Birthday Idea for a Mom

[apples and bananas]

So Dad drops off his 3 yr old this am and says "now, if you have a chance, make sure you make a nice card for mommy's bday" LOL hint hint!

I'm good with making a card, and will actually have a lighter load today and would like to do something nice for mom. Any suggestions on a one day quick throw together birthday present craft?

[mimi]

dye some large pasta shells with rubbing alcohol and food colouring and make a necklace for Mom. It dries quick and is pretty.
on the card put glue in a star shape and put glitter on it. You can also go on pinterest for some craft ideas. It is my go to place for ideas.:)

[Momof4]

Haha, I had a Mom say that to me about a Dad's bd and could the child make a card for him? I said that we had a busy day planned but we would try. I'm sorry but I forgot! Really! But I thought of it a few days later and I was glad I forgot because that's the Mom's job, not mine. That's my opinion. I plan my days around all 5 children and our daycare activities. I can't cater to special requests I'm afraid.

[sunnydays]

I would be the same as Momof4! I wouldn't take that kind of hinting kindly. As if we can just drop everything and make a card for a parent because the dad or mom couldn't be bothered to do it themselves. With kids this young, we end up doing most of the work! I help the kids make gifts for parents on special occassions such as Mother's Day, but I would not get into making gifts or cards fpor individual parents' birthdays...not only is it disruptive to our day, but it wouldn't be fair. Guaranteed all of the other kids would want to make one too...and then I would have to find out the birthday's for all parents (that would be 10 in total, assuming 2 parents per kid...not even thinking of blended families etc)...that would be a lot of gifts/cards to make! I don't do special things for one family over another.

[Monday 2 Friday Mama]

dye some large pasta shells with rubbing alcohol and food colouring and make a necklace for Mom. It dries quick and is pretty.
on the card put glue in a star shape and put glitter on it. You can also go on pinterest for some craft ideas. It is my go to place for ideas.:) I love this idea Mimi - if you don't mind me asking, how much alcohol should I be adding to the pasta/food colouring mix ?

[Judy Trickett]

Haha, I had a Mom say that to me about a Dad's bd and could the child make a card for him? I said that we had a busy day planned but we would try. I'm sorry but I forgot! Really! But I thought of it a few days later and I was glad I forgot because that's the Mom's job, not mine. That's my opinion. I plan my days around all 5 children and our daycare activities. I can't cater to special requests I'm afraid.


Ya, gotta agree there. It is not MY job to ensure that a parent has a birthday card. That is the responsibility of the OTHER parent or significant other. Parents need to learn that we simply can not live up to the dictates of FIVE different families. It's not possible.

Parents also need to stop off-sourcing their parental responsibilities. We are daycare providers - NOT personal assistants or nannies.

[apples and bananas]

Ok, seriously... it's a card for mom on her birthday. I think it's a nice thing to do. And quite frankly and honestly I asked for some quick ideas not to start a battle of parent responsibilities vs. caregiver responsibilities.

I certainly did not get offended that the dad asked for this. I am not the kind of caregiver that plans everyones day to the second and my parents like that about me. I keep with a general schedule so the kids know what's coming next. I don't see the issue in changing up this one childs craft to help hiim with a card for his mom.

I do not consider this request an insult... or a suggestion that I am an "assistant" or a "nanny" I'm a caregiver. That requires me to CARE for the kids. And if I can't switch up a craft on short notice to include a simple card then I'm not much of a care giver. And if I automatically jump to the conclusion that the parent is "using" me to do their job then I'm not a very nice person either.

So, if anyone would like to give me some positive advise on a quick craft then that would be great.

[Judy Trickett]

Ok, seriously... it's a card for mom on her birthday. I think it's a nice thing to do. And quite frankly and honestly I asked for some quick ideas not to start a battle of parent responsibilities vs. caregiver responsibilities.

I certainly did not get offended that the dad asked for this. I am not the kind of caregiver that plans everyones day to the second and my parents like that about me. I keep with a general schedule so the kids know what's coming next. I don't see the issue in changing up this one childs craft to help hiim with a card for his mom.

I do not consider this request an insult... or a suggestion that I am an "assistant" or a "nanny" I'm a caregiver. That requires me to CARE for the kids. And if I can't switch up a craft on short notice to include a simple card then I'm not much of a care giver. And if I automatically jump to the conclusion that the parent is "using" me to do their job then I'm not a very nice person either.

So, if anyone would like to give me some positive advise on a quick craft then that would be great.

Oh, sorry. I mistakenly thought this was an open forum were we could freely comment. :rolleyes:

[apples and bananas]

Oh, sorry. I mistakenly thought this was an open forum were we could freely comment. :rolleyes:

Judy, I in no way said that you couldn't comment. I also thought that this was a forum where we came for assistance and advise. What you gave was niether. And I didn't ask for your opinion on what I was doing. I'm sure your filled with great crafting ideas! However, you chose to critisize what I was doing instead of add anything positive to it.

I am getting really tired of reading all of this negativity on the forum. Either support or lend something positive as a solution.

[mimi]

Monday 2 Friday Mama, I put the pasta shells in a sandwich ziplock bag. I start with a tbsp and add a few drops of food colouring. I may add more r/a and f/c as needed till the pasta is coloured. It does smell at first, but it quickly dries.

I also agree with apples and banana's. Wether I would do this for a parent was not what she asked. She just wanted some quick craft ideas.:)

[apples and bananas]

This is a great idea mimi, and I've done it before, it works wonderfully and is great for this age group. But... I don't have the right pasta in the house. :(

I've got some great ideas started this morning and will finish them after nap time.

Thanks again to all that gave ideas.

[Bugaboo]

OK really A&B, you jump down PP's throats for being negative yet the only post here being negative is yours. You asked for opinions on a quick craft and you got some ideas. You also got a different perspective from a few other providers about their take on the situation. Because those providers dared to have an idea or an opinion that was different from yours, you are jumping down their throats. Make the craft if you want too. But don't start a thread and get your panties in a wad because someone has a different opinion than yours.

[apples and bananas]

OK really A&B, you jump down PP's throats for being negative yet the only post here being negative is yours. You asked for opinions on a quick craft and you got some ideas. You also got a different perspective from a few other providers about their take on the situation. Because those providers dared to have an idea or an opinion that was different from yours, you are jumping down their throats. Make the craft if you want too. But don't start a thread and get your panties in a wad because someone has a different opinion than yours.

I don't think I jumped down anyones throat and I'm sorry if I've offended you in a thread that you weren't involved in in the first place. Opinons were made, that I don't agree with. There for I made an opinion back... I have that right as well. Then a sarcastic comment was made and eyes were rolled. It would have been a good opportunity to discuss the opinions and maybe convince me otherwise. But nope... just rolled eyes.

My point is very simple. I asked for ideas. I didn't ask what people thought about doing crafts for parents birthdays. Opinions that were offered made me feel that they were judging me, or I was doing something wrong in their eyes. I think I have the right to defend that.

I am all for different opinions. However, Only ones that are asked for or are relevant to the post. When someone changes the thread like this to voice their opinion they throw everyone off track and suddenly I don't get what I'm asking for anymore. Someone even went to the point of PM'ing me some great ideas as they didn't want to get wrapped up in the negativity of the thread. How many others have great ideas that they didn't bother posting because it's taken a left turn.

I'm just asking for people to be helpful. I could care less if someone thinks I'm wrong. I just wanted some fresh ideas... I get a lot of negative opinions.

[Judy Trickett]

Oh, please, Apples and Bananas........

Such is the way forums go. If no one ever gave an differing opinion or some insight from the other side of a situation we would never learn anything from one another. Lord knows there are literally millions of forum posts on the internet where in people piped in in such a fashion. That's the way the internet works. And that is also how we learn from one another.

If you don't want differing opinions then use a search engine - that's what they are good for. I am pretty certain there are a gazillion card making sites out there.

I'm done with this discussion. I can't spar with you, it's an unfair fight because I don't have a Unicorn horn coming out of my head. Yes, I clearly suck............:rol leyes: Oh, there's that eye roll again.....sigh....da mn roving eye......

[mumstheword]

Well I'm gonna pipe in here, even though I am not agreeing or adding anything positive...

I also had a Dad tell me recently that it was his wife's birthday on the Monday. This was on a Friday. He said, to the child, make sure you ask if you can make a birthday card for Mommy at craft time today. This bugged me! First of all, I don't like when parents talk to ME through their child. It's weird and sneaky. Just come out and talk to ME. Secondly, i am not responsible for your wife's birthday card, you have the entire weekend to make one with your daughter yourself. Thirdly, we don't necessarily do a craft every single day. The child was too young to make it anyway so really it would have been ME making it. I do not want to make cards for every Mommy or Daddy's birthday.

I AM a nice person. I do all kinds of really awesome things for my dck's and their families.

And to say that if I don't make someone's wife a birthday card then I'm not much of a caregiver, is ludicrous.

What was the purpose of this thread anyway?...you can't just make a card without suggestions? You don't have enough ideas as a provider? It's a card for crying out loud.

[mimi]

You are right mumstheword, you didn't add anything positive though I do agree being asked through the child isn't the right way to go about it. If I wouldn't be asked personally, I wouldn't do it.
ALSO, there is nothing wrong with asking for new ideas, cut some slack o.k.?

[sunnydays]

Personally, I don't think that those of us who offered an opinion on this were being negative, nor were we trying to hijack the thread. I think, others, like me thought maybe we could offer a perspective that might be a bit different from the OP in the light of sharing our ways of doing things. Nobody said you couldn't make a card if you want to...nobody criticized you for doing so. This thread as many others simply offered an opportunity to share ideas. Sorry if they were not the ideas you wanted. With this forum, as in any other, I take what I like and leave what I don't.

[torontokids]

whoah, too much drama today. Let's all move on, shall we?

[apples and bananas]

Yes please, let's move on.

I asked for craft ideas, not card ideas... I'm quite capable to assist a 3 yr old in making a card. I thought we'd do a little extra and I was looking for fresh ideas. I got bombarded with opinions on parents roles vs providers roles.

Mumstheword... yes, I agree... you have added nothing positive or constructive to this feed at all.

Judy... I'm not sure what a unicorn has to do with it.

I didn't ask what anyone thought about what I was doing... i asked for craft suggestions. Not sure how I could have reworded it to get a different response then what I got.

Sunnydays, I didn't think you were being negative either.. which is why I didn't feel the need to address your post.

And to those of you who chose to pm me, thank you, I appreciate your positive ideas and I have used them today. It's too bad the feed went this way and no one else will be able to enjoy those same ideas. This was a thread meant to gain information, not opinions.

[momofnerds]

I have a art caddy with 3 drawers. In it, it has envelopes, paper, stickers, card fronts (I save all card fronts and ask parents for them to) the crayons stay on my table always, so the kids make their own cards and decorate it their way. I have a dcg who loves to make letters and cards for her family and yesterday she made me one too.

while I don't mind doing cards, I can't gaurentee that I'll be able to do one. Some days (like yesterday) are so crazy that by nap time I'm wiped out. He shouldn't have put you on the spot like this and I think if they did the project together it would have ment more.

I have a bin of beads and I always have pipe cleaners (thank you yard sales) and you can make a bracelet.

[momofnerds]

a bookmark
frame
necklace out of cereal
paper purse
something to hang off of her mirror in her car
something to hang on her keys
bake something, I know this would be a big hit! (heck I would like it if someone made dinner lol!)

[Momof4]

Well, I was the first one on this thread to say I wouldn't have the time or inclination to make something for a parent's birthday. We make tons of stuff for the parents for Mother's & Father's Days and for Christmas. But one poster somewhere on the thread mentioned that if you do this for one Mom you will have to do if for 10 or more and I agree. I treat all my children fairly and I treat all my families fairly so if I were you and made the craft today I would be setting a precedent for myself that I would have to continue so I felt that I was being fair to everyone.

That was my original opinion, didn't mean to start a big debate, but I also found out the hard way with my very first clients that if you agree to do a favour one time you start a snowball effect and they ask for more and more favours. I was concerned you were opening a big can of worms for yourself, hence my original comments on page 1, ok? No Drama Here!!!

[KellyP]

Judy... I'm not sure what a unicorn has to do with it.



Unicorn Provider

http://www.urbandictionary. com/define.php?term=unic orn+provider

[Momof4]

:laugh: That's hilarious!

[apples and bananas]

Wow! Once again, I didn't ask for opinions, I didn't ask to be judged. I asked for some craft ideas. We all run our business's differently. Different parents look for different things. Thank you for clarifying what Judy's off handed comment refered to. It's unfortunate that she throws her opinions out there, but is not will to debate anything.

I'm not here to defend my business or how I run my dayhome.

however, I will tell all of you that I agree... I don't think it's our job to do a craft or card for a bday. I think it is much better when dad sits down with the kids to complete the work. I also agree that I don't think it's right to "speak through the child". I find it underhanded and sneaky too.

But...

I like to help people out when I can. As I said in my origional post... I had a slow day today. I was excited to do something above and beyond for someone else. You know... you hear about people doing things like buying the person behind them in the tim's drive through a coffee. Do they buy everyone behind them a coffee? Does the person 3 cars back get upset that their coffee wasn't paid for?

It's not like I'm putting up a sign on my front lawn "WILL MAKE CARDS FOR MOM"S BDAY" It's not like the 3 year old told the 2 year old and the 2 year old went home and told mom the unfair thing the provider did today

I appreciate those of you who had feedback, and backed it up. I would have much prefered if it came with a clever craft idea as that's what I origionaly asked for.

[Judy Trickett]

Wow! Once again, I didn't ask for opinions, I didn't ask to be judged. I asked for some craft ideas. We all run our business's differently. Different parents look for different things. Thank you for clarifying what Judy's off handed comment refered to. It's unfortunate that she throws her opinions out there, but is not will to debate anything.



I find the fact that you think I don't debate anything laughable. I think that if people here were honest they would say I do plenty of debate. The problem is whenever you truly debate anything someone always runs off crying that I was too harsh or too mean. Seriously, sooooo over that.

Okay, you want a debate? HERE IS WHY I WON'T MAKE A CARD.........


Daycare has always been a minimum wage job (or very close to minimum wage). It doesn't matter if you did in home daycare in 1970, 1980, 1990 or 2000. If you break it down, after you pay out expenses, considering you are FULL all the time you are still earning minimum wage or less.

Now, I also realize that Tim Horton's has always been a minimum wage job. So, has McDonald's, most retail and many other jobs. BUT, back in 1970, while earning minimum wage the Tim Horton's worker or McDonald's worker sold donuts, hamburgers and coffee. It is essentially the SAME job they do now. They are earning the SAME wage (minimum wage) to do the same job. In essence, their job responsibilities in 1970 still match the job responsibilities and the proportionate wage that they do today. NOTHING has changed for the Timmie's or McDonald's worker in over 30 years.

BUT, take the daycare worker, babysitter, it doesn't matter what you call her, and it HAS changed for her. In the 1970's the babysitter kept kids fed, let them run around in the back yard all day or even had them sit in front of the TV. Parents were happy to have a happy, alive kid upon return from work. In the 1980s came the boom of 'early childhood education" and that same babysitter was now expected to follow a few government rules and offer a little bit of the alphabet and basic numbers. TV was starting to become "bad" for kids to watch all day. Then came the 1990s and now all kids needed to be wearing sunscreen all day, not be in the direct sun more than a few hours, TV was the "bad" babysitter, and they were expected to follow a curriculum and TEACH kids things during the day. Then came the 2000s and then suddenly every child expert said that not only were kids NOT to be in front of the TV all day, wear sunscreen, be fed three times a day in a nine hour period, but they were also to be "emotionally developed" through NO discipline and stupid shit like time-outs, gentle voices, a hands -off policy to discipline. And on top of that we were to make sure they are kindergarten ready. There was to be no plastic toys, God-forbid a kid lick something and die from BPA exposure , cloth diapered, be outside no less than an hour a day, have an ECE credited provider. AND, of course, during all of these years and with increased responsibility and more WORK for the provider the wage did not change. The provider in the 1970s was making minimum wage just the same as the provider in 2000 with a LOAD more that was expected of her.

My point is......WHERE DOES IT END??? If you ask a certain segment of the working population to keep giving and giving and pile more on their plates but never financially reward them then OF COURSE there are gonna be rogue providers who stand up and finally say ENOUGH!!!!!

I won't make a freaking birthday card for a parent because I already do ENOUGH. When does it end? Today it is the card. Tomorrow it will be something more. And every time a provider says that those "rogue" providers are bitter or mean or lazy or confrontational about making something like a card it sets back any progress the daycare profession has made. When a provider steps into the camp WITH the parents it makes our jobs harder. I am not saying this is an "us against them" situation. I don't think that at all. But from a SOCIETAL view the proof is in the pudding - we ARE and HAVE BEEN expected to do more, take on more responsibility and no one has ever stood up and say that for that additional work we should be paid more. No one can refute that point - it's fact. We still make the SAME income, proportionately, that we did 40 years ago.

I really do NOT understand why providers do not SEE this! It's not rocket science. So, YES, it pisses me off when providers come on and poo-bah a few providers who stand up and say "that is not my JOB". And it makes me angry that a parent would pile more on our plates.

Where does it end?

If providers want to be respected and seen as professionals then THEY have to do the work to make that happen. The provider has to stand up and say NO to a parent. We don't have to be mean about it. We can do it kindly and professionally but it still needs to be done. We are not babysitters or nannies. We are not a parent's personal assistant. We do IMPORTANT work and we deserve to be respected for it. And, sorry, but being asked to do, yet another, job that is a parental (or, in this case, spousal) responsibility reeks of the disrespect we see in this profession. I would NEVER ask a child's teacher to make sure she took time out of her teaching day to ensure my kid made a birthday card. So why do we ask a dcprovider? And, furthermore that teacher would look at you like you had two heads. But, oh, no, the provider just does it.

Where does it end?

[momofnerds]

well today I'm going to be a unicorn provider because today dcg came in and told me it was her daddys birthday so we are going to make a card and a craft.

[momofnerds]

judy, you seem so bitter and so angry about your job and the children and parents that you work with that maybe you need to hang up your wipes and go do something else. Relax, its just a card its not rocket science, *I* love doing arts and crafts with my kids, even with my own kids that its nothing to make a card. The poster was looking for ideas, why haven't you posted any ideas, instead you critized her from making a craft with a child, would it have been different if they made the craft first and then the child said that its for her dad's birthday????

[mimi]

If I would help the child make a card for the parent, I do it for the child, not the parent. They are so proud of their craft/card and are very excited to give it to their parent. It is for the child's benefit.

[KellyP]

I agree with what judy said. I think there are way too many providers out there who go that extra mile because they just loooove kids and dreamed of being a caregiver from birth :rolleyes: and then those same providers who go out of their way to include a daycare family into their lives and love them like their own are the same providers who complain about being disrespected and treated poorly by the very families they went the extra mile for.

It just makes no sense to me. I personally went into this field because I wanted to make money while being home with my own kids. I certainly didn't want to be someone's personal assistant/servant/nanny.

If someone wants to go that extra mile, then by all means do so but it sure makes it sucky then for the rest of us who want to work in a capacity that includes alot more respect and professionalism.

Maybe this is the time where "child care provider" shouldn't be a titled used for all the different type of providers out there.

I consider myself a child care provider. Meaning I provide "CARE" (and only care) to the child. I don't perform or agree to do any of the tasks that some consider parental responsibilities. Maybe those providers who do go that extra mile, should be called "Family Care Providers." Atleast that way people can differentiate between the different types of care givers out there.

[KellyP]

I also think that just because a poster asked for ideas doesn't mean that the entire thread HAS to stay on the path....why can't discussions be discussions without leading to debates and arguments?

Every internet forum I have been on, has threads that start on one subject and end with another. I kind of like how that happens. I think it is good conversation. It is also a great learning tool for those of us just starting out in this field. It is great to see the different perspectives from different types of providers.

[sunnydays]

I don't think Judy is angry or bitter or a bad daycare provider. I think she is realistic, experienced and intelligent! I have never met her in person nor have I seen her daycare, but I would be willing to bet that she runs a fantastic daycare with which parents and kids alike are very satisfied. And I think she brings wisdom to this forum that is much needed. You don't have to agree with her or anyone else (I have had myself a good debate with Judy in the past about subsidies...didn't agree with her, but I certainly respected her opinions and experience as I do now). My point is, debate is not about being right or wrong, it's about having an open and honest conversation about things and possibly seeing things in a slightly different way at the end of it if you open your mind to it. It does not mean you have to accept everything Judy or anyone else says, but can we not at least think about it and come to our own opinions (which should be ever evolving as our knowledge and experience increases)? I also get frustrated sometimes when I see providers bending over backwards (I am not talking about the card necessarily) or lowering rates, not charging for stats or vacations, etc etc. Why? Because it lowers the bar for all of us. If everyone charges for stats, parents will have nowhere to go where they can get these days for free and they will much more readily accept that they have to pay them...it becomes the norm. Same goes for providers vacations, sick days, etc. When one or several providers decide to undercut others, it makes it harder for everyone. I am not saying we all have to be the same, but I am just responding (and agreeing) to what Judy has said about giving more and getting the same. I know we have now completely hijacked this thread and I apologize for that. I realize the OP intention was to get some craft ideas, not start a debate and I do respect that, but can't help wading further into the murk at this point.

[apples and bananas]

I appreciate your point of view Judy. I agree with you to a point. I think if I offer something like... you don't pay for stats, I'm setting a new standard for the community. So when that client goes to the next provider and they charge for stats, they don't understand why. I'm raising the clients expectation. If I make a card then the next provider looks like they don't care because I did it and they don't feel they have to. I'm raising the expectations of the proffesion by offering more then what someone else feels is "there job".

I spent an hour last night price matching with 5 different grocery flyers in prep to do my shopping this week. So, if the superstore offers price matching, I go there to shop. And I take all of the cheap no frills and basics prices with me. But at the end of the day, The Superstore gets my business. Basics can be as ticked off as they'd like, they're just advertising for another store in my opinion.

I think it's called being competitive. I do these things for my clients and my kids because it keeps me competitive. It's a small thing that means a lot. My clients will stay with me because I do these extras and they will recommend me because I do these extras.

In response to your tim hortons/mcdonalds analogy. Things have changed. They work much harder to maintain that client and be competitive. Now they have starbucks, coffee cultures, fancier coffee's, latte's. Mcdonalds has harveys and wendy's along with the effort to stay healthy, combat new fast food trends like sushi etc. They have had to educate themselves because they're not just selling burgers and donuts anymore. Just like we've had to educate because clients expect more then free play and tv time.

So, I choose to stay competitive. I choose to LOVE my job and what I do. And I choose to come onto forums like this to gain advise, support and other views.

I appreciate your view Judy, I think it's a horribly negative way to look at life and our carreer choice, but I appreciate it just the same.

[apples and bananas]

And BTW, I agree... sometimes threads do take a left turn. In this case it diverted the entire reason for the post. Maybe it would have been a good opportunity for someone to start a thread regarding opinions on going the extra mile rather then to throw your 2 cents in here with complete disregard to what the topic was to begin with.

[dodge__driver11]

Ding its my turn..... LOL.

I had a horrible first 6-8 months doing daycare...And here are some of the reasons why.

People in my building called early learning on me ALL THE TIME!! So did other providers in my community, I cried, I whinced, I worried and I wondered why. But you know what? As soon as I stopped worrying about people's thoughts on me being a wheelchair user...Suddenly my stress level went down and they haven't been here in a long time, hell you know what I have even had a lady call CAS on me (in my building) because she was worried for my son...Well guess what? They found nothing and the social workers who came said "sorry for bothering you" and the report has been shredded and nothing came of it. (that's what the social workers told me happens when no concerns are noted)

I used to post and post on here about how down in the dumps I was about how people just weren't coming. I lowered my rates, made myself work crazy hours, all because I WANTED THOSE FAMILIES so damned badly, and guess what it got me? Sub par familes who didn't give two s*i&s about the policies I wrote, my rates, or paying me what I deserved and what was fair for the subdivision.

I now offer contracted hours, get my fees on time, and have a great set of families (until I relocate) one family signed on to come with me when I move. I no longer work hours that intrude on my family..any overtime is offered at a premium fee...I chose to focus on the things I could offer like my ECE training exp. my job in the school system etc.

I know I made a boo boo when announcing that I was moving but it was a bit hard to hide considering things were disappearing off the wall and out of the house.

Anyway...The reason I am posting this is because I WANT EVERYONE READING THIS THREAD including YOU TO KNOW that going above and beyond always leads TO SOMETHING MORE AND RAISED EXPECTATIONS OF GETTING SOMETHING EXTRA FOR LESS.

Would I do a card for a family? Perhaps... If it was not implied that I HAD TO DO IT. But I would also say something to the parent like " Don't you think that you and "Jonny" should have done it together he would have been so happy to work with you!"

[bright sparks]

Here is what I would do...

I personally think that it was to much and rather rude of the dad to make a snidey comment to their child at the door, rather than having the balls to ask you to your face if you'd mind. He knows he's pushing his look and asking more from you than he should. That being said, it is a request easily granted in a few minutes at very little cost. But, to prevent this particular family from taking advantage of you in the future due to your good nature, but also avoiding them thinking you are cold and caluss for not doing something which to them seems to be a small request, this is what I would do.

I would get this child up from nap just 5 minutes early and let them choose some different craft materials from your supplies and but them into a brown paper bag or zippy. I'd let them pick everything from tissue paper scraps, to buttons and die cuts etc I would include in the bag a folded piece of construction paper for the card. When Dad picks up, I would hand it to him and say, little Joey put this bag of craft supplies together to make a card for mums birthday. I would quite clearly say to Dad, I had all my activities planned for the day and thought it more appropriate and meaningful if you made the card with your child. Not only will this be a better experience for you, but it will also put you in the good books with your wife.

It's showing that you care about the child and family, but that you can not and will not change your days plans to accommodate an activity which is his role not yours. If he says he doesn't have time, I would even push it so far as to tell him it will only take 5 minutes with his child to make and that it will be worth the effort. I bet he'll never make some snide request like that again lol.

[ladyjbug]

OP, you do realize this is a PUBLIC forum, right? That means providers AND parents have access to it. Therefore if you post something that is not in the normal range for parental requests, some providers will feel the need to say that some of us would be offended by a request like that, especially in the passive aggressive way it was delivered by asking THROUGH the child. It is not negative to state an opinion on that and what it can allude to.

What was negative was this particular quote, posted by YOU:
I'm a caregiver. That requires me to CARE for the kids. And if I can't switch up a craft on short notice to include a simple card then I'm not much of a care giver. And if I automatically jump to the conclusion that the parent is "using" me to do their job then I'm not a very nice person either.

The assumptions that you made that those who choose not to do special for their families make them “not much of a caregiver” and “not very nice people” are very insulting to those of us who work very hard and just choose to run their business a bit differently. THAT is where your thread got nasty. You set the tone of the thread and a precedent by posting that expectation on a site where both providers and parents can read it and set their OWN expectations for their caregivers. The other posters are right to call you out on that.

For what it’s worth, if your post was truly just about wanting craft ideas and only input for craft ideas, why even add the reason or the manner/tone it was asked (i.e. HINT HINT)? It’s not needed if you just want craft ideas for a birthday. So, I am guessing you weren’t totally over the moon with the way you were asked either and that’s why that’s in there. Don’t jump on others for picking up on that.

[Artsand crafts]

A very creative way to be firm and avoid people taking advantage and still looking profesional. Thank you for your comment, Bright sparks!

[apples and bananas]

For what it’s worth, if your post was truly just about wanting craft ideas and only input for craft ideas, why even add the reason or the manner/tone it was asked (i.e. HINT HINT)? It’s not needed if you just want craft ideas for a birthday. So, I am guessing you weren’t totally over the moon with the way you were asked either and that’s why that’s in there. Don’t jump on others for picking up on that.

I have to wonder if people are reading all of the comments in the thread before posting their comments. I have said several times that I agree that it was sneaky in the way it was asked. I didn't agree with what was being asked... however... that's not why I created the post.

apparently my opinions are not ok but everyone elses are? I posted my opinions just as everyone else did.

[Bugaboo]

Wow ladies. I honestly feel really sorry for some of you. I really do. A&B, I think Judy's argument is coming from a place of genuine concern for you-- even if you don't read it that way. When some of us read your original post, it sounded like that parent was sort of ordering you to make a craft through his child. It rubbed me, and clearly some others the wrong way. Maybe you didn't take it that way and maybe the parent didn't mean it that way, we don't know, we weren't there. I'm going to go out on limb and assume that you, like most of us, plan your day. I bet you had yesterday more or less mapped out. You spent time (probably your free time) organizing your meals and your activities. It bothered me that a parent would come in and say to you (albeit through his child, which in itself is childish) to make a card/craft for his wife. That undermines YOU. You probably had a lovely day planned for your kids but this parent didn't acknowledge that. He made an assumption that he could throw yet another responsibility at you. I think a craft for mom's birthday is a lovely gesture that would be even better coming from the joint effort of father and child bonding time, not because you were given more work to do. This parent did what he did because he knew he could get away with it. He knew you would do it. If it doesn't make you feel taken advantage of then fine, all is well in your world. I know if a parent said that to me, I would be hurt. Hurt, that the day I planned was somehow not good enough or that I was already doing was not enough. I also know that the group of parents I have now would not ask me what this parent asked of you. Not because I don't care, not because I don't love my day care kids, but because they respect my the running of my day home. I felt like this particular parent was not respecting you and that is why I can see why Judy and the others are posting what they are posting.

[KingstonMom]

To avoid all the drama and get to your original question, I lilke some of the craft ideas here and I actually JUST made the pasta necklaces yesterday! All the kids loved them, we worked on patterns and putting them in order of colour etc. A great hit! The bookmark idea sounds simple and nice too!

As a "unicorn provider" I have had a mom drop off her daughter and say to her: "remember, after daycare, we are going to Aunt Shelley's birthday dinner!". Well, I helped the little girl make a birthday card for her Aunt Shelley. It was a simple, thoughtful gesture and mom appreciated it. I really would have no problem making a card for Mommy or Daddy, even if it was told to me thru the child as previously mentioned.
I dont agree that if we do it for one family, we need to do it for them all. I dont record parents birthdays, so they probably wont get one year after year!

The only time this would tick me off is if a parent said "its Mommys birthday, could you please something up for her? thanks" hahaha I think I would immediately be too busy to accomodate then. Them "hinting" to maybe if we had time etc, then I'm sure I can whip something up quite quickly!
Especially if it was the dad who asked, he is probably alot like my husband and I literally need to pull out the paper, glue, markers, glitter etc for him to sit down and help my son make ME a birthday card! Hopeless lol

Sorry you got the sidetracked opinions not about what you were originally asking about.
I always think twice about posting threads because of the criticism that goes along with it.

[apples and bananas]

I see it differently. I didn't get offended. I thought it was cute and I saw it as an opportunity to wow mom. I took it as a compliment. This father knows that I have a great connection with his son. And I didn't tell him i would do it, I told him that we would do our best to make some time for that. I do have a structured day. I also understand that they're kids. Structure sometimes turns into flexability.

I think it's very clear that Judy specificially (because she's the only one that gave this side of the argument) wasn't concerned about me being taken advantage of. Her point was clear that by doing this I set a standard for all providers.

And maybe that's ok. Maybe we all need to re look at our day. And try to find time for the little things. I do this because I love it. I get to stay home with my own children (which I don't always love btw) and I get to be part of developing some other amazing kids. I choose the families I want to work with and am not afraid to dismiss the ones I don't. I don't do it as a money maker. It's not... we all know that.

All of my families treat me very well. So for one of them to make an inocent comment about a card is not even something that makes me think twice. As a matter of fact, I wish I knew all of their birthdays, because they make it a point to know mine, and my childrens. And the look on that little guys face when he gave his card to his mom was awesome! How can that be a bad thing?

I don't spend my free time planning. I have free play planned into my day and I spend that time working on what's next. I believe in a 9 hr day. I do very llittle between the time daycare closes and the time it opens. I don't even do the dishes on Friday night, that's my full night off of everything.

My issue with this thread and those who commented is very simple. It was a request for craft ideas. If you were interested in looking for others opinions on parents asking us to go above and beyond then it should have been a new thread. I understand sometimes threads take a wrong turn. The turn this one made stopped those who probably had great ideas from posting them.

Comments started very hard and fast and they felt accusing to me too. Taking a simple card request and making into a debate of how much we do in a day.

You are all wonderful providers I'm sure... and for those who didn't offer craft ideas, it's unfortunate that you immediately went on the defensive instead helping a fellow provider out.

[ladyjbug]

I have to wonder if people are reading all of the comments in the thread before posting their comments. I have said several times that I agree that it was sneaky in the way it was asked. I didn't agree with what was being asked... however... that's not why I created the post.

apparently my opinions are not ok but everyone elses are? I posted my opinions just as everyone else did.

Oh, I did read your posts. I thought I had summarized them quite nicely based on the first one setting the tone, but no problem, happy to address a few more of your opinions. Here are some other gems and how I interpreted them:

“I don't think I jumped down anyones throat and I'm sorry if I've offended you in a thread that you weren't involved in in the first place. Opinons were made, that I don't agree with. There for I made an opinion back... I have that right as well. “ -That opinion set the tone for your THREAD!

“My point is very simple. I asked for ideas. I didn't ask what people thought about doing crafts for parents birthdays. Opinions that were offered made me feel that they were judging me, or I was doing something wrong in their eyes. I think I have the right to defend that.” Meh. People have the right to post that they don’t think that’s right. As I stated before, if you were TRULY looking only for craft ideas, you wouldn’t need to post about the manner it was asked. Like I said, PUBLIC FORUM, setting a precedent, etc.

“I am all for different opinions. However, Only ones that are asked for or are relevant to the post.” This one made me laugh right out loud. I have already mentioned that these providers have the right to comment on a public forum when you are setting a precedent for other providers. They have the right to not agree with you.

“I'm just asking for people to be helpful. I could care less if someone thinks I'm wrong. I just wanted some fresh ideas... I get a lot of negative opinions. Yes please, let's move on.” Once again, the first negative post was from YOU. The providers are allowed to defend their position. Note the "move on" comment...it be important in just a bit.

“Wow! Once again, I didn't ask for opinions, I didn't ask to be judged. I asked for some craft ideas. We all run our business's differently. Different parents look for different things.” You are posting on a public forum. If you are posting on a public forum, then you take what you get. These providers have every right to defend their businesses and the way they are running them.

“ Thank you for clarifying what Judy's off handed comment refered to. It's unfortunate that she throws her opinions out there, but is not will to debate anything.” Apparently you didn’t want to “move on” as you are clearly GOADING Judy into a response.

“I'm not here to defend my business or how I run my dayhome.” But in your earlier quote, you said you had every right to defend yourself. So, what is it? If you didn't want to defend it and felt you had nothing to defend then you could have left it and not answered the posters you didn't agree with.

“however, I will tell all of you that I agree... I don't think it's our job to do a craft or card for a bday. I think it is much better when dad sits down with the kids to complete the work. I also agree that I don't think it's right to "speak through the child". I find it underhanded and sneaky too.” So it took a multitude of posts to FINALLY get around to what most of us had already guessed- you weren’t happy about the way you were asked. It took you until about page 3 to admit it.

“It's not like I'm putting up a sign on my front lawn "WILL MAKE CARDS FOR MOM"S BDAY" It's not like the 3 year old told the 2 year old and the 2 year old went home and told mom the unfair thing the provider did today” – It IS like you are putting up a sign because you are posting on a PUBLIC FORUM-that providers and parents can read and set their own expectations.

I think it's called being competitive. I do these things for my clients and my kids because it keeps me competitive. It's a small thing that means a lot. My clients will stay with me because I do these extras and they will recommend me because I do these extras.
So, I choose to stay competitive. I choose to LOVE my job and what I do. And I choose to come onto forums like this to gain advise, support and other views.”
So basically, you do understand why people are mad at you. Judy is right on. You are setting a precedent for other providers and you don’t care about that. And you don’t really care about doing these things like a “good caregiver” would, for caring for the children, you do it because it keeps you competitive. Glad you are contradicting yourself right, left and centre. Right on, cool. Get it.

“I appreciate your view Judy, I think it's a horribly negative way to look at life and our carreer choice, but I appreciate it just the same.” Patronizing much?

“I didn't ask what anyone thought about what I was doing... i asked for craft suggestions. Not sure how I could have reworded it to get a different response then what I got.” – Like I said, if you TRULY just wanted craft suggestions, you don’t mention the manner in which it was asked. You could say “Hey, does anyone have any great suggestions for a craft? One of my DCKs’ parents has a birthday today and wants to surprise them!” Not “My client asked THROUGH his child to make a birthday card for his mother, hint hint”

Aggh. I am pretty sure that I didn't get through to you, or any of the others calling names. But yes, people that are proud of their businesses will continue to post when they believe a provider is being demeaned, especially when it is a public forum and will set a precedent for other providers. I think your parent's request, especially the manner it was delivered in, was out of line. If you think it's fine, then cool. Do it! But don't advertise it as the norm and demean other providers in the process, and THEN play victim. I think you probably could have found a number of awesome crafts and did them in the time it took to write nasty responses to everyone who didn't agree with you.

[sunnydays]

I would have been more ticked off having it asked through the child because at that point, there is no easy way to say no. Not doing it would disappoint the child who is now expecting it. It's like saying to the child, "maybe if you're good, sunnydays will give you ice cream today"...well, when I don't pull out the ice cream, the child is going to have a melt-down and think either he is not "good" or I am just mean. That would be my issue with this way of doing things.


To avoid all the drama and get to your original question, I lilke some of the craft ideas here and I actually JUST made the pasta necklaces yesterday! All the kids loved them, we worked on patterns and putting them in order of colour etc. A great hit! The bookmark idea sounds simple and nice too!

As a "unicorn provider" I have had a mom drop off her daughter and say to her: "remember, after daycare, we are going to Aunt Shelley's birthday dinner!". Well, I helped the little girl make a birthday card for her Aunt Shelley. It was a simple, thoughtful gesture and mom appreciated it. I really would have no problem making a card for Mommy or Daddy, even if it was told to me thru the child as previously mentioned.
I dont agree that if we do it for one family, we need to do it for them all. I dont record parents birthdays, so they probably wont get one year after year!

The only time this would tick me off is if a parent said "its Mommys birthday, could you please something up for her? thanks" hahaha I think I would immediately be too busy to accomodate then. Them "hinting" to maybe if we had time etc, then I'm sure I can whip something up quite quickly!
Especially if it was the dad who asked, he is probably alot like my husband and I literally need to pull out the paper, glue, markers, glitter etc for him to sit down and help my son make ME a birthday card! Hopeless lol

Sorry you got the sidetracked opinions not about what you were originally asking about.
I always think twice about posting threads because of the criticism that goes along with it.

[mumstheword]

For what it’s worth, if your post was truly just about wanting craft ideas and only input for craft ideas, why even add the reason or the manner/tone it was asked (i.e. HINT HINT)? It’s not needed if you just want craft ideas for a birthday. So, I am guessing you weren’t totally over the moon with the way you were asked either and that’s why that’s in there. Don’t jump on others for picking up on that.

I was gonna say that earlier. It really doesn't look like you were sincerely looking for craft ideas OP. It seems more like you wanted praise and back pats for being so darn fantastic. OR, you were looking to see how others would feel about doing a birhtday craft for a parent.

[apples and bananas]

I was gonna say that earlier. It really doesn't look like you were sincerely looking for craft ideas OP. It seems more like you wanted praise and back pats for being so darn fantastic. OR, you were looking to see how others would feel about doing a birhtday craft for a parent.

Nope, just wanted some craft ideas. And I got them. Several ppl PM'd me some great ideas.

[Nottellin']

So, I choose to stay competitive. I choose to LOVE my job and what I do. And I choose to come onto forums like this to gain advise, support and other views.

I appreciate your view Judy, I think it's a horribly negative way to look at life and our carreer choice, but I appreciate it just the same.

So if you choose to get other opinions why were you so offended when Judy gave hers?

I have to ask...how long have you been running a daycare? I can garuntee that Judy has way more experience and child care hours under her belt then you. Maybe instead of getting defensive you should try to hear what someone with a ton of experience was trying to tell you.

Sometimes things like "make a birthday gift" trickle into other expectations and thus lead to real problems.

And I know you think what you are doing is valued...but it isn't. When someone values the job you do, the don't ask you to do more because they already think that you already do more then enough. This parent implied that you don't do enough and so he asked you to do more.

[Nottellin']

Oh, I did read your posts. I thought I had summarized them quite nicely based on the first one setting the tone, but no problem, happy to address a few more of your opinions. Here are some other gems and how I interpreted them:

“I don't think I jumped down anyones throat and I'm sorry if I've offended you in a thread that you weren't involved in in the first place. Opinons were made, that I don't agree with. There for I made an opinion back... I have that right as well. “ -That opinion set the tone for your THREAD!

“My point is very simple. I asked for ideas. I didn't ask what people thought about doing crafts for parents birthdays. Opinions that were offered made me feel that they were judging me, or I was doing something wrong in their eyes. I think I have the right to defend that.” Meh. People have the right to post that they don’t think that’s right. As I stated before, if you were TRULY looking only for craft ideas, you wouldn’t need to post about the manner it was asked. Like I said, PUBLIC FORUM, setting a precedent, etc.

“I am all for different opinions. However, Only ones that are asked for or are relevant to the post.” This one made me laugh right out loud. I have already mentioned that these providers have the right to comment on a public forum when you are setting a precedent for other providers. They have the right to not agree with you.

“I'm just asking for people to be helpful. I could care less if someone thinks I'm wrong. I just wanted some fresh ideas... I get a lot of negative opinions. Yes please, let's move on.” Once again, the first negative post was from YOU. The providers are allowed to defend their position. Note the "move on" comment...it be important in just a bit.

“Wow! Once again, I didn't ask for opinions, I didn't ask to be judged. I asked for some craft ideas. We all run our business's differently. Different parents look for different things.” You are posting on a public forum. If you are posting on a public forum, then you take what you get. These providers have every right to defend their businesses and the way they are running them.

“ Thank you for clarifying what Judy's off handed comment refered to. It's unfortunate that she throws her opinions out there, but is not will to debate anything.” Apparently you didn’t want to “move on” as you are clearly GOADING Judy into a response.

“I'm not here to defend my business or how I run my dayhome.” But in your earlier quote, you said you had every right to defend yourself. So, what is it? If you didn't want to defend it and felt you had nothing to defend then you could have left it and not answered the posters you didn't agree with.

“however, I will tell all of you that I agree... I don't think it's our job to do a craft or card for a bday. I think it is much better when dad sits down with the kids to complete the work. I also agree that I don't think it's right to "speak through the child". I find it underhanded and sneaky too.” So it took a multitude of posts to FINALLY get around to what most of us had already guessed- you weren’t happy about the way you were asked. It took you until about page 3 to admit it.

“It's not like I'm putting up a sign on my front lawn "WILL MAKE CARDS FOR MOM"S BDAY" It's not like the 3 year old told the 2 year old and the 2 year old went home and told mom the unfair thing the provider did today” – It IS like you are putting up a sign because you are posting on a PUBLIC FORUM-that providers and parents can read and set their own expectations.

I think it's called being competitive. I do these things for my clients and my kids because it keeps me competitive. It's a small thing that means a lot. My clients will stay with me because I do these extras and they will recommend me because I do these extras.
So, I choose to stay competitive. I choose to LOVE my job and what I do. And I choose to come onto forums like this to gain advise, support and other views.”
So basically, you do understand why people are mad at you. Judy is right on. You are setting a precedent for other providers and you don’t care about that. And you don’t really care about doing these things like a “good caregiver” would, for caring for the children, you do it because it keeps you competitive. Glad you are contradicting yourself right, left and centre. Right on, cool. Get it.

“I appreciate your view Judy, I think it's a horribly negative way to look at life and our carreer choice, but I appreciate it just the same.” Patronizing much?

“I didn't ask what anyone thought about what I was doing... i asked for craft suggestions. Not sure how I could have reworded it to get a different response then what I got.” – Like I said, if you TRULY just wanted craft suggestions, you don’t mention the manner in which it was asked. You could say “Hey, does anyone have any great suggestions for a craft? One of my DCKs’ parents has a birthday today and wants to surprise them!” Not “My client asked THROUGH his child to make a birthday card for his mother, hint hint”

Aggh. I am pretty sure that I didn't get through to you, or any of the others calling names. But yes, people that are proud of their businesses will continue to post when they believe a provider is being demeaned, especially when it is a public forum and will set a precedent for other providers. I think your parent's request, especially the manner it was delivered in, was out of line. If you think it's fine, then cool. Do it! But don't advertise it as the norm and demean other providers in the process, and THEN play victim. I think you probably could have found a number of awesome crafts and did them in the time it took to write nasty responses to everyone who didn't agree with you.

I hate doing long quotes like this...but you are AWESOME. You pretty much summed up what I had to say.

[KingstonMom]

This parent implied that you don't do enough and so he asked you to do more.

I think you are over thinking this.
Its just a Dad dropping off his kid to a daycare simply asking a favour of the provider.
Relax people!!!!

Whats next?? You are the kind of people who dont hold doors open for others because "If you do it for one, you will be stuck doing it for them all!!"
Where is a little common courteousy and generosity?!

[sunnydays]

A & B, I totally agree that flexibility is needed in home daycare. I have tons of flexibility and often do activities, crafts, etc spur of the moment because the kids ask for it or a question from a child leads to a great activity, etc etc etc. I don't think most of us have a problem with that, but rather the way it is assumed by a parent that it's no big deal to do this.
But, more importantly...I actually wasn't going to post again as this thread is getting rather long.....but I cannot let this go. You said that you don't do daycare as a "money-maker". Well, I am sorry, but I DO! There is no way, much as a I love kids, that I would take in 5 kids every day ll day if I were not making money doing it. Perhaps that' s why I value things like paid stat holidays, paid vacation days, and paid personal days and being paid a decent rate on time and without any argument from parents. I work HARD in this job. I deserve to be paid fairly and to be able to afford to support my family. That is why I am doing it. To stay home and to make a living while raising my kids. I love what I do and find it very rewarding watching the kids grow and thrive....but there is NO way I would do it for free or even for the extremely low rates some providers charge. I would find that demoralizing and it would not be worth putting all of this time and energy into. Every time a daycare provider says they are not in it for the money, we all take a collective step backwards. It reaffirms the public view that we should not want to be paid well...that the pure joy of looking at those little faces and wiping those little bums should be enough. For me, there is no job joyful enough that I would submit myself to these demands and not be financially compensated for it. If I wanted a job like that, I would be a volunteer.

[Nottellin']

I think you are over thinking this.
Its just a Dad dropping off his kid to a daycare simply asking a favour of the provider.
Relax people!!!!

Whats next?? You are the kind of people who dont hold doors open for others because "If you do it for one, you will be stuck doing it for them all!!"
Where is a little common courteousy and generosity?!
I'm not over thinking it.

Please tell me in what other service industry that it would be ok to ask for a favour?

Daycare is a business. Plain and simple. It has nothing to do with courteously and generosity. Do you think my server at the Olive Garden would run out and get me a bottle of Dom Perignon to be courteous and generous? No, that isn't their job.
Do you think that Walmart will special order me the flavour of coffee I want to buy? No, it isn't their job.

Why is daycare any different?

[apples and bananas]

I'm not over thinking it.

Please tell me in what other service industry that it would be ok to ask for a favour?

Daycare is a business. Plain and simple. It has nothing to do with courteously and generosity. Do you think my server at the Olive Garden would run out and get me a bottle of Dom Perignon to be courteous and generous? No, that isn't their job.
Do you think that Walmart will special order me the flavour of coffee I want to buy? No, it isn't their job.

Why is daycare any different?

This is where we differ in opinion. That server should do his/her best to satisfy your request. I come from the service and tourist industry. I worked for a company that worked towards "wowing" customers. We went above and beyond every chance we could, and celebrated that.

You go to disney world and you are wowed left right and centre. Their job IS to satisfy the customer in any way they can.

That's how I look at my job. I go above and beyond to satsify my clients.

[monkeymama]

This is where we differ in opinion. That server should do his/her best to satisfy your request. I come from the service and tourist industry. I worked for a company that worked towards "wowing" customers. We went above and beyond every chance we could, and celebrated that.

You go to disney world and you are wowed left right and centre. Their job IS to satisfy the customer in any way they can.

That's how I look at my job. I go above and beyond to satsify my clients.

Disney world sure isn't handing out all those "wow" factors for fee. You pay a pretty penny for them.

[monkeymama]

A & B, I totally agree that flexibility is needed in home daycare. I have tons of flexibility and often do activities, crafts, etc spur of the moment because the kids ask for it or a question from a child leads to a great activity, etc etc etc. I don't think most of us have a problem with that, but rather the way it is assumed by a parent that it's no big deal to do this.
But, more importantly...I actually wasn't going to post again as this thread is getting rather long.....but I cannot let this go. You said that you don't do daycare as a "money-maker". Well, I am sorry, but I DO! There is no way, much as a I love kids, that I would take in 5 kids every day ll day if I were not making money doing it. Perhaps that' s why I value things like paid stat holidays, paid vacation days, and paid personal days and being paid a decent rate on time and without any argument from parents. I work HARD in this job. I deserve to be paid fairly and to be able to afford to support my family. That is why I am doing it. To stay home and to make a living while raising my kids. I love what I do and find it very rewarding watching the kids grow and thrive....but there is NO way I would do it for free or even for the extremely low rates some providers charge. I would find that demoralizing and it would not be worth putting all of this time and energy into. Every time a daycare provider says they are not in it for the money, we all take a collective step backwards. It reaffirms the public view that we should not want to be paid well...that the pure joy of looking at those little faces and wiping those little bums should be enough. For me, there is no job joyful enough that I would submit myself to these demands and not be financially compensated for it. If I wanted a job like that, I would be a volunteer.

Thank you sunnydays. Sums up my thoughts exactly!

[apples and bananas]

Disney world sure isn't handing out all those "wow" factors for fee. You pay a pretty penny for them.

Absolutely! I don't care for kids for free either. I have a business. I do charge to care for children. I know I'm not going to get rich doing it. If I didn't love it, I wouldn't do it. And making clients happy, making kids happy, going above and beyond makes it enjoyable for me.

I also have a full daycare and am booked solid for the next 2 years. I have referrals all over the place. I have people call me because they've heard about me. I'm sure you all do to, but this is how I maintain my business and this is the model I choose to follow.

[playfelt]

Some days we have flexible schedules and some days we don't because I have big plans already made. It was rude of the dad to assume that what I had planned for the day was less important than what he had planned for me for the day - um my daycare, my plans. Does it take much to have a child make a card no - but it would be a piece of paper folded in half with me printing Happy Birthday Mom on it and child scribbling with crayons on it taking only a few minutes while I made lunch and not detracting from our day. The other kids would get to do one too.

Actually I would probably just do it for all of them and write To Someone Special on the front and then let them draw on the inside as they wanted. I would not turn it into a craft that used my supplies, etc. as that is not what I am paid to do.

[apples and bananas]

I traced the boys hands... I left him to colour them... I cut them out during quiet time (took all of 2 min) Then I had him cut a straight line of paper. I folded it and wrote "this much" On it. On one hand I wrote "I Love You" Then we glued the hands to each end of the straight paper and he had a nice little card that when opened said, I love you this much.

Thank you to the person who pm'd me their pinterest board and I found it there.

[momofnerds]

I cut out 3 hearts and made a book, dcg colored and glued and used glitter (glue and glitter are only used when the babies are sleeping) she's so proud. You can't bottle up that grin thats for sure! I like the hand idea.

[apples and bananas]

I cut out 3 hearts and made a book, dcg colored and glued and used glitter (glue and glitter are only used when the babies are sleeping) she's so proud. You can't bottle up that grin thats for sure! I like the hand idea.


What a great idea! Thanks for sharing. That might work for shamrocks too. A little glitter and glue goes a long way!

[Nottellin']

This is where we differ in opinion. That server should do his/her best to satisfy your request. I come from the service and tourist industry. I worked for a company that worked towards "wowing" customers. We went above and beyond every chance we could, and celebrated that.

You go to disney world and you are wowed left right and centre. Their job IS to satisfy the customer in any way they can.

That's how I look at my job. I go above and beyond to satsify my clients.

You can "wow" your customers and still say no.

Can you imagine if I went to Disneyland and said " I don't like fireworks, I want a light show instead". Do you think they would do it or would I get a "No"?

Do you really think your server is going to run to the liquor store for you and neglect all, her other tables and miss out on tips just to do you a favour?

Do you really think Walmart is going to go out of their way to contact a supplier and create a ton of paperwork just to get you your coffee?

No. I have also worked in the service industry, and big companies aren't in the habit of saying yes, they are in the habit of saying no , but not making you feel bad about it.

[KellyP]

At what point does "Wowing clients" become enabling them?

Whether the provider minded making a card or not is not really relevent. What I think IS relevent is that the father actually asked/expected the provider to do it.

To me that says NOT my responsibility or portrays the attitude that he is asking his "hired help" to do something he didn't prioritize into his schedule.

Bet his wife would be super proud to know that the child's caregiver made the card rather than dad and child not only making a card for their beloved family member but making some really cool memories of time spent together instead.

Going above and beyond is one thing. Do it if you really want to. I have no issues with that.

But when all is said and done, I believe the lesson you just taught dcd or dcg for that matter is other people will always pick up the slack for their inability to prioritize. Enabling at it's finest.

That is precisely why child care providers are often shown so little respect in my opinion.

[apples and bananas]

I can see your point. However,

I don't think we can compare fireworks and a light show to a 5 minute card.

If I didn't have time to do it, i would have simply said to the child. Well, let's see if we have time, but we have a pretty packed day today.

I don't think it's up to me to teach the father that he needs to spend more time with his son. My job starts when they enter my door and stops when they walk out of it. What they do on their own time is really not my business.

As much as you say "That is precisely why child care providers are often shown so little respect in my opinion. " I say.... this is exactly why I put my child in a home daycare when I was working. They recieved more one on one attention. No, I would never ask a teacher or center care to do a quick card, but that's the advantage of home daycare. Yes, I have a daily schedule, but there's always room for flexability. I'm not bound by it.

I don't think taking on a request from a parent is enabling anyone. I think it's helpful... and nice.

[Other Mummy]

Wow...who would have thought that the most benign title "Birthday Idea for a Mom" would evoke 7 pages on this forum !!! BTW...off topic, but I'm digging apples and banana's new avatar :)

[Momof4]

Wow, apples and bananas, look at all the very intelligent caregivers who took time out of their busy days to help and advise you. I hope after you calm down you will come back to this thread and read every single word because there is a valuable stash of information hidden in all the posts that could help you so much if you read them with an open mind. Same goes for all the other new providers who think it's all sunshine and roses still. No, this isn't about a card, it's about the principal of the entire thing.

I've raised my children and have gone past the birthday with the 5 at the front and I'm still proud to say that I learn something from others every single day, about running my daycare and about life in general. If you close your mind you are doomed.

Now there are always going to be the people who are proud they fart rainbows and don't see that other people are actually pushing them around. There are always going to be the people like me who want to learn to do a better job every day and are proud that they are standing behind their contract and not being pushed around any more after a lifetime of being pushed around. There are always going to be the babysitter type, goofing off, and hence the parents who come to us with wide eyes after they realize they were promised one thing and it was all lies. We are all different. But we are here to help each other.

You came to this forum and asked for advice. We gave you lots of advice. Good luck to you if you don't heed at least some of the fantastic advice that was given to you.

[apples and bananas]

Wow, apples and bananas, look at all the very intelligent caregivers who took time out of their busy days to help and advise you. I hope after you calm down you will come back to this thread and read every single word .

I have not only come back to the thread, but I've been commenting all the way along. You didn't see that? I'm not convinced that you've read every single word based on that comment.

I have seen lots of opinions and I've given lots of opinions... but little advise.

And for the record, there was never anything to calm down from. I'm not sure I understand what the point of your post was.

OTher mummy... I agree, the title is a little misleading now isn't it. Wouldn't it have been wonderful if it was 7 pages of useful ideas... much like I asked for to begin with. Oh well. Some very intellegent and great caregivers PM'd (as I've already stated) and I got a great craft idea from that. And my child left glowing and very proud of himself that he made something wonderful for mom.

Regarding my avatar... someone made an off handed comment about a unicorn in and around page 3 so I thought I'd just fit the part. ;)

[Spixie33]

I have been reading this thread and really enjoying the different viewpoints and points raised.

Personally I see nothing wrong with other providers expanding on the thread and taking it in a different direction. Some people stayed on topic and others raised other points. The other points raised were still in relation to the original post and how other providers would handle the situation. Hearing how others would handle a similar situation is the whole beauty of this thread. That is how threads work and there were good and thoughtful points raised.

I had a day a couple of weeks ago where we did some finger-painting and then the next day the parent dropped off his daughter and said " Make me another one of those cute paintings today."

Um.....I am not doing finger-painting or painting two days in a row. That would be repetitive. I just smiled and wished him a good day and didn't do it or give in to the pressure to produce more artwork. It was a nice, mild winter day so we spent extra time outside instead of crafting. The fresh air is much better for them and makes them much happier and I am worried about what makes for a fun/successful day for the kids.

[Momof4]

Really? Really? A & B Really? Ok, I'm done!

[KingstonMom]

Holy Cow!! Am I the only one that is with A&B on this one???

She was simply asking our opinions on craft ideas and you jump down her throat.
I hope you all feel better sleeping tonight knowing that you have said what you said?!

[dodge__driver11]

Deleted comment....

[KellyP]

Holy Cow!! Am I the only one that is with A&B on this one???

She was simply asking our opinions on craft ideas and you jump down her throat.
I hope you all feel better sleeping tonight knowing that you have said what you said?!

If after 7 pages of great advice, awesome perspectives and a whole lot of opinions, you are still the "ONLY one" with A&B on this one, THAT alone should say something.

Also, I can't speak for others but I sleep very well at night. I said NOTHING that was rude or offensive and if neither you nor OP really and truly understood what other providers were trying to say, then YOU are the one who should have issues sleeping.

Doing special and going above and beyond what child CARE should really mean is hard enough as it is. Being asked to do more on top of all of that is rediculous and really very very sad.

NONE of my daycare parents would dream of asking me to do more than I already do for their child. They value my services and the quality of care I provide and not once have I been asked for more on top of that.

Guess I just have parents who "get it". I dont know.

[notaunicorn]

well well well the hens are clucking away!!

I see the OP posted in "daycare providers experiences with parents"

now, I would say maybe the OP made a mistake posting in this section but I do feel she was looking for either a validation or someone to say it is ok to say no to this. I think those of us that are opinionated (and not in a negative sense) gave her a bit of a start by defending our right to say enough is enough.

maybe if all she really wanted was posts on crafts she should have posted in the right section - childcare/daycare activities.

her opening lines


So Dad drops off his 3 yr old this am and says "now, if you have a chance, make sure you make a nice card for mommy's bday" LOL hint hint!

gave the impression she was not impressed with the dad being sneaky and underhanded in pawning off something he could easily do with the child, but chose instead to hand the parental reins to the daycare provider.

her next lines


I'm good with making a card, and will actually have a lighter load today and would like to do something nice for mom. Any suggestions on a one day quick throw together birthday present craft?

had a different feel to them. She chose to be okay with doing it therefore she owns the responsibility thrust upon her by the dad.

where the thread went from there was stupid. It is a public forum. Parents read this too. Providers look to other providers for HONEST opinions. In other forums providers have been lambasted/flamed/mocked/threatened for being honest.

Those that said we could not post out opinions and yet posted other defamatory comments towards other providers need to check themselves posting in a PUBLIC forum.

I am embarrassed by some of the behavior this post has created, all the while we should be having each others backs, while opinions may differ.


and Dodge - saying this post needs to be closed is your right, and an opinion, but I disagree.

OP if you feel the post needs to be closed you can ask, other wise I see it as a way to grow and learn various thoughts, without getting nasty or taking sides.

BTW, I have had to put my daycare parents "on notice" sometimes as they hand the reins to me for far too much sometimes. I have raised my children, I choose to provide care for theirs.

[dodge__driver11]

I am all for others posting and thats great I posted my thoughts too, the only reason I posted that it maybe should be closed is everyone started to argue...but hey, whatever argue away..I have a bag of popcorn...Just kidding! :)

[Nottellin']

I can see your point. However,

I don't think we can compare fireworks and a light show to a 5 minute card.

If I didn't have time to do it, i would have simply said to the child. Well, let's see if we have time, but we have a pretty packed day today.

I don't think it's up to me to teach the father that he needs to spend more time with his son. My job starts when they enter my door and stops when they walk out of it. What they do on their own time is really not my business.

As much as you say "That is precisely why child care providers are often shown so little respect in my opinion. " I say.... this is exactly why I put my child in a home daycare when I was working. They recieved more one on one attention. No, I would never ask a teacher or center care to do a quick card, but that's the advantage of home daycare. Yes, I have a daily schedule, but there's always room for flexability. I'm not bound by it.

I don't think taking on a request from a parent is enabling anyone. I think it's helpful... and nice.
Wait, I'm confused...isn't Disney the example that YOU gave ME?

Anyway, yes it is enabling. I don't understand how it is a providers job to make a birthday gift for a child's mom.

You said yourself that you would never dream of asking a preschool or a teacher to do that so why is a home daycare any different?

[playfelt]

In theory we are supposed to have open-ended art not teacher craft time available to the children anyways so if the child chose because daddy suggested it to make a card during freeplay/art time then that is what would have happened had the child not been in home care but in a centre with same age kids. The teacher's help would have been the child asking for help to fold the paper into a card. Home care means we have to adjust best practice so that we keep everyone safe so no free art in many cases.

[Daycare123]

I think Judy's argument is coming from a place of genuine concern for you-- even if you don't read it that way.....

.....the group of parents I have now would not ask me what this parent asked of you. Not because I don't care, not because I don't love my day care kids, but because they respect my the running of my day home. I felt like this particular parent was not respecting you and that is why I can see why Judy and the others are posting what they are posting.

I completely agree with both of Bugaboo's points!

[Spixie33]

So.....I had to think of this thread today because DCD walks in and says to me "I am not sure if you guys are busy today or what you have planned but DCKs mom is celebrating her birthday today. Don't take this information the wrong way and do with it as much as you feel comfortable."

My mind immediately went to this thread and I was like -- NO WAY ! I remember reading this thread and kind of having mixed feelings and here it was happening to me. It just goes to show that eventually situations can affect all of us.

I told the dad we were starting our mother's day project today and I would see what I could do. It felt like an enormous amount of pressure to have thrust upon me when I kind of had our day planned out to be outside and working on mother's day.

I know this dad is CRAZY about his wife though and just wants her to have a good birthday and that he gives the older child money to buy a present for mom and thought that the little brother might also want to do something.

I know it was not out of laziness that he was asking or because he doesn't plan to do something for his wife. He told me that the wife grew up with three older sisters and was kind of always a last thought on her birthday so they go all out for her as an adult.

We did make a quick craft today so he will have something to give his mom but it sure was stressful coming up with something at the spur of the moment when I didn't have it planned