the middle is the truth often shrouded in miscommunication / personal perception of situations and so forth which is what they will try to find ... if she is to take you to court it is likely cause she honesty believes she did not do anything WRONG so either that he had been 'dry' up until moments before you arrived and she had just not had chance to change him yet cause some kids CAN hold it for a long time and than 'flood' out and that is why she is feeling entitled to proper 'notice' in her mind cause your reaction from her perception was unjust ... so perhaps she changed him as she says using other clients stuff?

Although IMO I will admit using other clients supplies on a child is so NOT COOL practice unless it was an EMERGENCY like the kid ran out and it was borrow or sit in a poop diaper ... cause some kids are allergic to certain wipes or diapers that is WHY we ask parents supply them and parents should have every reasonable assumption that this is what WILL occur?

I wish you the best of luck in your resolution of this - conflict is never fun and the stress of being sued is NEVER fun .... ideally maybe mediation between someone at small claims would be a better way to go for everyone!

Momof4
03-29-2012, 03:54 PM
Yes, Inspired by Reggio has covered it all. But now that you have sent a professionally written FINAL letter, let it drop. I've been involved in a situation where a woman started sending me terrible emails and I let myself get pulled in to try to defend myself and I now know that it is a mistake. These types of people NEVER STOP and when you are tyring to defend yourself you are just fueling the flames and they keep going and going.

Block all the numbers and emails and forget about it. She's NOT going to take you to court.

Lou
03-29-2012, 07:07 PM
100% agree with momof4

mom-in-alberta
03-30-2012, 01:13 AM
100% agree with momof4

As do I. I would no longer engage in dialogue with this woman, either verbally or via email. I would, however, document any attempts at communication that she makes toward you. Save her emails. Record her voicemails and save them.
I also highly doubt that she is actually going to take this any farther than she has. It costs both time and money to go to court, and effort as well.
I, too, wonder what the REASONING is (in her mind) that you owe her more money? She must have said why she feels like you "stiffed" her. What were the terms of the contract regarding dismissal/termination of care? If there was no contract at all, you will for sure come out the winner here (as much as can be said in this case, anyway). Does her agreement call for a full month's notice? Mine does, FYI. But I don't disagree with your pulling him, I am glad you did. Just curious what her rationale is, other than greed....

jec
03-30-2012, 03:10 AM
Have you reported the incidents to the police? I had mentioned it on your update #2 (sorry haven't been on in a week and might have missed reading that you did)
The ladies above are right, leave it be now. She might just be the type of person who knows if she can rattle you, she will.
Sorry your having to go through this

parentof1
03-30-2012, 08:17 AM
She had a vague contract at best...it was poorly written with bad wording, and when questioned on it--she wasn't really up for debating, first she said she had 2 weeks notice, then one months then 2 weeks adjustment then none...it was confusing....Since this email she has sent me 2...I have not replied as I am done, but its like...Is she?

SHE STILL SAYS I OWE HER 600.00

parentof1
03-30-2012, 09:14 AM
and also too, when she first told me how much I owed it was 600, then 300, then 600, then 300, now shes back to 600, crazy chick

Crayola kiddies
03-30-2012, 09:44 AM
Do you not have a copy of what you signed?

michellesmunchkins
03-30-2012, 09:57 AM
I agree with all the other posters to not have anymore contact with her and to document everything that she says/does/emails etc. Sounds to me like she's just looking to threaten you in the hopes that you will fork over more money. If it does go to court, so be it. It will cost her to do so and in the end it sounds to me like you would most likely win. Negligence of a child MUST come before money! You also need a copy of your signed contract! If not now, for future. Sometimes that it is all you have to support your position as most times this will always come down to your word against hers. I hope it all works out for you. Nothing worse than having to deal with all this drama when you were just protecting your little one!

Lianne1981
05-29-2012, 12:52 PM
Make sure to save everything and document everything with date, times, and names!!

Good luck with everything!

Lou
05-29-2012, 02:08 PM
Did she ever back off?

ChristyCrossbones
06-06-2012, 09:31 AM
My first thought when I read your post is why has he been to so many different places. If you knew your child was "difficult" then he should be put in an a place that can deal with his needs. Most daycare homes have more than one child to watch and care for. If your child needs more than a normal amount of direction it can be frustrating and make the environment for the other children there tense. It is NOT fair to blame the provider for being honest. I do not agree with her language describing your son at all. Tack is needed on her part. Seems to me that you are looking for someone to agree with you. I understand your feelings are hurt by her attitude but it not fair to place a child with his level of difficulty in a daycare home that is not equiped to handle it. If you can handle him keep him with you for his own benefit and self esteem. JMO

dodge__driver11
06-06-2012, 10:14 AM
@ Christy CrossbonesExcuse me?? I don't know this persons whole story.... but I read her posts...She was being honest. She asked for feedback from a provider, and was not given it. Maybe they've lived in other areas? Maybe she was on Mat. leave and could pay to hold her spot....

Regardless for you to say she is looking for someone to agree with her???

OF COURSE SHE IS!!

That is part of searching for a dayhome. looking for someone who matches your parenting style....

I think you're being awfully judgemental.

Skysue
06-06-2012, 10:23 AM
Hi,

I sent your original post a PM but now that I see that he can't be with you based on what I have been reading.

He sounds busy, most boys are busy and need to be stimulated a lot.

He may need a Montisouri environment where the ratios are smaller and where he will be stimualted a lot. Have you tried this avenue?

Skysue
06-06-2012, 10:28 AM
My first thought when I read your post is why has he been to so many different places. If you knew your child was "difficult" then he should be put in an a place that can deal with his needs. Most daycare homes have more than one child to watch and care for. If your child needs more than a normal amount of direction it can be frustrating and make the environment for the other children there tense. It is NOT fair to blame the provider for being honest. I do not agree with her language describing your son at all. Tack is needed on her part. Seems to me that you are looking for someone to agree with you. I understand your feelings are hurt by her attitude but it not fair to place a child with his level of difficulty in a daycare home that is not equiped to handle it. If you can handle him keep him with you for his own benefit and self esteem. JMO

Please read the other psots as she said her first 2 daycares closed that is why she needed to go to a third. Also 3 year olds do want to do EVERYTHING themselves it is frustrating but we need to ENCOURAGE independance and COACH them in how to do things on there own.

It is very frustrating at this stage for the child and if he is not being encouraged than that daycare provider needs to go!

parentof1
06-06-2012, 11:34 AM
Guys I explained I cannot stay home with him, we rent, and being self employed is not an option until we by a home and we cannot afford this right now.
:(

Montessori is too expensive. He is at his now provider and is very happy there, and she is very happy with him.

As for Christy Crossbones or whatever... Ummmmmm...

Wow, I can't believe you "flammed me" like that. I was doing what was best for my son... I wasn't searching for someone to cater to me. If that were the case I'd hire a nanny.

As for my prev. dayhome history I was a subsitute and had a hard time finding places that would take him given my wacky schedule, and I know that this is because dayhomes rely on income...one closed, and the other didn't like my employment situation. And later closed. I can't blame her.

Of course I want someone to agree with me, that is part of finding a dayhome, don't you think? Philosphy needs to match.

Mother of Pearl
06-08-2012, 07:43 PM
First of all I am sorry that you are going through this. I have never posted here but felt compelled after reading what you have experienced. I would go with your gut. As an experienced provider I always give a 2-3 week adjustment period and plenty of leeway to the new child. Also, patience is a must for any provider and this one seems to not have it. I won't even comment on the eye roll...get out and look for another provider. Call local schools and see if they have a list. Be honest if they ask why you are looking...its not a good fit and you have been uncomfortable. Details are not necessary! There are many loving providers out there. Good Luck.

Momof4
06-08-2012, 09:43 PM
Thanks luppernoodle! I'm not an ECE but my name became Mom at age 19 and I certainly have a lot of experience with children, all Common Sense! I think common sense is lacking these days, just my opinion, and I'm trying to bring it back, one family at a time, ha!

I agree that every child is different and unique and they don't all fit into a mold. I also am a stubborn woman and very patient and that's why I like to take babies into care rather than a 2 year old. Because the babies learn my patient stubbornness will win out every day and they are going to learn to be well behaved, patient, well mannered, caring people in my home.