''Discipline'' the child when parents are there ? [Archive] - Daycare Bear Canada

DisneyPrincess

01-24-2013, 08:24 AM

Ok since the 4 pages of threads are all gone because of the ''bomb'' I thought I would just bring in more topics to discuss.

Its been a while now that I am wondering this : Do you intervene in disciplining the child even if the mom or dad is there ?

When the child is misbehaving with ME, I do my thing. Obviously no time-out but I do say to the child that it is unacceptable behaviour. Problem is the parents most of the time give kisses to the kids and tell them ''please dont do that, i loveeee you'' :no:

But my attitude little 3 y.o. who has tons of anger often gets upset, hits her parents, stomps her feet, makes angry faces and all they do is cuddle her ?? :no: Sometimes I want to say : You shouldnt cuddle her, she is misbehaving and you are showing her that its ok to act that way !!! It would really help me if we were on the same page about her ''attitude'' problems ?!

What would you do ? say something, say nothing ?

Its been a year that she acts that way and every day I get a taste of her disrespectful behaviour with me, I cant stand it, even though there is time-out to take a breather and after that we are good for a few. I keep telling the parents how tough it is sometimes but I dont ''tell'' them what not to do obviously.

It drives me crazy when I see parents letting their kids do their fit and acting out. When my own girls were little, I did not accept it at all, guess I was a little firm !

Inspired by Reggio

01-24-2013, 08:40 AM

My house, my rules and until they are out the door everyone needs to follow them ... so yes if a child is misbehaving during drop off or pick up and the parent does not quickly address it in the manner expected in our code of conduct that YES I would step in because I do not want negative behavior at pick up or drop off escalating to other children who are watching and think 'hey maybe I will try that look at all the attention Johnny is getting with that fit!

A child who HIT their parent would get a very stern talking to by me specially if their parent tried to be all 'oh honey' about it .... NOT ACCEPTABLE regardless of the age of a child to hit another person!

A child who cannot not 'exit the program gracefully with dignity and respect for others' the parent is basically instructed by me to 'time to take them as is please and leave because this is not acceptable behavior for the other children to be watching and should not be negotiated with' ... I had one child leave my home in the middle of winter with no coat or boots cause she was refusing to get dressed for the mother she NEVER did it again because it was bloody cold outside and she had to ride all the way home COLD. If the first time did not solve the problem than from that point onward they would be required to tidy up their activity 10 minutes before their parent 'normally arrives' and to get dressed to go home and be sitting waiting the next day on the step all ready to be picked up ~ this way they can be taken out immediately if they were 'acting up' again and they would continue to do that daily until the child has left the program 'gracefully with dignity and respect' and then they would be allowed to earn back the privilege to continue to play up until their parent arrived ... it usually only takes 2-3 days for the child to realize it is 'easier to behave with dignity and respect' because the tantrum because they do not want to go home does not work!

kidlove

01-24-2013, 08:45 AM

you werent "firm" you were a good parent. Any parent who doesn't discipline when the child is acting out and in clear need of discipline is not being a "good parent" IMO. Some parents for some reason feel that discipline has it's own time and place, and others just don't discipline at all. I am a firm believer of firm discipline and "nipping it in the bud" quickly. I have had MANY children I care for behave one way with me and another when the parent comes through the door. Some of them are down right brats and know that when Mom or Dad comes I am no longer the "boss" and they act out, knowing full well that Mom or Dad will do nothing! :cursing: and others do the "act out" for attention of that parent they missed all day and are now trying to get all the attention from the whole day in one minutes time. Either way...the behavior is inappropriate in my book. I generally give the parent/child one chance to work it out on their own, but if the parent allows the child to disrespect them in front of me continually and does nothing, I will intervene on the parents behalf....never addressing to the parent as to tell them how to handle the child, (teaching them to parent is not my job) :) rather I will continue to do my job of teaching the child the correct behaviors. I will take the child by the hand to face me, or tap the child on the shoulder, make clear eye contact as I do all day when they are with me, and clearly and firmly state what they need to do..." ________, you need stop crying and put your boots on!" I will ussualy address any ill behavior toward parent as.."_____, do not treat Mommy that way, Mommy loves you and missed you all day, tell her you are sorry and do what you are told". Parents usually appreciate the step in to help them out, alot of times they have had a long day and don't want the fight and other times they are a little embarrassed and appreciate the backup. Depending on the parent, I will ask the child if they would like to take a timeout while Mom or Dad waits? some parents dont mind that as well, just depends on the parenting style and the child. I have also had children that completely disrespect the parent and aside from my efforts we get no where, I just dress them up quick and send them out the door kicking Mom, to that I say.....let them beat you up on your own time! Not mine! :)

Inspired by Reggio

01-24-2013, 08:48 AM

...Its been a year that she acts that way and every day.....but I dont ''tell'' them what not to do obviously....

Well now that the behavior is a 'habit' it is going to be even HARDER to change it specially if you do not have the parents on board!

I agree that every parent has a right to their own parenting style in their own homes cause well they are their children .... however IMO when you choose to enroll your child in a GROUP setting you also need to be prepared to follow the rules and expectations of that GROUP ... if at home your child is allowed to hit and scream and behave like a little demon that is your choice but when you send that same kid to SCHOOL you need to accept that they are going to be sent home or supspended and so forth because that 'behavior' is not tolerated by society!

This is why I have no problem telling my clients what I need and expect from them while HERE ... cause this is my home, my rules and I control what is tolerated here .... if they do not want to instill that behavior or value at home I cannot really control that however I can let them know that inconsistency between home and the group setting will make it harder for their child to adjust between the two varied expectations and if the behavior is a 'deal breaker' for me that their choice not to be consistent about the expectation at home could result in the child being terminated before they have a chance to 'master' the skill because of the inconsistent expectations ... which is usually a pretty good motivator for the parent because it then kicks in that allowing their kid to do this is going to result in no daycare which makes changing the behaviour an easier investment than trying to find a provider willing to deal with that behaviour ;)

DisneyPrincess

01-24-2013, 08:59 AM

Yah when I tried once to speak to the girl, she gave more and more attitude, parent ask to say sorry to me but she just kept giving me the eye... she was in daddy's arm looking at me as if saying : Nanana you cant do anything :P Oh my blood was boiling ! I couldnt just grab her from dad's arm and bring her in time-out ??!?!

Some kids screams their eyes out to get dressed when with me, I have zero problems in the morning when I have to dress all 5. But I tried putting mittens on one little girl OMG she was screeaammiinnggg !

Plus isnt it risky to bring in time-out when parents just want to leave ? What if I get problems with the parent after ?!

OMG I am so firm with the kids during the day, but when the parents get here I'm afraid to show them my ''frimness'' perhaps because they'll think I'm too firm and take their kids out :unsure:

Inspired by Reggio

01-24-2013, 09:17 AM

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Plus isnt it risky to bring in time-out when parents just want to leave ? What if I get problems with the parent after ?!

I personally do not use time outs because I find them ineffective so this is not an issue for me ~ I would just be addressing that the behaviour was inappropriate, needed to stop and if it did not that the consquence would be tomorrow you will have to get ready prior to mom and dad arriving so that you can leave without treating mom or dad like that'

At my house if a child is sent for some alone time it is because they have lost 'control' of their emotions and need a safe place to self regulate not as 'punishment' for something they have done ... so they control how long they are 'in an alone space' and than are welcome to return when needed to have a conversation and resolve the conflict that caused them to loose their noodle in the first place ;)

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OMG I am so firm with the kids during the day, but when the parents get here I'm afraid to show them my ''frimness'' perhaps because they'll think I'm too firm and take their kids out :unsure:

IMO this needs to change or you are going to continue to have issues with pick up and drop off because your daycare children can SEE that you behave inconsistently when other adults are around ... this gives them power and control ...so they are going to misbehave just to TEST how far they can push before you DO do something and over time that will start 'escalating' so that behavior is not just being tested at pick up and drop off but all day long .... the rules and expectations for children need to be the same regardless of who is around or you end up with mutiny over time!

I do not behave any differently with my crew regardless of whose here if they do something that needs redirecting I redirect it, if they have a conflict that needs resolution we resolve it, if they were to do something that made me angry I would let them know in a socially acceptable manner ... IMO we do a child a disservice by pretending that we never have extreme feelings and showing them how we deal with them without 'hitting/yelling/etc' that we tell them not to do ... if I was concerned that my practice might be seen as 'too firm' I would have to honestly reflect on IS IT TRULY and adjust my practice so I could be consistent in front of others or if I truly felt I was just in my actions and handling of situations that way than I would know I some how attracted clients into my program that do not share my values on child rearing in which case it likely would not be a 'bad thing' if they choose to leave because I was FIRM with my expectations for human decency because over time it will ensure I end up with a program that has minimal stress cause the children all behave well ;)

mimi

01-24-2013, 09:24 AM

daycarewhisperer

01-24-2013, 09:31 AM

Inspired by Reggio

01-24-2013, 09:34 AM

...I told my dcb (31/2 yr old still in diapers) not to open/close the door in front of parent. I received a side glance from parent not happy I was instructing child not to do this. Excuse me, wind chill is -25 do you want to pay my heating bills? :cursing:

I have the same rule ~ if a client EVER side glanced me about it they TOO would get disciplined ;)

IMO this is not just a 'letting the cold air in or out' issue, or a you are going to break my door handle reefing on it which I agree would suck for sure but ultimately are just about money and are replaceable ... IMO this is a SAFETY issue for all the children in my care ... children are not permitted to open ANY door except the bathroom door because at my house opening doors are an adult job so that I know the children are safe at all times ...IMO when a child feels they are allowed to just open a door that exits the house it opens the reality that they could open it when you are not looking and run out into the street ... you hear those stories on the news about children who 'get loose' from the house because they were not taught to leave the door ALONE until they were old enough to earn that trust and they were hit by a car, died of hypothermia cause the parent thought they were napping and did not check on them until too late and other horrible preventable stories had the exit doors been kept locked and had the child been taught consistently that it was not SAFE to open the door by yourself at your age!

mimi

01-24-2013, 09:43 AM

Reggio, it is a Big rule in my daycare not to touch doors even if an older child wants to help by holding door open when we go outside. I remind them only Mimi can touch the doors. You are correct, it is the parents who need the discipline as well. This little guy with the diapers is now in pull ups because I said he wasn't to wear diapers here any longer and training must commence. At pick up he told his mom he peed in his pull ups to wish she told him that was perfectly o.k. I told her no, it is not o.k. If you allow it, then the pull ups become a diaper substitute. She didn't like me telling her that, but too bad. It is that attitude that has delayed his training!

kidlove

01-24-2013, 09:45 AM

disney: i have used timeouts for certain kids, not all though! different kids different discipline, what works for some definately may not work for others, I go with the parents opinion, I have had kids start to throw a fit and had the parent say I dont mind if he/she needs a time out, I will wait....this is speaking of the kid that when put in time out, does them good and they come out of it with a dif attitude than going in. Doesnt work for all but for those that it does work for, I offer that to the parent. I have also interfered with mothers putting their kids in the car seat with the kid kicking and screaming at them, I say.."do you mind?" they respond: "by all means", I give the child the "look" tell them to sit still and get buckled! they shut up, sit still and let me buckle...the Mother stands there in disbelief, "how did you do that!" I reply with the plain and simple..." when you are in control they are not, you just have to let them know you are in control, as easy as a look".....

DisneyPrincess

01-24-2013, 10:56 AM

Oh geez stories I could tell about misbehaviour at the door! I instruct the misbehaviour dck's by telling them before pick up that they can not touch the door (opening and closing, running outside) and that they must listen to mom/dad and no crying. This works for a second and then just like DisneyPrincess said, they give the evil eye and nanana look. The parents don't want to discipline because THEY will feel bad having not seen them all day.
I told my dcb (31/2 yr old still in diapers) not to open/close the door in front of parent. I received a side glance from parent not happy I was instructing child not to do this. Excuse me, wind chill is -25 do you want to pay my heating bills? :cursing:

I have patio door, very dangerous to squeeze fingers in, and some even bang in the window :blink: Now obvisouly I say to the child, to not do that, cause to my surprise, parents dont ! It the summer they will lean in the screen door haaaaaa : If they break it, would I have the courage to have them pay for it :mad:

DisneyPrincess

01-24-2013, 11:04 AM

Inspired by Reggio

01-24-2013, 11:12 AM

.... but the ''parents you cant control you kids, let me help you and show you how its done'' part LOL kindda hard. I feel I would be rude to the parents but I get your point ladies. My house, my rules !

Just imagine us all standing behind you with our best Supernanny glare pose of 'you're the boss here ~ they really NEED this assertiveness from you to thrive both the children and the parents' ;)

My clients have always been thankful of parenting advice and tips ~ I typically do not offer it unless truly needed basically keep my nose out of their parenting unless it is affecting their child's ability to cope in the program and counter conducive to the goals we have set together for their child or I see they are visibly struggling with a child or if they are 'venting' to me about issues at home and than always approach it professionally 'I can see you are struggling have you ever considered trying ...' or 'I empathize with how frustrated you are have you ever tried ...' followed by my suggestion of what I have seen work to correct those issues they are having.

kidlove

01-24-2013, 11:20 AM

funny one for ya! i saw one of my daycare boys out in the grocery store once and he was screaming at his Mom, standing in the cart and hitting her in the face. First I heard the ruckus and looked at my daughter and said "wow, somebody needs discipline" :) turned the corner and found...it was one of my daycare kids! one of MY daycare kids! Now any of you who take deep pride in the helping raising of these kids will completely understand my point of view at that very moment....I had this child from 6 months to now (4.5 year old) and there he is, the mild mannered, quiet little blonde haired boy (with me) but acting as a dr heckle and mr hyde complete 360 with Mom.....I was so angry to see him behaving that way. They were walking in the same direction as me, but in front of me down the isle (moms back was to mee as they alked) but because boy was standing in cart and facing his Mom, he was also facing me over his Mom's shoulder......in mid scream and hit, at her....he caught me in his view, :ohmy:....we made eye contact and with my all too familiar "I am dissatisfied look on my face" and a lift of my hand shaking my finger in the "no,no" back and forth to him, he instantly stopped screaming, turned around and sat in the cart....you should have seem the look on her face, like "what just happened?":huh: She rounded the next corner and so did I, at that point I was right behind them and he still had his eyes fixed on me, I said heelo to mom, she looked surprised to see me (not junior though :)) I overstepped my bounderies, but felt Mom needed a little help, so I took a big jump and said to Boy, "wow, you sure are giving your Mom a hard time, you need to sit still and behave, that behavior makes me and Mom very upset" gave him the look....;).....see you tomorrow! He continued to watch me as I walked away, Mom thanked me the next day, said he was good the rest of the visit at the store. Now why can't parents understand how to take the control from the child like we do?

Inspired by Reggio

01-24-2013, 11:31 AM

... Now why can't parents understand how to take the control from the child like we do?

Because we parent out of the investment and necessity of maintaining harmony and safety in our group and IMO many parents today parent out of GUILT so they do not want what little time they have with their child being marred by correcting behavior ... little do they realize if they invested in that time when wee their time would be more 'positive' over all specially as they grow up and behaviors like that 'escalate' when left undisciplined!

daycarewhisperer

01-24-2013, 11:40 AM

Wow you ladies have guts... I need to figure out what to do, cause it pisses me off seeing kids like that. sorry the language. And not just here, at the store or restaurant or others places. Watching Supernanny boils me to see parents gets treated that way and let it happen.

I have guts with everything else, getting parents to pay me on time, pick up on time, children listening to me all day, but the ''parents you cant control you kids, let me help you and show you how its done'' part LOL kindda hard. I feel I would be rude to the parents but I get your point ladies. My house, my rules !

It's not guts for me. It's only that I'm willing to give up the money. Once all of us are clear that I'm willing to give up the money then a choice has to be made.... follow my rules and my expectations or scoot on down the road to find someone who either needs the money or it doesn't hurt their heart to see violence. That aint me.

daycarewhisperer

01-24-2013, 11:48 AM

The parents don't want to discipline because THEY will feel bad having not seen them all day.

Naw it's not because they feel guilt. They don't want the child to cry. They like the idea that their child gets to go nuts and act horrible because deep down inside them they wish they could do that too. They are quite comfortable with letting their kid get their bad bahviour on in your house because they pay you and you WILL put up with it or not get the money. They also feel their child should have their way and not be upset at all. Their kid deserves that because he/she is special and they are the child of their parents.

It's a combination of a lot of things but guilt isn't even on the radar.

kidlove

01-24-2013, 11:48 AM

agreed Reggio. I do recognize that most parents do allow so much more ill behavior from their kids because it seems (and sometimes they openly admit) they only have their kids so many hours per day, why spend them disciplining? Even when I worked I didn't allow that behavior from my own kids, if they needed discipline at pick-up they got it! it's guilt and for some just laziness or ignorance. They don't care enough or don't want to put forth the effort it takes to discipline.

bright sparks

01-24-2013, 11:52 AM

I don't allow parents to parent under my roof. I am the leader until they are off site. I also don't allow ANY violence in my home so when the child hit the parent it would upset me so much that I couldn't have the kid anymore. It's a deal breaker here. There's no amount of money worth me watching violence in my own home. It's not about them.... what's best for them... their needs... their child... their ways. It's just about ME and what I need in MY house. No judgements... I get that there are a lot of parents who are perfectly comfortable with that kind of violence... but I'm not and my dc kids sure the heck arent. Some of them have been here for four plus years and never seen anything violent happen here. I wouldn't want them to witness it or my other clients either. Too risky and too upsetting.

She would be told that it's never to happen again and I wouldn't allow her inside my house with the kid. I would have her deliever the kid to the door step and I would bring her in over the threshhold and receive the child at the outside of my house on the door step. If they made a scene from the front door to the car... then they would have to go. My neighbors wouldn't like that deal AT ALL and they are way higher priority in the food chain than any day care clients or kids. Day care kids come and go but my neighbors are here for decades. I want THEM to live in peace too.

I am greatful to your contributions to this forum daycarewhisperer and find that quite often you present a different angle through your opinions on different subjects. I am interested in your comment about how if a child hit once that you would no longer accept them into your daycare. I was just wondering why you wouldn't work with a family and child to rectify this behaviour? I understand that you said that it is your need to have a violent free home, but I know that so many children act out physically and it isn't acceptable behaviour under any circumstances but I struggle with the idea of not doing anything about it other than sending them off to somebody else to deal with. I'd love to hear your thoughts on this as I know there has to be a line drawn when enough is enough but surely every child deserves a second chance and speaking for myself as a caregiver, investing my time in these children through good and bad is part of my role in the children's lives.

kidlove

01-24-2013, 11:54 AM

bright sparks

01-24-2013, 11:56 AM

Naw it's not because they feel guilt. They don't want the child to cry. They like the idea that their child gets to go nuts and act horrible because deep down inside them they wish they could do that too. They are quite comfortable with letting their kid get their bad bahviour on in your house because they pay you and you WILL put up with it or not get the money. They also feel their child should have their way and not be upset at all. Their kid deserves that because he/she is special and they are the child of their parents.

It's a combination of a lot of things but guilt isn't even on the radar.

I think a lot of parents are like this but please, don't paint every parent with the same brush. Guilt is most definitely on the radar for a lot of people.

kidlove

01-24-2013, 11:58 AM

if I let every child who hit once go...i don't think I would have any kids left. ha ha! isn't it human nature to learn from mistakes, and isn't it fact that children don't know better, we have to correct the bad and teach the good.

bright sparks

01-24-2013, 12:05 PM

I do agree in part with you too whisper, many parents do it for many diferent reasons, some for the reasons above talked about, I do feel some do chose not to discipline due to the guilt they feel for going off to work everyday, and what has not been mentioned is perhaps the worst of them all, the parent who you defined, the parent who truly feels that IF they discipline their child it send a message to the child that they don't love them....these parents are the kind that do anything in their power to make their child smile and stay happy all day, even when it is at the expense of others including themselves, these are perhaps the worst of all, because they are raising their child to be a selfcentered.."do for me because I am the only one that matters" kinf of person...... that is the one that gets me the most upset! I call it "creating a monster" i always mention gently to these parents that "their child will only be cute for so long" even they will get tired of the behavior at some point, and by them? it will be too late!

The people who raise their children like this will have a reason for doing so. It doesn't make it right, but it doesn't mean they can correct all of their behaviours over night. Things to factor in are how they were raised, childhood trauma among many others. A child raised with lots of physical discipline and shaming for example may subconsciously have this fuelling their need to please their child for fear of them feeling the same upset that they did. There is far more involved in how we parent our kids than just being selfish or shallow or doing the easiest most convenient thing and for everyone, don't think for one minute you have a clue what's going on behind closed doors. While it doesn't apply to everyone, there are many parents suffering depression, marriage instabilities, financial issues etc etc and while this isn't a good enough excuse for raising "a monster",it's still a reason. I think there obviously has to be boundaries on how much you do but I feel these parents still deserve compassion and guidance and honesty. Maybe a person doesn't want to hear the truth but its part of the process. Eventually it will click, or maybe it won't but I don't begin to pretend that I know why these people are the way they are with their children but an honest open conversation is definitely a good starting point. Otherwise if you don't want to invest this extra part of you, then terminate. They aren't going to change and your not going to be any help keeping quiet and saying nothing. (This isn't directed at anyone specifically btw)

bright sparks

01-24-2013, 12:05 PM

daycarewhisperer

01-24-2013, 12:39 PM

I am greatful to your contributions to this forum daycarewhisperer and find that quite often you present a different angle through your opinions on different subjects. I am interested in your comment about how if a child hit once that you would no longer accept them into your daycare. I was just wondering why you wouldn't work with a family and child to rectify this behaviour? I understand that you said that it is your need to have a violent free home, but I know that so many children act out physically and it isn't acceptable behaviour under any circumstances but I struggle with the idea of not doing anything about it other than sending them off to somebody else to deal with. I'd love to hear your thoughts on this as I know there has to be a line drawn when enough is enough but surely every child deserves a second chance and speaking for myself as a caregiver, investing my time in these children through good and bad is part of my role in the children's lives.

It's a process. First the parents contact me and read my website where I have this: We have little behavior issues with our kids. They don't hit, bite, fight, or be mean to each other in any way. The love each other and treat each other with respect and admiration.

During the interviews we talk extensively about it. I let them know that I don't allow ANY violence. I tell them I WILL discipline their child in my home when they are here at drop off or pick up. If the kid is mobile I discipline them during the interview if they do something I don't allow so the parents see that I am VERY comfortable correcting their child in my house.

So the parents of older babies or toddlers know that I don't have violence so if their kid hits, figths, bites they don't hire me.

Next phase is to address the pre-violence behaviors which include any physical resistance, bucking/flailing while in the arms of the adult, pulling/grabbing on clothing, putting their hands to the face of the adult in a clapping motion, bycycle kicking during diaper changes as a resistance or flipping during a diaper change, pulling their hands away when the parent purposely has them clasped, and grabbing at hair. When they start that stuff as infants I address it with the parents and show them the techniques I have to get them to stop it.

I tell the parents THIS is the stuff they do before they start whacking at you... kicking you... pulling hair etc. I work with the parents to stop it at THAT level. With each interaction I have the parents know I mean business.

I say phrases like "I can't have that here" "he can't do that" "I can't have him kicking at me" "I can't have him grabbing my glasses" etc... when they are really little... like seven to twelve months.

By the time they are walking the parent knows the line. They are also talked to about these pre behaviors and I tell them pretty frankly that if the kid does that to THEM at home they need to TELL me so I can nip it in the bud here.

I also watch them from car to door. If the kid starts acting up on my property I open the door and SAY something. I don't let anything slide. I say "stop it", "knock it off", "NO", or whatever to get the kid to know I'm watching and the parent to know I mean it. I don't want my neighbors having to listen to a badly behaved kid a few feet away.

If I see an older baby grabbing at their moms (it's almost always the mom) I SAY something right there "NO johnny... leave it..." and show the parent how to turn the child away from them and put them on ignore or "shun" while we continue to talk.

Bit by bit they get it. The parents don't want bad behavior here and as their child ages they love the fact that they are safe to know they won't get hurt here. Their friends and family who have age mate children are getting hurt at day care and they proudly say their child doesn't act like that and they have NEVER been bit at their day care.

It's a process but it works. :) I'm never afraid to take over and I discipline them right in front of their parents. I let the parents know that I can't manage it and if they want this deal they have to be on the same plan. I've never had a kid raise their hand to me... not once in my 34 year career. They KNOW better from day one. The parents know I not only will not allow it towards me or the kids but I won't allow it between them and their kids under my roof.

One other thing.. is that the discipline/corrections with child and parent are VERY short and quicklike. I say what I have to say and then in a flash... I'm over it. I don't do therapy sessions. I don't do "I'm sorry's". I don't make a big deal of it once I've corrected or said my peace. I just MOVE ON to the next thing and act as if nothing happened. I am a super quick forgiver and I don't make too much out of it.

The parents know over time that I TRULY love love love love love their kids. I love them with every bit of my soul. I would give my life for them. When they really GET that you are coming from a pure heart and not any other place but what is best for yourself, the other kids, my kid, my property, and their kid they have an intrinsic trust. They may not LIKE every correction or redirection but they know for sure that it aint personal and I dig their kid. It's just my ways and the results are excellent.

DisneyPrincess

01-24-2013, 12:58 PM

OMG kidlove - the boy the grocery store -- that is funny. I do that to kids here sometimes. The parents are back at me and I give the 'not happy' look and the 'no no no' gesture to the child. It worked a few times hahaha

DisneyPrincess

01-24-2013, 01:16 PM

Daycarewhisperer, you are like Supernanny Joe, dont worry it is not an insult its a compliment. I love that women, have you ever seen the show ? The British supernanny, not the american one I dont like her.

Supernanny Joe gives all the love and support to parents and she sure knows how to handle the children in a calm matter. I know its television, but I'm sure she's IT !

mom-in-alberta

01-24-2013, 04:50 PM

My handbook states that once the parents arrive, THEY are in charge. But they are expected to enforce MY values and rules, which are pretty clear!! Should a parent choose not to, I absolutely will.
For whatever reason, kids tend to go nuts at pick up. Maybe overstimulation, excitement about seeing mom/dad, a little bit of anger that mom/dad have been gone all day.... I don't know.
And for whatever reason, parents don't tend to discipline the kiddos. Guilt over being away all day, embarassment, maybe it just never happens anyway (the discipline).... I don't know.
But I have told this story once, and I will tell it again. I used to be all casual and let mom/dad deal with all the behaviour. Probably just non-confidence on my part. That ended the day that a 5(!) year old boy KICKED my front door into the wall, because he didn't like what his dad told him they were going to have for supper. No more Miss Nice Lady.
From that point on, if YOU aren't going to show/teach your child, I WILL. As long as they are around me, they will behave in the manner that I expect from them.

JennJubie

01-24-2013, 05:04 PM

[QUOTE=Inspired by Reggio;37132
... I had one child leave my home in the middle of winter with no coat or boots cause she was refusing to get dressed for the mother she NEVER did it again because it was bloody cold outside and she had to ride all the way home COLD. [/QUOTE]

When I had my son in daycare he did this. I went to pick him up, and he threw a fit because he didn't want to put on his winter gear. I gave him ONE warning and when he refused to get dressed again, and went on with his tantrum, I scooped him up and marched right out the door with him. It only happened once.

DisneyPrincess

01-24-2013, 06:35 PM

OMG I did it ladies ! Thanks to your awesome advice, before parents arrive I had a tiny chats with the children. Even thought the 2 y.o. didnt quite understand me, I said : Now when mommy and daddy arrives, you are going to be extra nice with mommy and daddy and get dressed ! -- When parents arrived : the 3 y.o. was all over the place, I did my best ... but daddy was sitting on the ground getting her dressed, she kept falling on him for fun and well it wasnt the best scenario but she did look at me constantly.. worried.. lolll - And one little girl was spinning around not wanted to get dressed, I said TO EVERYONE : Girls remember what we talked about, we stay nice and get dresse right ?? she looked at me, I looked at her and said, listen to mommy and go get dressed... SHE DID :yes: I WAS SO PROUD OF MYSELF.

We have been inside all week so kids are so hyper, but tomorrow friday, last day :) and hope pick up goes as well or even better :D

kidlove

01-24-2013, 07:42 PM

Good for you! Just remember....YOU ARE THE ONE IN CHARGE! and if you don't like what the child is doing in your home OR the parent isn't doing enough? you have the right to step in and if the parent doesn't like it....there's the door.

I had one little guy kick his Mom and scream at the front door, when I realized all the other kids were watching him throw his fit...I put a stop to it fast, I looked right at him and said "you act like that, you leave my house!" opened the door and pointed outside, Mother followed. as I closed the door, I pleasantly shouted, "see you tomorrow" and closed the door. wanted to make sure EVERYONE understood, that doesn't happen in my house!

mom-in-alberta

01-24-2013, 11:16 PM

Great job!! :)

DisneyPrincess

01-25-2013, 08:11 AM

OMG LADIES THIS MORNING TOTALLY BACKFIRED ON ME ; the 3 y.o. girl was rude to her mother this morning, I SAID : REMEMBER WHAT WE TALKED ABOUT YESTURDAY, WE STAY NICE TO MOMMY IN THE MORNING.. the brat started crying, her mom was shocked when I told her my new way of ''no negativity'' and its been months that I try so hard with her and you know what, yesturday went great !! WELL AFTER A LONG ARGUMENT THAT ITS NORMAL FOR HER TO ACT THAT WAY AND SHE IS JUST EXPRESSING HERSELF AND MOTHER FEELS GUILTY SO... SHE DIDNT AGREE WITH ME, ALTHOUGH SHE ONLY HAD A FEW MONTHS LEFT SHE JUST GAVE ME HER 2 WEEKS NOTICE !!!!!

I SAID FINE ITS TOO BAD YOU FEEL THAT WAY, IVE BEEN TRYING SO HARD TO HELP AND UNDERSTAND HER AND.... YOU KNOW WHAT I ACCEPT YOUR TWO WEEKS NOTICE IN WRITING THEN.

IM FUMMMIIINNNNGGGG !!!

Inspired by Reggio

01-25-2013, 08:30 AM

Oh wow ~ that totally sucks Disney ... I personally would not let the experience stop me from standing up for myself ~ if she feels the need to terminate because you are now going to be expecting socially acceptable behavior from her child than it is time for them to go ... just because a behaviour is a 'developmentally appropriate' does not mean that we need to CONDONE it because it is not socially acceptable behaviour to express yourself by SCREAMING AND CRYING!

I will admit that this is the one of the reasons why I do not allow behavior like that to 'start' in the first place because if you allow it to start without addressing it with a client you sort of reach that point of no return with clients where when you finally DO stand up for yourself that they get MAD because from their perspective you are now 'reneging' on some agreement you had at least in their mind that this was allowable and now suddenly it is not ... they feel like they are getting ripped off by having new expectations thrust upon them and so forth :rolleyes:

Even when the behavior is so totally socially unacceptable ~ I have seen cases of poor providers where a client who was constantly bouncing checks, being late with payments and so forth doing things no 'business' would have tolerated and the provider finally stood up and the client tried to BLAME THE PROVIDER for being unreasonable ... some people just have such a very skewed sense of 'entitlement' it is sad! :thumbdown:

mimi

01-25-2013, 08:35 AM

Disney you were proud of yourself yesterday for standing up for good behaviour in your home. Continue to be proud of this stance. This mother showed poor parenting. Instead of following your lead to get her child to behave, she made excuses for her child and terminated. That is an adults angry sulk. Very immature. She has the 'no one tells me what to do" attitude. Well happily let her go and look for alternate care. Good riddance.

Inspired by Reggio

01-25-2013, 08:47 AM

Agreed Mimi ~ in fact I would take it one step further that the mother demonstrated the exact behavior you were trying to correct in her daughter ... life handed her a choice she did not like and instead of approaching it with dignity and accepting that this is your home and she needs to respect and follow your lead within it she has thrown her own TANTRUM ;)

kidlove

01-25-2013, 08:48 AM

yuck! this is a prime example of poor parenting and you pay the price. I have had the same thing happen to me before, don't blame yourself, if anything don't let the poor behavior start in the first place, as reggio said! and maybe rethink your interviewing process as well, make sure you include some sort of "behavior expectations" right off the get go! Inform parents and child the behavior that is expected upon drop off and pick up...that way, it's all in the open. You won't throw anyone any surprises, by allowing it one day and putting your foot down the next. Unacceptable behavior is unacceptable behavior no matter what, if that Mom can't handle it, she needs to quit her job and let her daughter walk all over her in private. What does she expect you to do, just sit there and watch her kid misbehave in your home, and say nothing? as one of the others here always says........NEXT!!!!

DisneyPrincess

01-25-2013, 09:07 AM

You know the worst part is that I was going to stay open later for her alone for the next 2 MONTHS since dad is in the Army (with extra cost of course) but when they signed up it was suppose to be 1 week outta 3 months typa-thing and last sumer it was also a month and a half... and I let it go. Putting up with that little girl's attitude outside my work hours... seriously !!

Plus the mother always has a harder time with her then dad does. She always comes here overwhelmed especially when dad is aways and she must deal with her daughter on her own : YOU WOULD THINK SHE WOULD OF ACCEPTED THE EXTRA HELP AND SUPPORT.

This morning she wanted a kiss before leaving and the daughter says : NO !!! How rude is that :( you accept to start your day with your child rejecting you :O Even if the child is mad for you going to work, thats no reason.

She made excuses that its before at 3 she doesnt know what is going on, she's expressing herself cause doesnt know how else, she's upset she cant stay home with mom ...... HUM I'VE HAD OTHER 3 y.o. and they were not THAT angry inside !!

In this thread there is a argument with parent feeling guilty or more lazy : I THINK ITS BOTH !

Well good luck to her, she will quickly find out that there is NO daycare spaces available anywhere but quite a drive from here !!

It was though approach for a friday morning, I shouldnt have brought it up and waited next week I guess, oh too late now. I will do a fresh start with new comers of course, this is sure a learning experience, just so chitty it affects our fincances, unless by chance I get phone calls A.S.A.P. !!

kidlove

01-25-2013, 09:19 AM

live and learn disney. There is the biggest down fall I have realized of having your own business......someti mes you are great financially and some times down in the dumps....what goes up must come down and vice versa. hold out for a great family cut back a little on expenses and be glad for the good families and kids you have. ;) good luck! and take a relaxing weekend off!

Momof4

01-25-2013, 09:26 AM

We've all had difficult children in our daycares DisneyPrincess. We can't just let them run amok! Rules have to be followed or the inmates will take over the asylum and we'll be the ones who go insane. You have a right to be super angry, you are well rid of this parent and child if they are not on the same page with you for raising a well behaved child and I'm sure you will find a better family.

Now you know something you have to watch out for in your next interview and you've learned a lesson about something you will not tolerate in the future. I learned these lessons too and it certainly made me a better and more honest interviewer. Which helps weed out the families that are going to cause me grief before I even consider signing them on. Sometimes people will fool you but I wish you better luck with the next clients.

Shake it off as best you can and have a great weekend. It's for the best. Envision your days ahead WITHOUT this family and you should feel better.

mom-in-alberta

01-25-2013, 01:14 PM

Aw, Disney; that STINKS and I am so disgusted right now.
As the others have said, do not allow this woman's poor behaviour affect you. She is acting just as badly as the child (huh, wonder where little girl gets it from??).
Have a great weekend, despite this setback!!!

Inspired by Reggio

01-25-2013, 02:10 PM

.....She made excuses that its before at 3 she doesnt know what is going on, she's expressing herself cause doesnt know how else, she's upset she cant stay home with mom ...... HUM I'VE HAD OTHER 3 y.o. and they were not THAT angry inside !! ...

I have had clients in the past who have tried to 'excuse' VERY POOR BEHAVIOR of their child and my response is 'yes I empathize there is always a reason WHY but that is not the point we are discuss here ~ the point is that REGARDLESS OF WHY the behavior being exhibited right here is unacceptable and our goal as caring adults is to help her understand that regardless of being tired, sick, missing her daddy, getting teeth, her sock being crooked, etc etc etc we NEVER hit, yell, scream or act rudely to another human being ... it is our job to teach the child RESILIENCE that yes that sucks but there are socially acceptable ways to deal with it!

Now that said ~ I would never force a child to hug, kiss or show affection to another adult even their parent because well that just sets poor precedent to the message that 'no means no' that we try to instill later in life so to speak that could come back to turn a child into a 'victim' of thinking it is ok for an adult to force physical affection on another :(

However if the child had been RUDE about communicating that they were not in the mood for affection I would have just corrected her choice of words "Wow Sally that is very rude way to talk to mommy ~ if you are needing some space and do not want a hug or kiss you just tell mommy 'no thank you I need some space right now'"and left it at that.

daycarewhisperer

01-25-2013, 02:38 PM

She made excuses that its before at 3 she doesnt know what is going on, she's expressing herself cause doesnt know how else, she's upset she cant stay home with mom ...... HUM I'VE HAD OTHER 3 y.o. and they were not THAT angry inside!

What the Mom needs to GET is that YOU are EXPRESSING yourself. She wants the child to express herself because she doesn't know how else... and that is EXACTLY what you are doing. She's raising her to be an expresser of herself but doesn't want to accept YOU expressing YOURSELF????

The issues isn't whether she EXPRESSES herself it's HOW she expresses herself. You are expressing your feelings in a calm, nice, thoughtful way. The child needs to do the same.

DisneyPrincess

01-25-2013, 09:06 PM

Yes I realized that I should of told her to kiss mommy :( Well in any case, even if I would of said that acting like that was ''hurtfull'' to mommy, mom would of acting the same way : defending her daughter, arguing with me on the action and give her 2 weeks. My husband thinks they probably had it in mind already, since it was so quick to act like that.

The father pick her up and as she was all happy in the daycare, as always, as soon as she crossed the door to see him in the entrance, she pushed him away and didnt want to get dressed. I let it go and will never speak to this to these parents again for the next too weeks. I will still be nice : Hi Bye Have a good day. That is all !!! Father is going away so I wont see him, so he just thanked me for my services and they always appreciated the favors of opening late for them and understanding. That said, I wished him luck.

I have only little girl starting in two weeks, was already planned, and got another request already, fingers crossed !

Case closed... next ;)

Mambia

03-19-2013, 04:28 PM

I have a dcb who is great all day with me, listens well but the minute mom steps on to pickup, wow!!! He turns into a little crazy hooligan while she waits at the door and does nothing to calm him down. He gets so upset and runs off to the point that I can't even control him and wonder why the heck mom doesn't just grab him and take him home!!! What do I do? She doesn't see it as an issue, just thinks he is being silly meanwhile I want to just say "take your kid and leave already" it makes me look bad as a provider because I honestly cannot control this child because he goes nuts!!!! Help

daycaremum

03-20-2013, 11:48 AM

It comes down to bad parenting. No matter what advice or whatever we share with parents, they are still going to do things their own way. They pay us to look after their children while they are away, not teach them how to parent. I have a separate coat room and I escort the child to and from that room at drop offs and pick ups. If a child was tantruming I would intervene and say time to say goodbye, mummy has to go to work and say goodbye and leave the coat room. Parent gets the point. At pick up if child is rude or misbehaving I intervene and say something of the jist, "You're not listening very well, so I'm going back in the house now, see you next day." I leave the coat room , shut the door behind me and let the parent deal with their child. The child has been told, the parent has been shown that I believe they need to get control over their child and I'm not going to waste my time standing around watching. I used to stay in the coat room even when children were misbehaving until I had a mum of twins come back on a Monday and say that when I told the kids to stop misbehaving and get their stuff on and go home like they were asked it upset them so much it was a whole weekend of tantruming and misbehaviour. Yes, she blamed me being firm with the children for their whole weekend!! Crazy!! So from then on I say my piece and then leave the room.