What the ..... Friday venting

[mlle.coccinelle]

Ok,
I just gave one of the parent their final strike...

remember the 3.5 year old finger sucking DKG.... well today during nap... she went in OUR washroom ( i have a separate washroom for the dayhome) and has put poop ALL OVER the toilet, wall floor.... she stepped in it.... walk all over my bedroom with her feet covered in poop... all that while i was having a snooze on my couch... I guess i wont be taking any naps anymore!

I also told her about the fact that she need to bring winter clothing... she said that it was ok for her daughter to go play outside... without her snow pants, gloves,hat, scarf and coat! she only has a fall/spring jacket.... I answered that next time she comes, if she is not dressed correctly, i will refuse to take her for the day... and she got offended.... Listen lady, you were wondering why your daughter is always sick... I have the answer for you....

I reminded her that we will be re-signing our contract the first week of January and that there will be a slight augmentation of price ( because i was new, I had no idea what to charge and realized that i am not charging enough at all!!) and she said that the price i gave her is too high for her budget and that she will have to think about it.... Well lady, if you leave, good luck finding someone that will pick up your child's crap for 25$ per day!

....Sorry for the bad words... this has been the worse week/day since i've started dayhome :( :(

[angelina]

*hugs*

oh my, i would have a rough time with a kid like that.

parents like that - i have spares at home, so everyone is well dressed for the season. i cannot put up with parents that are not dressing their kids right and i tell them -------- i got out daily and i have clothing for your kids, if you don't have any. thankfully, most of my parents bring winter coats, snow pants, good mitts when I ask them.

yes, here in ottawa $25 is too low.
my area, the low end is like $35 per day. I am at $40/day now with my toddlers.

angie

[Smitty]

oh I feel for you! how horrible! I am new at daycare. I have been caring for kids for three months and I am quikly learning from my mistakes. Geez I thought there wouldn't be any drama working for myself at home. So far I have delt with late payments, no payments, forgotten payments, NSF cheques, full timers turning into part timers, people taking surprise vacation days on the actual day, supposed toilet trained dcb pooping his pants EVERY DAY, my house getting distroyed, etc, etc,etc. I need to change policies but i am afraid i will loose clients. I dont charge enough for part time and before/after care kids. Not sure how I can change policies when it has only been a couple of months but I feel like i really need to.

[Momof4]

Yuck, yuck, yuck, yuck, poor you for having to clean all that up! I hope you made that child help you!

mlle. do you really only charge $25/day? We need to talk! I started out charging way too little and realized that I attracted the wrong kind of clients. I'm glad you have a contract because I started without one and that was a big mistake too.

I know there are a lot of other caregivers on this site from Alberta. You should talk to them before you get your contract changed so you attract the right kind of clients from now on.

[Other Mummy]

What a crappy way to end the week (pun very much intended) :)

I'm sorry you had to deal with that. At 3.5 she should know better than to smear feces all over the bathroom. How did DCM react to that news?

She is in for a rude awaking if she decides to shop eleswhere when you raise your rates. Newbies often make the same mistakes (charging way to low).

[gravy_train]

oh gosh.. that is really horrible. like everyone else is saying, don't sell yourself short, ever! i every walk of life people will take advantage of you, and this profession is no exception. you have to treat your business with a business mind.
personally, i would terminate if a child ever smeared feces all over the place. i couldn't deal with cleaning it up and part of having my ow business is that i don't have to. YOU call the shots here! embrace that power!

[treeholm]

This is indeed awful, and I'm very sorry you had a bad day. I have to say, though, that I'm stuck on the part where you say this happened while you were napping! I can't imagine allowing myself to doze off while running a daycare; it sends shivers up my spine imagining the mischief a 3.5 year old could get into if left unattended. I barely have time to go to the bathroom. Maybe I'm a paranoid newbie, but I don't let the children out of my sight for longer than the time it takes to pee, and for nap time, they are either babies in pack n plays or they are older ones (I have two 3.5 year olds) who nap where I can see them. If my child did something like that at daycare, I would ask the provider where she was when this was happening, and if she told me she was having a nap, I would be shocked. I don't mean to offend you, I'm just surprised that someone would think of taking a nap while at work.

[Momof4]

Treeholm, you are new so don't judge too harshly! I have to admit, even in this open forum that parents read, that I rest and read and sometimes doze off for 1/2 an hour or so during naptime. Hey, I'm honest and I deserve a break. The children sleep for 2 hours and I'm in the room for the first 1/2 hour while they fall asleep and the last 1/2 hour when they are waking up. They don't miss me. My dckids sleep on my main floor in my dining room and living room which are also my daycare rooms. So I go to my bedroom upstairs when they sleep.

If I stayed downstairs I would wake them up earlier than they should wake up. I would love to be able to do dishes or some other chore during naptime but to tell you the truth I'm super happy that I'm forced to relax. I stay here in the room until they are asleep and I hear the first sound out of them thanks to my Mom's ears even if I do fall asleep for a bit.

I've never had a child take off their diaper as mlle described, but I'm back down here at the first peep as I said. But my dckids wake up noisy so I'm back as soon as I hear a sound. Obviously mlle. has a sneaky girl who wakes up quietly. Extremely Yuck, but we can't judge each other!

[cfred]

Hey Treeholm....easy on the judgement calls there. This is a tough job and for some of us it runs for 12 hours/day. I've had my own kids get up and get into mischief whilst I slept. It happens. Her little poo stomper is obviously very quiet. Personally, my dcks sleep in pack and plays in separate rooms and I am NOT with them. The point of quiet time, aside from children having their sleep, is for me to have a good break. Quite frankly, we all deserve it. I might suggest that a monitor is in order as it will amplify sound, making it a little tougher for things like this to happen. I have them set up on both floors the kids sleep on. I like my kids separate so I don't have to do the whole 'settling everyone in thing'. We all have cribs in our bedrooms...kids don't like it, but they have to take one for the team :) After a bad night's sleep or if I'm ill, I've been known to doze too and I make no bones about that with the parents. If you are watching the children CONSTANTLY for the whole time you're open, you're pushing yourself too hard. YOU need a break too...or burnout will catch up with you.

And Mlle....yeah, definitely charging too little. Bump it up about $10-$15.....still not what we're worth but on par with most others.

[cfred]

Ummmm.....amendment. ...by my own kids in previous post I actually meant my OWN kids...biological... ..

[treeholm]

I apologize. It was not my intention to judge, I was just genuinely shocked. I am not someone who can nap myself... I would fall into a deep sleep and the house could be chaos and I wouldn't notice. I never even took naps when my own children were little. So the thought of someone napping while on duty with children was foreign to me. And I didn't notice in the original post that the 3.5 year old was supposed to be napping when this happened. I understood that the 3.5 year old was awake when the daycare provider took a nap. That's what shocked me so much! So, I misunderstood the situation in which the provider took a nap. I pictured a house full of children playing and a sleeping provider.

[Crayola kiddies]

Well I to would never have a nap during the day .... I do often lay on the couch and read but I don't nap as much as I would sometimes like to. As a parent if my child did this this and I asked where the care giver was and she said napping I would remove my children from her care . I don't think a caregiver should be sleeping with a house full of kids because this is what happens. JMO

[Inspired by Reggio]

Wow ~ ya the cleaning up shit sucks big time and the reality is that could have happened to the OP regardless of had she been sleeping cause in centre care we used to get kids who finger painting in their cribs quiet as mouse with THREE STAFF on the other side of the sleep room door!

But the 'sleeping on the job' just came up in another thread this morning so I will copy and paste my response from that one to save myself some time because it does come with LIABILITY if this is something you regularly practice and if you are going to do it that is of course your choice and business but if the shit hits the fan being judged by other 'providers' about it is going to be the least of your worries cause while can understand WHY it might happen that is irrelevant ... the fact is that lots of people work 12 hour shifts doing demanding jobs but if they fell asleep on them while being 'paid' they would be reprimanded and judged for it too and HAVE BEEN ;)




The liability if something happened and it was found we were actually sleeping is huge ... there was a story in the news a year or so back just this in NY ~ and the women had to serve three years in jail for it and got deported from the States ... now admittedly she feel asleep with a child not 'contained' but the reality is that no child is ever truly contained in our programs ~ kids get out of pack and plays all the time, they figure out child proof locks and so forth

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/...72R6LH20110328

There have been other cases over the years too ~ a provider who lay down in the sleep room with the kids which was in the basement to help rub backs and she fell asleep too and awoke to the fire alarm going off ... the playroom did not have proper fire exits from it and they could not get up the stairs because the fire had spread to the doorway of the basement which was right by the kitchen .... they ALL died in that fire including the provider ... the inquest from that is one of the reasons that all 'areas of your program should have two viable fire exits' ... BTW this provider had 'windows' down there but they were apparently painted shut and not large enough to get out of and she succumb to smoke inhalation trying to get them open

It is sadly not uncommon for providers to fall asleep on the job ... I know in centre care staff 'nodded off' all the time in sleep rooms with the darkness and quiet music playing you'd fall asleep sitting up all the time but thankfully we had multiple adults to go over and give each other a nudge to wake up and do their job ... falling asleep on the job is definitely a hazard in this job or any job for that matter when you have been up all night with your own kids, your own health or whatever and we should all have precautions in place to 'prevent' that from happening .... heck a police officer in our home town just got sanctioned for falling asleep on the job while supposedly monitoring a crime scene and the media videotaped her and a bus driver got nailed a little while later for it .... and none of them were immune from the public scrutiny of having done so and consequences on the job from 'suspension without pay' to 'conduct unbecoming fines'!

I get that as 'parents' we all sleep while our children are home however the reality is there is a different STANDARD OF LIABILITY when you are getting PAID to do the job verses it being your own unpaid job you are doing .... your own kid dies cause you were sleeping and they got into mischief no one comes looking for 'justice' and sadly there are dozens of cases of that in the media as well ... however someone elses kid dies or is injured while you are being paid to keep them safe they are going to be looking for some sort of 'accountability' for that action!

Look at the drowning inquest in Ottawa right now .... 1000's of children die every year in swimming pools and no inquests but a child dies in a pool while under the supervision of someone ELSE and inquest ... life is never going to be the same for ANY of us after that inquest is over cause we are held accountable for the actions of that ONE business!

Now all that said I do admit that like the provider in NY if I am under the weather I do take medication to help me get through the day but I am EXTRA cautious on those days to ensure I do not fall asleep and I still choose to 'lay down' on the couch and read a book or play games on my Nintendo or surf online from my phone just to rest my back from sitting and standing position for a bit because otherwise I risk my back going out on me again ... so for at least 30 minutes I am 'resting' along with the kids BUT I am still awake and as a precaution I set the alarm on my phone for 10 minutes intervals 'just in case' until I am ready to get up and tackle the afternoon ... so if for some reason I DID fall asleep on my break time I have the monitor on the kids sleeping rooms if they were to awake and the alarm is on and both are by my ear to wake me up if god forbid I actually did dose off while reading or something cause well I am human and realize anything is possible and take precautions as such!

Another precaution I did not mention in the other thread is that because I work 'alone' and well anything can happen here I could have a heart attack and die and the poor kids would be left 'unsupervised' until someone showed up ... so my spouse calls home regularly throughout the day to check on me and if he is not going to be available I have two other family members I ask to take on that role and as part of our fire drill the older children are taught what to do in emergencies ... such as calling 911 if 'Reggio falls down and wont get up' and when I do not have any 'older kids' on enrollment to take on the 911 roll than my spouse calls home more often and if I did not pick up he would be calling a neighbor to come check or flying home from work to check on me ... like everything in life hoping for the best in life but having a plan for the WORST is prudent!

Attending playgroups and other engagements out in 'public' is another precaution as well cause it reduces the amount of time we are home alone in isolation for something like that to happen too!

If you do not already have a 'buddy system' in place to check on each other throughout the day while you work alone I strongly suggest that you do so ... could save your own life or someone elses!

[mlle.coccinelle]

I don't normally sleep, BUT, I am pregnant, lost 15 pounds in the past month from vomiting ALL the time and have been having that AWEFUL cold for the past 3 weeks. All my parents are aware that i dose off on the cough for about an hour after i get all my cleaning from lunch done! I put my alarm on my phone to make sure I'm awake 30 minutes before the end of naptime... If I dont do that, my vomiting get's worse during the day... and i just can't do it. I though i could vent withough being judge... too bad for me.

We are going shopping at a thrift store for some extra winter clothes to keep here... It frustrate me that i need to do this... but Oh well.
and I am raising my price 10$ a day... 35 $ is what people normally ask for in the area... I'm going to raise up my standards a whole lot... No way I am cleaning poop ever again... ( well unless its an honest accident!)

[Momof4]

I'm sorry you are feeling awful mlle.c and I'm really glad to see that you are raising your rates.

[Inspired by Reggio]

I do not think anyone is intending to be 'judging' you mlle.coccinelle when they share a different opinion or why they do not engage in certain practices others do ... lots of providers do not transport their children by a vehicle because they think it comes with too much liability ... some are very vocal about that .... however I choose to do it and do not feel 'judged' when others share why they do not choose to do it and try to share their opinion to make sure I am making an informed choice ... it is a personal choice for each of us to weigh the potential liability about what we do within our business and sometimes people sharing their opinion has helped me to amend or close up risk loop holes and so forth .... people will stop being HONEST with each other on forums if people keep pulling the 'do not judge me card' .... we make judgements all day long it is part of being human asking people to not do so is against human nature ;)

I think the difference between sharing differences of opinions arises is when people stop sharing 'facts' about why they do things and start making it personal or attacking character and so forth which no one has done in this thread at all ~ everyone to this point who has disagreed with the sleeping on the job has done so from that I would be too concerned about liability or something happening to be able to do that ... the fact is only YOU know how heavy or light a sleeper you are, only YOU know what safety precautions you have put in place to wake yourself up in an emergency and only YOU have to deal with any aftermath of having been sleeping should something happen ... if you feel you have covered your basis to minimize any risk involved in this practice that is all that matters!

I think it is awesome that you have informed your clients that this is a practice you are engaging in to cope with your pregnancy while still being able to provide service to them .... transparency in our practices is key to avoiding conflict for sure. I personally have a clear detailed 'supervision policy' in my contract to make sure that clients know that at times I cannot always have my 'direct line of sight' on the children and that I rely on other senses to supervise the kids during times of the days such as food prep, quiet time, bathroom routines and so forth, clarity that I use monitors and so forth because all to often I have seen parents complaining on forums that a child was injured at daycare and blaming the provider cause she was not 'in the room' at the time like they EXPECTED that this should be the way it is and were shocked and angered to find out there kid was sometimes 'alone' in a room. And sorry but the reality is we cannot BE in the room all the time while wearing so many hats and caring for so many kids .... I am not bring all the kids into the bathroom every time someone needs to pee so my EYES can be on them at all time and so forth and well sometimes those who have never cared for multiple children do not realize what is 'practical' or not so they need to be educated to avoid conflict later on in the relationship.

So in your case you informed your clients that this was your new practice and if they were one of the people who were not ok with it than they at least had the option to make alternative arrangements if it was a deal break for them verses this being the practice but the provider thinking it is none of the clients business and therefore not informing them and than having something happen and them being angry because they were not informed that the provider was 'napping' on the job.

[Momof4]

Treeholm, I hope I didn't offend you. I was just thinking that I was like you when I started out and I got sooo tired until I really got into the routines and streamlined the way I prepare the food and crafts in the evening. I never take my eyes off the children all day long either outside or inside and going to the bathroom for myself is quick process and taking a child to the potty means I run back and forth from the bathroom to the toyroom to keep watch on everyone still.

However, my dckids are really sound sleepers and are all in the living room and dining room and it's all pitch black on my main floor so they sleep well. So I am forced to go upstairs to my room. I don't see any difference between that and the way most people have their children sleeping downstairs and upstairs and the caregivers stay on their main floor. My set up is the opposite, that's all.

[treeholm]

Oh gosh, no, Momof4, I was not offended! You are right that I am a newbie, and I love the fact that I can be open when asking questions on this forum. I respect those of you who are more experienced so much, and appreciate the feedback. I really was shocked when I interpreted the original post to mean that a caregiver was napping while children were awake. I have two 3.5 year old dcg, neither of whom naps, so I didn't even think of the child being asleep. We do have quiet time, but we all know that a child at that age who thinks the caregiver isn't watching, can get into all sorts of mischief. I just had a picture in my mind of a napping caregiver with children fending for themselves, and it bothered me so much I had to respond. As Reggio pointed out, each of us needs to know how heavily we would sleep, whether the children would be safe etc. I am such a heavy sleeper that I wouldn't even risk napping while the children were asleep, but that's me. I think if I fell asleep, the parents might all arrive to find their children screaming and me passed out... not a pretty picture for sure!

[sunnydays]

While I am certainly not judging the OP and I am empathetic to her situation in which to get through the day she NEEDS that rest...I also agree with Treeholm and Reggio that sleeping can be a liability if something happens. I have quiet time and use my computer or lie down and read a book, but I don't sleep. If I did doze, it wouldn't be a heavy sleep anyway as I am not a heavy sleeper, but I just don't. I do get a nice quiet break, but I always have my ears open. I once had a child come down with croup while in my care...he woke up crying and wheezing and having trouble breathing...I shudder to think about what would have happened if I had not heard him. These are the things I think about and why I am always listening for anything slightly amiss during naptime. Anybody not in a playpen I have directly in earshot so I can hear if they get off their cots because you just never know...even though it has never happened, there is a first for everything. But I am definitely not judging anyone who does nap...I do understand.

[playfelt]

While I don't support the napping for the adult during naptime. Do remember that there are extenuating circumstances and the parents have all agreed that they would prefer the caregiver take a nap during naptime rather than close her daycare while she gets over this part of her pregnancy.

[dodge__driver11]

Hi all...

I know I am a little late to the post here--But I like reggio have my husband call and check on us regularly because I am a one woman show, but I too would never sleep unless there was another adult present to cover while resting. While I am emphathetic, and certainly not judging, its just not something I could do...I wouldn't be able to rest as I would be too worried that something like this or worse would happen.

If I may share an exprience with you...

I have a dck who is a very loud waker, like the type who sings, babels, and junk, and one day he didn't wake at his usual time.... and I went by his bed, here he was choking on sticky tack that my sister left out while hanging posters the day before. He was just tall enough to reach.... (Needles to say I had a few choice words for her) I don't know what would have happened had I been napping too:(

Is there someone that could come in for you like mom dad a cousin, or a friend so that you can rest?

That said ds is very sneaky, and he has snuck keys from my pocket soda off the counter all while I am wide awake and watching.... SO SNEAKY...

Hope things get better :(