Insurance

[torontokids]

For all those providers with their own children who are you with for coverage. My insurance company just informed me they are counting my own two children in the coverage for 5 kids. I knew this has been a problem for other providers so I had double checked this with them before but now they are saying they were mistaken.

I've been calling around and haven't found a single provider that will cover me for 5 dc kids plus mine. The best I found was TD Melage Monnex and RBC they will do 6 total (4 dc plus my 2). In a past thread a few options were mentioned including AllState, Cooperators but both those companies have stopped covering 5 plus own.

Help!

[Inspired by Reggio]

I am no help Torontokids ~ this topic comes up over and over again and you will get mixed messages about which ones WILL cover the 5 plus your own.

I admit that I have always been surprised when I hear providers that state the Cooperators covered the 5 PLUS because that is who I am with and I was told the same thing you and that was back in 2007 ... home childcare ryders is for 5 children in the program max and that would have including any child of our own under 10 but fortunately for me my stepson turned 10 the year I started home childcare so it was never an issue.

All you can do is keep seeking to find a carrier that is willing to put on your policy that it covers the 5 children PLUS your own .... and as for the others I just really hope for their sake that it is indeed clearly stated on their policy that the insurance ryder covers 5 daycare children PLUS their own children cause I worry for them that should the 'shit hit the fan' in a claim and there is evidence that 7 children were present or what that the carrier will say that the policy is void because the provider had too many children in attendance :(

This is the challenge cause while it is 'legal' to have 5 children plus your own the 'regulated industry' is 5 children including your own because they argue that the 'risk' of incident increases with the more children present and well as insurance carriers are concerned about 'risk' they are going to want to follow what is seen as best practice of the regulated industry ... some insurance carriers will not even cover 5 children they follow other provinces rules and do 3 max!

[playfelt]

Traditionally co-operators and state farm were the two that would insure 5 daycare children but they require you to have at least your house insurance with them as it is a rider. If you plan to use your vehicle you will need auto insurance with them too so they can add a rider. We used to have Allstate but my daycare insurance was with a group policy CCPRN had arranged. When that was no longer an option and we had to start looking on our own the not insuring all 5 was a big issue and that is when we found out these two did do 5.

[BlueRose]

I am with Wawanesa. I have coverage for 5 dck's plus my own 2. When I first talked to them they said they would only cover a total of 5 kids including my own. The second time they said 5 daycare kids plus mine. I got it in writing.

[torontokids]

It's weird Playfelt because I called both Cooperators and Statefarm and both said they don't do it. I have said clearly that I will transfer my home and auto to them.

Can individual brokers make decisions not to insure but another broker through the same insurance company decide to cover it?

[Vtorrance]

I just last month got my insurance with the cooperators. I have 5 plus my own children. I don't know if it makes a difference if you have everything with them and have been a client for awhile. I can't see it being different from broker to broker but what do I know.

[sunnydays]

I have mine through Aviva and they insure 5 kids plus my own. (the borkerage is Wawanesa as Bluerose mentioned...but that is here in Ottawa). Good luck!

[Inspired by Reggio]

...Can individual brokers make decisions not to insure but another broker through the same insurance company decide to cover it?

Seeing as many rules are often open to 'interpretation' in our society I am going to guess YES cause even the interpretation of the Day Nursery Act varies across the Province with some areas being allowed to do things that Ministry Injectors banned in other areas ... an example of that for home care is that in the regulated industry some agencies allow the providers own children over age 6 no longer count in their ratios other agencies make them count their own children right to age 10 just like any other 'school age' child would be counted so you will often see 'banter' back and forth about this rule on boards even though across Ontario they are all working from the 'same' DNA just that some follow the minimum standards and others have made 'additional rules' above the DNA that really are not DNA rules but 'agency rules'.

Same things happens with CRA and a provider will call and get one employee who says yes sure you can do that and another provider calls and gets a different person who says 'nope you cannot write that off'.

This is why I always advocate get it CLEARLY IN WRITING when someone tells you that you can do something in your business that is that sort of 'grey' thing but will bite you in the ass if you do it wrong.

[playfelt]

It depends what you are asking for and what the broker understands. There is always an issue of what the word "business" means in the sense that home insurance is different than business insurance. You are not a daycare centre and sometimes they interpret it as that. I would just keep calling their call centre for info knowing you will likely get a different person each time. When you get the answer you like, get the name of the person giving that info and then approach your local branch with the info.

I just find it hard that they can turn around and say they won't cover what is legally allowed in Ontario and be able to get away with it.