Thinking of just giving up! Ugh :(

[momof5]

Ok so as you all know if had so many hassles these past few months, This one family that have been with me since March 1 ft and a before school, asked me to give them a "summer rate" since they both will be ft. I was being overly cheap and gave them my price. Tonight she tells me they are not paying the amount! They are going to find somebody else possibly cheaper!! The price i gave them was $50, thats for 2 ft kids and 9 hours a day!!! I even told them i was taking a huge income loss by doing this for them! She wants to pay$30 total for both of them! So now i'm left with 1 ft only 4 days/ week and not guarnteed to stay as moms job was cut with the new budget cuts! Ugh no successful interviews, and all the money spent on new activities for the summer months! I sure didn't see this coming! Sorry for ranting, nobody else seems to understand how much time and effort i have put into my daycare to make things fun for all ages, now i'm left empty by her being cheap! I know 2 ft kids at $30 is just not feesable (sp) and that's with me providing everything! So frustrating and heart breaking!! :(

[Inspired by Reggio]

Oh wow could luck to her trying to find someone to work for that ... seriously??

No discounts ... two kids would cost her $70 a day here and I have two siblings sets in care who do not even question fees time two!

Sorry you are struggling :(

[Bookworm]

Wow! Hugs to you. That lady will not get a good quality daycare for that price, if she even finds one at all. It sucks starting out and trying to find good clients. I opened my daycare in January and was lucky to get a ft and 2 pt, however, it has taken me until the past two weeks to get any other interviews. I find its feast or famine with the interest. Can you go to the schools close to you and let the secretary know that you have openings in your daycare. Maybe advertise for summer care for some older kids just until you get some ft clients? I find most people who are looking now are looking for September starts.
Good luck to you! I hope you find some clients soon.

[mom-in-alberta]

Yikes!! Something tells me she is going to look around and realize how ridiculous she is being. $30 doesn't even cover my daily fee for ONE child. WTH is she thinking?? That barely covers food for two kids all day. Apparently you should work for free?
Grrrr. :(

[Crayola kiddies]

Some people just want something for nothing ..... I wonder how she would feel if her boss doubled up her work load and then said oh by the way I can't pay you as much as I was paying you so too bad ...????? I'm sure she won't find anyone to look after her kids for that price unless its a family member. Even a teenager wouldn't work for that price

[michellesmunchkins]

Not a chance would I work for that money. I've done the $50/day for siblings too and trust me that's not even worth it unless you really do need the money. I no longer provide sibling discounts. they both get the exact same service so why should I lose money? You don't want this family if that's how they think!

[apples and bananas]

No discounts ... two kids would cost her $70 a day here and I have two siblings sets in care who do not even question fees time two!

(

Same here, I just gave a quote to 2 existing clients both wanting to hold a spot for baby number 2. No sibling discounts. One will be $70 for both kids a day. The other one I started her at $30 a day so i'm leaving her rate along, but her baby sibling will be $35. That's my new rate for a new client, so that's her new rate. She's lucky i'm not raising the first ones rate.

I'm sorry your struggling. But stick with your origional prices. If you discount too much to save a client you'll feel like you're not getting paid what you deserve and end up hating it! I hope things turn around soon for you.

[playfelt]

The best she is going to find for the summer is a teen looking for a babysitting job and if she ok with that then she doesn't deserve you anyways. I know that doesn't help you at all in the pocketbook. Are you willing to take school age children for the summer as there is always a demand for that come middle of June and parents realize their afterschool person has no intention of taking them all day. At least that would fill some of the gap till Sept.

Almost all the contacts I am getting now are for Sept/Oct so am trying to budget myself for a lean summer although I sort of planned it that way by not advertising my spaces earlier. I am looking forward to the break just not the financial break that comes with it.

[dodge__driver11]

Hi,

I lowered my rates....but it was after careful consideeration, and realizing that though I was worth that price I must stay competitive in my area, but I do not give sibling discounts and I reserve the right to charge based on hours not the # of days a child attends.

Don't sell yourself short. Honestly its not worth it.

But if you feel you must take an honest look at your program and fees then do so. I know I feel much better for doing that.

[momof5]

Thank you all so much for the support!! I know i might sound crazy with this idea, but do think maybe if i redo my basement and move the daycare down there instead of using just my main floor for play, crafts, and naptime? Could this possibly help attract people???
I'm willing to advertise for Sept and take a loss over the summer to tackle this idea if it would possibly attract more clients?? Opinions? I've already invested every penny into this so far, i don't think i have anything to lose?
You all give such good advice and opinions which i honestly value!

[Marie]

I am in the wrong area here! LOL $50 is what I would charge for siblings and I'm happy with that. In my area the going rate is $25 a day! I've seen some at $28 but that's the highest I've seen.

[Littledragon]

I hear ya! I'm hard core struggling too. I finally got my second family to set a date for their arrival (mom is on mat leave and wasn't sure she's going back to work) and now she's not sure she;s going to have a job to return to. My family can't live off one family (which is what I'll have if this girl backs out) and it just hit me how unstable this business is - which really scares me. I applied for a full time evening job last night. I'm SO stressed about it too. Sometimes, it just doesn't seem worth it. But then I remember how much I love it, and that if I just stick to my guns, I will eventually find something.
What mom is trying to do is get you to lower your rate. I'm sure she knows she won't find soemone who is willing to take two kids at that rate, so she's trying to get you to drop your price. Don't. You're worth more than that. If she wants to go somewhere else, let her. If you drop your rate to please her, she'll think she can take advantage of you in other areas.
I know it's hard to find people right now, but if you're not making any money by charging her what she wants anyways, what's the point?
Hang in there, I have faith everything will turn out - for both of us. I'll pray for you and you pray for me :)

[Littledragon]

oh and if it makes you feel any better, i don't give discount for siblings, it doesn't make sense for me to do that if I could find two seperate kids who would pay full price so siblings would be $90 for the day

[dodge__driver11]

Hi,

If you want to keep the daycare from over taking your home..like....you really need that seperation, that's one of the reasons to use the basement.

Other reasons are
-Like you said it attracts potential clients
-"the mess" of the daycare will/might be easier to contain
-you may be able to set up centre play easier

Some things you may want to take into consideration are:
-how will you handle meals?
-Arrival?
-Sleep?

[Crayola kiddies]

When we built our house we built it with the daycare in mind. We built a bungalow to have the larger basement so i have a dedicated daycare space. as well we have an entrance right from the garage so parents drop off and pick up that way. I have a full bathroom and a kitchenette with a bar fridge, microwave, sink, cupboards ect! My house has five bedrooms so the dck sleep in pnp's in my bedrooms and that's the only time anybody sets foot in MY house. So at the end of the day after everything is cleaned up and the last child leaves I walk upstairs and I'm home.

[playfelt]

Depending on the area you live in the basement concept either attracts or detracts. It is getting better as some come around to see advantages and a lot of renovation companies have even been marketing the idea of finishing off additional space. But for many months every other ad here in Orleans toted the benefits of their main floor playroom with natural light vs a dingy dang musty basement.

Having said that mine is in my basement although we turned the diningroom into an upstairs play area so we have the benefits of both and quite honestly when I have mostly infants we spend a lot of time upstairs and only the big kids go down for an hour or so when babies are napping - saves on the lugging up and down.

If you look around your main area is there a space that is not utilized that you could make to look more daycare friendly? A lot that have a main floor playroom use their diningroom and livingroom so it makes a large space but either room could temporarily be utilized for a playroom. Then if you fill back up, you could make finishing the basement a winter project - when a lot of the home improvement stores have sales on the supplies needed for that too so a good time if you are going to do it.

As far as finishing the basement with 5 kids it might be something you want to consider doing anyways as it would allow them to spread out a bit more including bedrooms for the older ones as they reach their teens and no one wants to share anymore.

A lot depends too on how you intend to finish the basement. The cost to do it is not recoupable from a tax claim standpoint as it considered part of your house or becomes a capital gain when you stop doing daycare or sell your house which will cost you a lot more in the long run. If getting kids is an issue this might not be the time to finish the basement for the daycare or if you do make it only a part of the space and put in lots of lighting to keep it bright.

[momof5]

I hear ya! I'm hard core struggling too. I finally got my second family to set a date for their arrival (mom is on mat leave and wasn't sure she's going back to work) and now she's not sure she;s going to have a job to return to. My family can't live off one family (which is what I'll have if this girl backs out) and it just hit me how unstable this business is - which really scares me. I applied for a full time evening job last night. I'm SO stressed about it too. Sometimes, it just doesn't seem worth it. But then I remember how much I love it, and that if I just stick to my guns, I will eventually find something.


Good luck with I'm sorry your going throughthis as well!! I hear ya, my family can't survive off this one girl i'm left with and she's only 4 days a week either!! I'm not lowering my rate for her! I'm sure you are right that she's trying to get me to do that for her, Once I told her That's not an option for me, she then terminated!! LOl oh well she has played that guilty card once before and I fell for it, but not this time!
getting this new eve
What mom is trying to do is get you to lower your rate. I'm sure she knows she won't find soemone who is willing to take two kids at that rate, so she's trying to get you to drop your price. Don't. You're worth more than that. If she wants to go somewhere else, let her. If you drop your rate to please her, she'll think she can take advantage of you in other areas.
I know it's hard to find people right now, but if you're not making any money by charging her what she wants anyways, what's the point?
Hang in there, I have faith everything will turn out - for both of us. I'll pray for you and you pray for me :)

I'm sorry your going through this as well!! I hear ya, my family can't survive off this one girl i'm left with and she's only 4 days a week either!! I'm not lowering my rate for her! I'm sure you are right that she's trying to get me to do that for her, Once I told her That's not an option for me, she then terminated!! LOl oh well she has played that guilty card once before and I fell for it, but not this time!
Good luck getting this new evening job! I will send good fill up vibes your way as well! :)

[momof5]

=dodge__driver11;168 03]Hi,

If you want to keep the daycare from over taking your home..like....you really need that seperation, that's one of the reasons to use the basement.

Some things you may want to take into consideration are:
-how will you handle meals?
-Arrival?
-Sleep?[/QUOTE]

Thank you for your much appreciated advice Dodge_driver11!

I was thinking I would use my front room as a quiet area with some books, puzzles, while we wait for everyone to arrive, then head downstairs???
As for sleep, I have a big basement so i was considering having an area for the playpens/nap mats for them, of course I have the baby monitor on, and this way i would be able to get dishes done etc.. Right now they sleep in my dining room! LOL
Is that even a reasonable thought???

[momof5]

Thanks PlayFelt!!

My basement is already finished, i would just need to change the color on the walls etc.. Right now I use my front living room and dining room for space. But it just seems like it's not enough space for people that come in. (kinda like "that's it" look)
When I peek at other websites they have such amazing spaces set up, and always seem full, this is where my idea came from. LOL I honestly am just trying to think of things that could just work to help attract more possible clients.

[Sandbox Sally]

I don't really think you need to do a dedicated daycare area to attract clients, but I guess if you're struggling, it can't hurt. It really sucks when finding clients seems to be taking forever. Don't compromise yourself, though. You'll just end up bitter with little to show for it.

Good, good luck!

[dodge__driver11]

Hi,

Well then you will have to be sure that everyone is on time, most with a basement space from my exp. only open the during pick up and arrival. Say for example, everyone is at your home by 9:30, (you don't have any "late arrivers do you?) then using the living room while waiting for your day to start is not unreasonable.

But for sleeping, can you "disassemble your area?" or are you planing on leaving it up?

Yeah for sure baby monitors are fine, but you just needd to make sure that they have a good "range" so that the tykes can be heard.

Will you have a bathroom?
How will you handle changes?

[sunnydays]

As Playfelt mentioned, sometimes basement can actually push people away. I know I looked for something non-basement when I was looking for daycare because I hate being in a dark basement all day and didn't want that for my kids either. There are also safety concerns if your windows are not big enough to climb out. Having said that, if you have big windows that solves the safety concerns as well as the dark issue and then you can have a big beautiful space to work with. We have been looking at buying a bigger house and one thing I would love is a walk-out basement with big windows so I could have the daycare there. But, if I don't find that, I would prefer to have it on the main floor with the idea that I could actually clean up the kitchen and watch them playing at the same time instead of savign it all for naptime. So, basically, if you think the playroom will be more inviting and will work well for you, then go for it, but if it is going to bring a new set of problems, I would say you are better off on the main floor. Maybe you could look more at what kinds of things you offer in terms of outings, activities, food served, etc. I don't know if any of that is where they issues are, but just a thought. Good luck!

[dodge__driver11]

Yeah that is true, light light light. I live in a condo...so my ECE background, support staff, (alternantes) is what got me my current families

[Inspired by Reggio]

I use my whole house for my program but the main play area is in my basement - I had a large window installed in the stairway for the additional fire exit because my normal windows were not large enough to meet the fire code bilaws for operating a 'business' down there and that really helps to let light down into the basement in general and make it not feel well 'dank' and I also painted it a pale shade of yellow and added lots of lighting so it does not feel like a 'basement' ... but even still I too personally do not like to spend ALL day down there as a dedicated space ... we play in my main floor family room as well and it up in the kitchen and so forth and well to be honest we spend most of our day outside as long as the weather permits and I just offer all my 'program' out there from art to story time under a tree ;)

[playfelt]

What kind of a "program" do you offer and how do you convey that in your ads or interviews?

Most of the people I have interveiwed lately even with babies are concerned about their learning and schooling and academics and the fact I have tons of toys doesn't seem to interest them. I am able to show them the kind of things we do and that makes them place their kids.

The funny reality to all this is that before their child is ever ready to truly benefit form the preschool curriculum they will be off with mom having baby number two so it was all for naught but if that is what pleases them I can show them what I have available for 3 year olds.

If that is something parents in your area are looking for then you might want to find a way to show that at interviews and put into your ads. It is one thing to say you do it but better to be able to show it.

Some areas just have too many providers which gives parents the upper hand to make demands and be choosy. Over time that will change and if you can hang in there till the balance comes back you will get calls/interviews.

As for the basement, unless you have some scary drawings on the walls just leave them as is for now and put up lots of kid friendly posters, cut pictures of kids from parents magazines and put those up to hide some of the wall. Set out active play things like tents, tunnels, balls and net, beach balls, etc. Then when you do your interview you will have the upstairs that you have now but can then say to parents that you take "physical activity" seriously and want to be sure that the children have ample opportunity to use their "gross motor muscles" and so you have an indoor play area for them so that even on rainy or winter days you can still "exercise". (be sure to actually say the words in highlighted as they are current buzz words parents like to hear). That would be a quick change to see if it works for your next couple of interviews.

I like to start out my interviews as a way of breaking the ice with asking the parents to tell me a little about the type of care you are looking for. What do you envision for your child?

That gives me a really good idea of what is important to this family and quickly if it is someone I can work with or if our expectations are not on the same page. If on the same page then run with it and if not get them to explain more and why they consider it important. Often they have read or heard something and need to be talked back into reality.

[Momof4]

I'm late to this thread but still want to send you my support momof5. I would be charging a lot more than $50 for siblings and don't offer a discount. I did it once a long time ago and it wasn't appreciated at all. The parent you are talking about won't appreciate all that you do either so in this case it's probably better to cut your ties and find a great family.

Why should you take a pay cut because the two spaces are filled by one family instead of two? Don't sell yourself short. It costs a lot to feed these little munchkins.

[apples and bananas]

I think that if I were a parent looking for daycare I might be concerned about basement care for the following: Mold or dust and I might need reasurance that my child won't be stuck in a basement all day. Especially in the winter months. So if you do decide to change your daycare space to the basement make sure you focus on those 2 things with your clients. "big windows" or "daily play outside" etc. I don't have a basement to do a daycare in and have never had my kids in one but those 2 things come to mind.

As a provider I'd be worried about drop in parents, early or late. How do I get upstairs to let them in if they're running behind or if I have different drop off times. My parents all come between 4 and 5:30. They have pick up times, but there are those days when they beat traffic and they're here 15 min early. Just make sure you plan for that. Maybe a holding area upstairs with different toys so they can wait for mom and dad.

Just some stuff to think about.

[momof5]

Thank you so very much!! For all your advice and opinions, After reading all this, I'm not going to use the basement, So many things I honestly didn't even realize until you all pointed them out! Thank You for that! I will also look into improving my program, In all honesty i didn't want it to feel like "school" even though we "play" with shapes colours etc... and do many crafts involving those, maybe not as much as I should. I didn't think parents with under 3's would focus so much on that! I will take this time to search up different ideas to improve my program and change it around! Thank you again for all your support!!

[Crayola kiddies]

You have to have the right kind of basement to do daycare .....as I said before I have an entrance right from my garage into the daycare so there is no worrying about going upstairs to meet parents .... I have high 9 foot ceilings so it doesn't feel like a basement and it is fully carpeted ( except for the kitchen area) and I have huge windows. Everyone that has come here for an interview has said it is the best daycare they have seen yet. Of course I only have space for 5 and I am full and vest of all My commute is 15 stairs and I love being in my daycare all day.

[jec]

I haven't been on line for a while and a little late too replying but want to offer my support ~stay strong. We've all been there where you hit a rough patch and stealing from Peter to give to Paul to make some ends meet.
Sending you some good vibes that things get better soon! I've always found that interviews pick up before September!