Errands

[Shannie]

Hi! Just wondering if anyone has ran errands during the day at all? I agreed to take on my first dayhome boy from 7 am- 6pm. This leaves zero time during the week for things like, banking, post office, groceries....does anyone take time during the week with the kids to do running around? Are the parents ok with it? I am contemplating taking the kids but maybe I should just be asking for an afternoon off every couple of weeks to get my own stuff done.

I agreed to start my dayhome 3 weeks early too and have now realized that I have no time to get my daughter ready for back to school. lol.

Thanks for the advice

[Lee-Bee]

When I had a full daycare with 5 kids no. My selling point for most of my families was we stayed on site (huge backyard). But, as you noted long hours and no time for errands or other things was really not working for us.

I then closed the daycare and kept one child. We now spend our day in the main house (not in separate daycare space) and the families knows that I do tend to the house during the day and run errands as needed. It is manageable with two children (both approx. 2.5yrs.). They find it fun. I go to grocery stores with the double carts so they sit side by side and giggle the whole time etc. I would have ZERO desire to go out for errands with more than 2!

If you plan to you need to discuss it fully with parents so they know. You DO NOT want to run into a family member or family friend and have them casually mention seeing you to the parents if the parents do not know! You just need to be transparent with the daycare families. Mine knows that for periods of time their child needs to entertain herself as I do laundry, cooking, cleaning and house tasks during the daycare hours to free up my evenings for family time. I made sure they knew this so when their child, who is talking more and more, goes home and says I was ignoring her, or wouldn't play with her or whatever 2.5yr olds randomly report I am able to clarify that while doing laundry she was told to go play etc.

7am-6pm is an incredibly long day. Why do they need such long hours of care?

If you start running errands a god way to off set it is to run a few on the way to the park. Then the kids get something to look forward to after the boring adult stuff and if they complain to the parents they had to run errands you can follow up by saying, yes we stopped at the post office on the way to the big park. So the parents see you still have the kids in mind.

[mickyc]

Sometimes but not often. I don't have a big enough vehicle to take the kids so my running around is usually evenings.

On occasion when I have 1 or 2 we do! A few weeks ago I ended up with 1 boy. We went to the bank, got groceries and picked up the mail. We then did the park and mcd's for lunch. If a parent doesn't like it then too bad. It gets us out of the house and it isn't often. I also do laundry, water flower beds, go online when kids are here.

[jodaycare]

I am walking distance to everything. I work 6:30 -5:30, I do most of my banking online or deposit cheques from the parents by mobile deposits. My bank is open till 8 pm and on Sat and Sun. I have a Walmart and a Fortinos within a 5 minute walk. My parents have no problem with me walking to the store, it can be an awesome teaching opportunity.

[5 Little Monkeys]

Just got back home from doing an errand lol, so yes, I do!

Home daycares are different than centres. We offer a home like experience. For some, this includes doing errands. My daycare kids even know our family members (in laws, cousins etc) as we sometimes go to their houses as well. My Inlaws give the dck's Halloween treats and we visit them often on our walks.

I've never had a parent not like this, in fact it's usually a selling point. I only go in the car when I have 2-3 though.

Tomorrow were headed to the mall to meet Anna and Elsa and we'll likely browse the stores too!

[Shannie]

Right now I only have my 2 kids and one extra, I'm going to see if the parents mind. It is a very long day for us all and an hour every once in awhile could sure break up our day a bit. I have been taking them to the splash park, playgrounds and picnics daily so a stop for something would be super handy. specially since I started up earlier than anticipated. I need to get my daughter glasses and nothing is open past 5:30.

[mickyc]

I think most parents wouldn't mind. As long as you are looking after their child it shouldn't matter what you are doing. I think most parents would rather not have to take extra time off if they don't have to.

About a week after starting My handfuls mom made a comment about her previous daycare. She said provider would get upset that her pickups and drop off times were all over the place because she had errands to do. She said well I certainly wasn't paying her to do errands!!! So yes there are some who think that.

[5 Little Monkeys]

I think most parents wouldn't mind. As long as you are looking after their child it shouldn't matter what you are doing. I think most parents would rather not have to take extra time off if they don't have to.

About a week after starting My handfuls mom made a comment about her previous daycare. She said provider would get upset that her pickups and drop off times were all over the place because she had errands to do. She said well I certainly wasn't paying her to do errands!!! So yes there are some who think that.

This would annoy me too. If pick ups are all over the place and they are your only/last child, than it's hard to plan your evenings. Yes, you could say well your done at xx time so just plan for after that but if I was done 1-2 hours earlier, that's a lot of extra time that I could have made appt's/done errands. If it's the mom I'm thinking if, she was likely just mad about having to be on time or commit herself to set times as it sounds like she just likes to come and go as she pleases. She sounds like she uses daycares as drop centres lol. (If this is your mom that you've told me about before!)

[Suzie_Homemaker]

I don't.

In my view, we are being paid to work not run errands. Not saying others shouldn't, but it not sit right with me.

I think if I paying person to care for my child, I would be annoyed if provider running errands and bringing my child along. If I wanted my child running errands in day, then I stay home and bring with me. It blur line between babysitter who just supervising child for safety and day home which provide safe, nurturing and educational environment with focus on child's needs not provider's.

Sure, if work outside home, I'd have lunch period to run errand that day home provider not have, but that is one of down sides being self-employed our of house.

Not knocking those who do it, as sure they have okay from parent but I wouldn't and don't.

[fivelittleones]

I take my dcks out but only for day trips. I will have less children this September and so I'm planning outings once or twice every week, but they are geared toward the children having fun and learning. I wouldn't feel right going out shopping or running errands either, it doesn't seem very professional to me. However, not knocking others for doing it, to each their own. Everyone runs their business differently and has different values and goals.

[superfun]

I don't, but I close at 430, so I can usually get most things done after work. One of my families that came to me when their daycare closed, they mentioned that she would take the kids to buy groceries, etc. And the family liked that.
Now that I think of it, we do sometimes walk to the store if we need something. But there isn't much close to me, so it doesn't happen often.

[mickyc]

Suzie- with the comment that we are paid to work not run errands then how does that logic apply to days we close with pay. We are being paid to work right?

Focusing on the child's needs not the providers? Well do the kids not eat? What is wrong with buying groceries while on the clock? Kids learn life skills while running errands, learn about making healthy food choices.

I don't book many days off a year and ask all parents to give me notice when they will be away. Most times if I just have 1 kid I will close. Sometimes I am not given notice and suddenly find myself with 1 kid. I certainly am not going to sit and entertain 1 child all day long. What a great chance for us to go out and get some stuff done and we always follow up with something like mcd's or the pRk

[jodaycare]

Suzie, going grocery shopping can be an amazing opportunity for learning: math skills, colours, nutrition to name a few. During the holidays, it can provide an opportunity to talk about different cultures and how they celebrate. I agree that we arent paid to shop but if it is used as a learning experience, that is great.

[Suzie_Homemaker]

I take my dcks out but only for day trips. I will have less children this September and so I'm planning outings once or twice every week, but they are geared toward the children having fun and learning. I wouldn't feel right going out shopping or running errands either, it doesn't seem very professional to me. However, not knocking others for doing it, to each their own. Everyone runs their business differently and has different values and goals.

Me too.

We go library, splash park, type activity but never errand.

[Suzie_Homemaker]

Suzie- with the comment that we are paid to work not run errands then how does that logic apply to days we close with pay. We are being paid to work right?

Focusing on the child's needs not the providers? Well do the kids not eat? What is wrong with buying groceries while on the clock? Kids learn life skills while running errands, learn about making healthy food choices.

I don't book many days off a year and ask all parents to give me notice when they will be away. Most times if I just have 1 kid I will close. Sometimes I am not given notice and suddenly find myself with 1 kid. I certainly am not going to sit and entertain 1 child all day long. What a great chance for us to go out and get some stuff done and we always follow up with something like mcd's or the pRk

I sorry if you upset with my view.

Paid leave not relevant. My point was I being paid during day that child is here, to educate, entertain and care for child. It not for me to go doctor, grocery shop, bank and bring children along. My day care hours are for the focus on children's need, not for my needs and expecting children to go along so I can reduce my to-do list.

If I nurse, I could not wheel patient in bed to grocery store and it be inappropriate.
If I carer in nursing home, it be inappropriate to take elderly person to do my errands.

All grown up have thing they need to do at end of work day. All grown up need groceries, banking, pick up dog food. Just because we work from home, that not mean we have to lower standard of professions.

No other job would allow this "on the clock". People expected to do in own time. And before you say we work longer hours than most - that is our choice. We chose home day care. We choose more than other child care person, our hours. Yes, kid learn life skills while running errands and will learn when doing that with their family.

If you think buying grocery on clock is okay, that fine. I was clear that for me it not. I would also not have daycare children sort my dirty laundry, or clean my toilet but that is life skill too, no?

I would open for one child because I have contract for care. If some don't come, and I have one, that way it goes. I would not dream of saying to that one set parent, "oh I'm closing today because I'm not going to sit and entertain your child all day long so we doing my errands and your kid can tag along". If that how you choose operate, that fine. But not me.


Suzie, going grocery shopping can be an amazing opportunity for learning: math skills, colours, nutrition to name a few. During the holidays, it can provide an opportunity to talk about different cultures and how they celebrate. I agree that we arent paid to shop but if it is used as a learning experience, that is great.

Yes but that not what was said. Taking child for errand is not primarily for learning experience. It for convenience of provider primarily. Adding a couple of math question not make it suddenly about child care. It still about provider doing personal task in work day however it presented.

[Lee-Bee]

All opinions aside it comes down to what you tell the parents before they sign a contract.

If you let them know that you will be doing errands and housework before they sign they have the option to send their child elsewhere if they are not comfortable with this. If you inform them of this first then you are doing your job (while running errands)...you've put these errands into your job description.

Parents just need to be given the chance to agree to it first. It is just about being transparent with the families and not about who is doing better care.

[5 Little Monkeys]

Even though I do the odd errands with my dck's, I always turn it into a lesson and than end it with a fun child themed activity. Shopping is one of their favourites though lol. They help me buy ( pick out) a lot of the toys actually. The parents enjoy that we get out and do things in the community. I know a few of them don't take them on errands so when they come to the grocery store with me, it's a great time for them as we discuss the things we see, talk about being patient in line, etc.

I think this is a great asset to home daycares. The children are treated like my own and are included in activities that me and my family do. We are a tightly bonded dc and my dck's ask for my family members all the time. They truly are part of my extended family.

From my experience, parents around here would be more okay with the odd errand on "work time" than having to pay for my vacation days and have no service given.

If a dc was doing daily errands and ignoring the children's needs than I'd be more concerned but I don't think this happens very much.

[mickyc]

Suzie I am not upset with your view I just didn't see how you can say we are being paid To work but then have paid days off.

Also I would never just tell a parent I will be closing today just because I have 1 kid. This is why I ask all families for 1 months notice of their time off. Then I have enough time to decide if I want to close or not based on how many kids are here. Usually if it's just 1 I will close and be able to give plenty of notice.

For my families they have no issue with me running errands. I don't do it often and it is often paired with a trip to the park/splash pad and mcd's. That being said it is very rare that we go out - maybe once every few months. Summer more often as people are on holidays.

I also go online (like now), do laundry, clean, etc while "on the clock". Kids are having fun enjoying free play.

[adaycarelady]

You can't be doing learning activities from open to close. As long as a provider does learning activities on a regular basis, it's not going to ruin a child's future if a provider runs errands, cleans the house or plays farmville. Kids want variety too. There is nothing wrong with taking a child out into the fresh air and sun and driving into the real world where they will learn about the world they will grow up in. Yes, they can have these experiences with their parents but alot of my parents drop their kids off and go run their errands so things get done quicker. Providers can easily run their errands after hours in peace too, but they choose to bring their daycare children along during their work hours to add variety to their program. Life skills are very valuable. When these children turn into adults they are not going to be doing learning activities all day, they are going to be running errands so why not teach them how things get done since some parents don't. I play farmville everyday, do my laundry, get all my house cleaning done, pay bills, menu plan, run errands, give the dog a bath and even watch netflicks during naptime. I also have a very educational program and themes. I am not a robot and the perk of working from home is being able to do stuff around the house. I like to get things done during work hours to increase my relaxation time during my off hours. If I didn't do things during my work hours, I'd be doing chores non-stop in the evenings and weekends and would burnout quickly. The kids in my care are very happy and need time as well to interact with each other. They do not want to be listening to me teach all day. Just let kids be kids and let them play!

[crayolamom]

I don't know why everyone is so shocked with Suzie's response. I have been following this forum for a while and Suzie was actually being kind by saying she doesn't do it but if others do do it that's their choice.

As for the comment above "you can't be doing learning activities from open to close" really? That's your only job how can that be so difficult for some? If that's a major issue don't do childcare.

Many people at work don't get a two hour or 3 hour break while children are napping and have to clean the house after they get home from a long day at the office.

When you go into your doctors office ask him how many times he leaves his work on the clock to go pick up groceries.

As for the life learning skills, give me a break! Typical excuses to justify dragging someone's kids around town to pick up groceries and to run errands how unprofessional.

You work long hours and that's parent of the job so if that doesn't work for you find a job outside the home were you get a half an hour break and can go pick up your groceries than.

[crayolamom]

How YOU want to run your daycare is a piece of advice that should have been added after what Suzie said not after my comment but thanks! If majority of you agree on one thing then we will pick apart who ever doesn't agree.

It is extremely unprofessional and not right in anyway. I will be printing off and using this thread as a selling point in the future to show parents what I DON'T DO.

[adaycarelady]

I have been working with kids for 9 years and have never met a child who was interested in learning activities for 10 hours. What do you do when they loose interest and just want to relax? Follow them around the house with your pocket chart lol. Shame on those teachers for taking summer holidays!! Children need to be learning academics all day, everyday so get them back in the classroom asap!! A doctor does not work from home so is unable to do chores around the house. He is also paid to take care of patients physical wellness, not teach them life skills. An office worker is paid to do office work, not teach children life skills. I wouldn't have to clean so much if I didn't have a daycare since alot of the dander comes from the daycare kids. As for errands, I wouldn't go for a haircut and drag the daycare kids along. All my errands are daycare related. Wouldn't that be sad if a 10 year old had to ask what a bank or grocery store looked like since they have never been to one before. As self-employed people, we are all able to run our daycares the way we want. That's what self-employment means. Since I am self-employed I have created my own program goal which is to help children learn independence. Helping them to understand what a bank is and where our food comes from helps me to reach my program goal. I could even take it a step further and take them to a farm and show them where the grocery store gets the food from. If I buy something off the farmer directly while the children are with me would be considered an errand however, shame on me for showing the children that we exchange money for goods!

[crayolamom]

People that work from home are necessary taking tlcare of other people's children. Why do you think your entitled to run your arrands in someone else's dime? I have a structure schedule where my kids are learning all day in different ways. If yours are bored then I might was to revise how you operate. So why do we send kids to school all day if they loose interests. Logically and morally what you are saying makes no sense. Sorry to break it to just but just bc you are self employed does mean you can drag someone else's kids around town for your own personal reasons.

There parents can help thrm understand what the bank does and grocery store. Like I said excuses!!!

I don't even understand why you would want to drag all those kids out its such a liability issue what if something happens to them. Selfish and irresponsibly and this why many ppl don't take us seriously be pprovidrs like you treat like a joke.

[adaycarelady]

Everyone runs their program differently. In my daycare, there is a time for work and there is a time for play (just like in real life). Parents sign a permission form that allows me to take them out and about. If they don't like my program, they don't have to sign up. I don't take out the group when everyone is here. I usually just run errands when there is only 1-3 kids. We also don't go run errands everyday or every week for that matter. It's just a random event. I take my job very seriously btw. Education is important to me, but life experiences are as well.

[Suzie_Homemaker]

I think there some confusion.
I seem to touch rawed nerve with some who become very defensive of choices. That not my intention. But since many think it deserve anger and frank choice of wording, I too be frank about my opinion in return.

To me, working from home is not about household tasks. Just because can be done, I don't feel they should be done. When children in my home, I am being paid to provide care for those children. To me, the benefit of working from home is being able to claim some household expenses at tax time which employee cannot. It about not having to have two car insurances if not want to. It about convenience of not travel into work location during winter. These are the benefit from being in home that many not have.

I have no objection to period of free play and think it very valuable time, within reasonable limit. But this not same as leaving children to play by self and friends so I can get on with family errands like laundry, cleaning, prepping family supper or playing game on phone. During period of free play, I am in room interacting with children, guiding, answering questions, suggesting, asking questions, participating for both safety and also to ensure no one is getting hurt.

Many might say they open plan and can see children from other room. That not point. I small house and can see everyone too but in my opinion, that is not permission for me to leave children to entertain self while I do task for family just because I happen to be working from my own house.

We very lucky that at times, all children nap which give a longer break than most other professions and while home, I can see many would then do tasks for family. This I can understand as children are not awake and not needing level of supervision they do when awake. Indeed, once lunch cleared away, and afternoon activities laid out, I see it make sense to use last few minutes of children sleeping to do quick task to get ahead of own errands. But to take children, during time they awake, to grocery shop or other non business errand, is cop out, to me. To use the time during which being paid to provide home day care for primarily own benefit, is not okay. From 10 hour day, this add up to maybe 4 or even 5 hours being about what easy for carer and benefit carer and nothing to do with providing care for the child.

If using grocery store as educational life skill, most provider have play food and can easy make pretend game giving equal skills without pretending it educational outing when really it just dragging children along to do own tasks. I understand that when walking home from park or splash pad and passing local store it make sense to go in for milk needed for afternoon snack. I think most parent would be very fine with that couple of minutes detour but this very different than going to supermarket with weekly list even if list include day care grocery needs.

To me, plopping children in front of TV for "educational show", or taking children to store for "math and educational activity", is not even being honest with self. This is what I expect from a stay at home parent running errands with own children or maybe someone who has one or two children they take in with view it bit extra and they babysitting. But it not something I would expect from day home who is running business of providing care for children.

I not say that every single minute of children's time in home has to be educational although my program has strong focus on that. But putting children in a room under the guise of free play, so provider can do her housework is total abuse of situation. I do not think it unreasonable that every single minute that day care children awake in house, that day care activities are the focus, instead of providers wanting to use time in the house to do own family errand and expect children to entertain self and call it "free play".

As person said, if during interview, you telling parent that children nap for 2-3 hour each day, that you take them to do your weekly groceries because some eaten by client children, and that you feel free play is time for you to do laundry, clean bathroom, pay your bill in bank or anything else that every adult has to do in own time normally, then that is fair. But I doubt many parent be okay with paying day care fees when 4+ hours of day care being used for provider's own errands.

This is my view. The standard I apply to myself based on the standard I would expect if paying for own child to be in daycare provider's home. To me, a day home service is comparable to day care centre service, just in more intimate environment where child build relationship with carer long term rather than having high turnover of staff who not know each child personally. How you do your business in your home, is down to you but I think lot of parent be very, very shocking and upset to read some of comment in this thread and to learn how much of child's day is not focus on day care activities, educational or not, or limited level of supervision where provider doing own thing.

I not see how lining up in bank is educational for preschool child. They not understand banking, deposit, withdrawal, interest rate, credit score. To a preschool child, toddler and infant, they lined up in building waiting to get to front of line so carer can speak to adult and then leave.

I do not see how carer leaving children to free play while she wash toilet and scrub bath or launder own family smelly sock is educational for child when same level of education from carer being present and in moment giving supervision of children she paid to care for and interacting with child.

I do not see how carer with many children getting her tampon and hair dye and piece of steak for husband supper is educational when same level of education from play food and pretend store where child can be store person and add up pretend prices on food item that other day care children pretend to buy. This more educational that real store because price can be assign with value at math level of preschooler and they can pay and work out change. I not for one second believe carer who doing shopping is getting children to add up, pay, work out change. Are carer using grocery shopping for educational reason arranging that children can see deliveries, or behind scenes? No. I not believe that be case.

There lot of real ways that carer can provide life skill within day home or outside on walk - but difference is focus on child care not focus on provider need/wish to get own errand down and pretend it a field trip benefiting children. It totally for benefit of provider and freeing up her own time after work.

For me, this about intent of task. And to fill day with own errand when really should be providing day care is not what my client pay for, or why I have wait list.

In past, we go to Farmer's market. Not for shopping. So children could see that the carrot, cauliflower, apples that they previously saw in ground at the Farm, is sold for food. We go see same Farmer we visited when crop planted. Same Farmer we visited when crop harvested. Same Farmer who showed children his chicks and hens. Same Farmer who let children collect egg from hen coop. Visting Farmer in market to see his crop on table and his egg in tray for selling - that is life skill and educational. To see whole process. All trips arrange with children's need in mind so they see the whole process.

Popping to Farm market to get own grocery is not same thing at all. Going to store and getting own shopping and pretending it life skill, not even carer who say that, really believe own line.

[superfun]

I don't even understand why you would want to drag all those kids out its such a liability issue what if something happens to them. Selfish and irresponsibly and this why many ppl don't take us seriously be pprovidrs like you treat like a joke.

You never leave the house with your daycare kids? Really?

[superfun]

I have already mentioned that i don't do errands, but that doesn't mean I think it's wrong. Like I said before, one of my previous daycare families really liked when their previous daycare took the children to the grocery store.
I think what it comes down to is choice. Some families will choose a home daycare because they do things like one big family. Others will choose because they want educational activities the entire day. We each offer different programs, and that's a good thing.

[TinyTwigs]

I have to agree with Suzie all the way here. If you want to run errands that's fine but don't make up excuses. Let's be a little more honest on this forum ladies. The reason we run errands isn't so we can teach children where the produce and dairy products are located in the grocery store but more so to finish our errands on the clock so we can spend more time with our family in the evenings and weekends or just to get it out of the way so we can relax.

I definitely would be mad and term care if I found out my daycare provider my taking my child around to run errands. Daycare is daycare not a time for parents to do their own personal shopping.

I have never taken children out to do errands I have only ever taken them out to the park.

[Kellybelly83]

I do take my Dayhome kids on outings, and I have it in my contract for liability purposes. The way I determine if I feel OK with the outing, is I think if the kids will truly enjoy whatever it is. My Dayhome kids love to go to the grocery store. But I never do it for a big shop, because then it's boring for them. I am open for 10 hours a day and half of the groceries I buy are for the Dayhome, so I feel ok buying Dayhome groceries or craft supplies at the dollar store etc, on work time. I do my own personal gorcery shopping on the weekends usually. I have taken the kids to the post office for my own personal postal needs, but only because the kids really like to go. I would not go to the dentist for 2 hours and have them wait though lol. Although I might go for a check up, just so they could see how painless a trip to the dentist is haha!

As for cleaning my house, yes, I do it during the day if I can. I also start dinner when the kids are here. That to me is a bonus of working from home. I only do these things when the kids are set up with an activity where they don't need me. I have mostly older kids so there is no nap time anymore, so when it's "quiet activity time" I get a few things done.

So I'm kind of on both sides of this coin. I'd feel guilty if I took the kids on errands frequently , and they didn't really have fun. But I do take them places and most of the parents see that as a bonus, because I have a large vehicle and the patience to take them out haha. Come September I'll only have 1 four year old all morning until noon. I plan on buying a pass for her for the rec centre so we can go with a friend a couple times a week, but honestly she'd be over the moon if we went to the bank , or staples etc! She LOVES " helping" and "jobs" and being a "mommy" lol so I can see us doing a lot of errands, if only to keep her happy and busy! I take my job seriously and I put the focus on the kids, but I'd be lying if I didn't try and maximize my time by doing some of my own personal stuff during the day, when I feel it's appropriate to do so. I took the kids to 5 different parks this week, but I also did my laundry after we got home and they were tired haha... It's all about balance to me. :yes:

[5 Little Monkeys]

I feel that some are thinking errands is a dirty word and we're dragging kids kicking and screaming along with us lol. My kids love coming to the grocery store and the odd time the bank (there's a kids area they like to colour at lol) but agree with the above poster, it's not like we're taking the kids to the dentist or our annual physical check ups at the doctors!!

IMO, getting groceries during the day is no different than cleaning the house, prepping supper, washing laundry, going online, watching tv during their nap, weeding the garden while outside, etc etc. In fact, the centres I worked at took the older kids to the store sometimes as a treat!

[playfelt]

I had a single parent situation years ago when I was first starting daycare and often she would complain to me about how she had to do housework and errands on evenings and weekends and about how much her son wanted her to just play with him. He would even say but Sharon plays with me all the time why can't you. It made me realize that I was giving the children a false impression of what "home" care was all about. With that in mind I would have them dust the playroom with a rag on Wednesdays ( I did it properly on the weekend) and on Friday we sorted bins and put things back where they belonged and straightened up the playroom. I started doing a half hour freeplay system where I was "free" to do my own thing too. That meant for that half hour they had to play with only what as already available, not asking for something off the shelf, etc. and there were bonus points for getting along, sharing, etc. I was free to put in a tub of laundry or change a bulletin board display or sort and straighten up something. They learned that there was more to making a group function than just playing with me.

I do have concerns about the providers that do outings with a mixed age group where the youngest spend the whole time in the stroller or wagon. I get that yes they are seeing neat things as you wander around the museum but they are not really learning at their level of comprehension. They should be at home playing. Very young children need a one on one adult to lift them up , comment on what they find interesting not just what the group is looking at etc to get the best benefit from the outing - ie with the parent on the weekend not me during the week but that is just my feeling. I took my own kids on outings not the whole group.

Have we ever walked up to the corner store to get a jug of milk because we were running low and hubby was out of town and had the vehicle and I didn't want to go at night yes but it was because of them that the outing was necessary - ie not them tagging along with something I wanted to do.

[Suzie_Homemaker]

I think a lot of this comes from each view about what home day care is.

Many see home day care with the emphasis on home and creating environment that is like second home on all levels.

Others (like me) have different view. I see daycare whether based in centre or home, as being about daycare - focus on the children, a full work day, educational, outside time, but in smaller close knit environment where close relationship between carer and core group.

I don't offer a day home - a home away from home for child to be when parent at work. I offer a day care facility which happens to be situated in the building I live in and the only connection to home, is that this is my home address.

I don't do errands when children in house.
I don't have TV on.
I don't leave children unsupervised even for 30 seconds unless asleep. (no to even to pee)
I don't expect child who awake to remain in crib/on their mat quietly until set time.
I never leave my day care children in care of someone else.
I feel I am the person vetted and so it my responsibility to be here when children present.
My husband not mix with day care children, ever. Most they might glimpse him walking out kitchen door to his workshop (semi-retired). He say hello kiddies, and they call hello back. That it. They might see him cutting grass outside window or plowing snow.

We have large garden fortunately and lot play equipment suitable for ages I take. Walking trails too.

[Crayola kiddies]

You never leave the house with your daycare kids? Really?

I live in a rural area .... In order to take the children off the property I would have to drive them so the answer is no I never take the children off my property ....
I gave to agree with Suzie on most of her points ....you wouldn't see an office worker running personal errands during working hours that's what their lunch break is for .... I do however use nap time to prep my dinner or fold some laundry .... But I do all my banking on line and truely have not set foot in a bank in about 4 years ... And now I do online grocery shopping so all I gave to do is pick it up .... If I have a drs appt that I can't schedule during the evening or weekend then I have my mil come and look after the daycare while I am out...... Oh and I also am tv free... I market myself as tv free and travel free .... And parents know at the interview that I have a back up provider in the event I absolutely cannot book an appt on a weekend or in the evening otherwise I would have to close ....and I have a bathroom in my daycare so I do leave them to pee but I leave the door ajar

[mickyc]

Very interesting! It is interesting how different everyone views things.

Yes Suzie I do view my daycare more like a home setting. My group loves free play! I don't have to keep them occupied all day and they are never bored. TV is on for first 30 minutes of the day as well as nap time for those who don't nap. I cook, clean, do laundry, go online, water flowers all while kids play. We sing, do crafts. Learn our letters, numbers, colors etc. go on outings occasionally for groceries, get the mail, go to bank. I would never take kids to an appointment. My MIL is my backup and the kids call her grandma. I even leave kids unattended while I go pee!! Lol.

We all do things differently and that's OK. My families are happy and my spots are full.

[Suzie_Homemaker]

I think some of service level also set by local market.

Here, for home type environment, where kids just present and carer does other non-daycare related things, most people pay $20 a day and bring food. For more educational based care, like mine, rate about $35-$40. My fees are $38 but I close at 4.30pm.

For me, not worth it to be paid $20 so local market demands if higher fees, different service.

[superfun]

I used to work in a job that paid me twice as much as what I'm doing now. And we all ran to pick up groceries, mail a letter, or go to the bank (only the employees that banked at the only branch close to our job). So I would say yes, people do run errands while they're at work. It was the trade off we got for not having regularly scheduled coffee breaks. We could just do some of these things when we weren't busy.

[TinyTwigs]

I think it's a tad bit unprofessional to be running personal errands with other peoples children but hey whatever works for someone may not for someone else.

As for the comment above you most likely worked for a company who had coverage while you were gone to run "errands" so if you left your work place someone was there to cover for you and if there wasn't you can't just go. Same goes for home daycare, yes it's your home but it's also your WORK place. So in a home daycare setting it's different because you have to essentially bring your clients with you bc there usually isn't anyone there to cover and if you want the flexibility to go out to run errands then hire an assistant. It's like a hair dresser bringing 5 clients to the grocery store?!

I also don't like how people are using the word "home daycare" to justify doing personal errands on the clock since they run a homey based childcare setting. The only "home" aspect of your job is that it is run out of your house. If you want to make it homey I am pretty sure no one has a "family" meal at the dinner table with the family and Daycare Kids.

People do errands so they don't have to do it after work or on the weekends that way you kill two birds with one stone being work and errands.

Also how can anyone think that going to the bank or grocery store is educational for infants and toddlers??? Someone mentioned above that their daughter went on a field trip with her "class" to the grocery store so how is that not appropriate> well you answered your own question! She had a class meaning she was in elementary school which also means she was older than and infant or a toddler so that concludes that taking infants and toddlers to the grocery store is not age appropriate. Also how would you feel if those teachers were grocery shopping? I personally would be annoyed and that isn't professional at all. Their parents can take them to the grocery store and teach them those things, that's not our job and there's a reason pretend play food was invented.

Providers get upset all the time that they aren't taken seriously and that people view them as "babysitters" not ECEs or whatever but can you really blame them ?

Someone said they run errands and their spots are always filled. That's nice but that doesn't mean you are any better of a provider than someone who doesn't run errands and whos spots are always full it might be a simple as living in a good location.

[33 Daiseys]

ummmmm not to stir the pot but i run errands all the time. as well as take kids to the doctors and yes the dentist. if my kids have a cleaning, im still there to read a book to them color ect. We run to the grocery store when the kids help pick out which fruit and veggies they want for the next week. It is a block from where we go to play group so why not?
We also go to the bank every friday morning. It takes less then five minutes, and it is right beside the library, where we go to story time.
I also cook and do laundry, paper work during nap time. I have some clients that are here at 7 am, and others that can stay as late as 8 pm. On those days, they also come to soccer, Dance classes, ect.
This is a major part of why all of my families come to me. The fact that we are out of the house and in society every day. Just a question, When children in day care get older, will they not have to get up and go to school, work, ect? So why is it viewed as harmful that they start learning these things at an early age.
Could this mentality of shelter everything for children be why the 20 year olds of today don't know how to do anything? Could it be from their daycare providers and parents doing everything with out their children? Not picking a fight but after speaking to a few child shrinks this has come up time and time again.

[5 Little Monkeys]

We received some cucumbers from a grandma and decided that we should make pickles with them. I didn't have the ingredients on hand so yesterday I took my group of 3 to bulk barn before going to the playground. Pretty sure they weren't scarred from it ;) (if anything, I was! Lol. They wanted to know what everything was in the spice aisle and what it was used for and I felt like an idiot because I didn't always know the answer!! Haha)

I do agree with other posters though...it's all about how we run our programs and by informing Parents of such, they can decide to send their child to us or not. For myself, I've had parents give great feedback on this part of my program. Strangers in the store always comment on how well behaved my "children" are and this makes me proud. I've had parents say they hate doing errands with their child so they leave them at home with a spouse. I think the best way to teach is to do, so I love taking them to the store with me. (This is a rare thing tho, not every week...heck, not even every month!) But I do draw the line at doctors appt's lol (if it works for others that's great tho!)

I take my job very seriously and try to incorporate lots of fun and different things to do to keep us from getting bored and for all my kids thus far, this has included grocery shopping (it's almost the only errand I do). If I had a group that really hated it or didn't get anything out of it, than I wouldn't do it.

Like I said before, I really don't see the difference between leaving the daycare to do an errand or staying home to do one. It's just justified differently but it doesn't make one right or wrong.

Last night I saw an ad for a 24/7 hour dc and I wondered how they get their errands done!

[Suzie_Homemaker]

Could this mentality of shelter everything for children be why the 20 year olds of today don't know how to do anything? Could it be from their daycare providers and parents doing everything with out their children? Not picking a fight but after speaking to a few child shrinks this has come up time and time again.

It not about sheltering children. It about doing job being paid to do.

My client come here for educational program not to have second family. My own children, knew about sex, drugs, cultural differences, sexuality, racism and politics long before their need for knowledge.

My children cook, clean, iron clothing, have own bank accounts and plenty life skills before hitting their teens.

Sheltering children? LOL. So offering educational environment with full focus on the children during business hours, with free play with me present, with outside activities daily, with math based learning happening in pretend store vs real one, with outings to farmer's, swimming, walks, splash pad, etc is sheltering children? No, it offering a professional service where clear boundary between business related events and personal running errands aren't crossed.

I don't think it mentality of sheltering children - but flip side - could this mindset of doing own tasks during work day rather than concentrating on tasks employed to do be reason 20 year olds today, expect to show up to job, play on phone, skip out early if quiet, skive off when boss not looking, do as little as can get away with. You know those who have sense of entitlement about picking up pay cheque without actually earning it?

[mickyc]

My kids wish we could get out more!! Unfortunately space in my vehicle doesn't allow for it often.

Those of you who are "on" your whole day must be exhausted! I am and I don't do a pile of provider led activities. My kids love their independance and have amazing imaginations.

I too would never take my kids to a doc appt or dentist but that is just me.

I also think kids have years of schooling ahead of them. Parents need to be responsible for things too. Why do we need to focus so much on things being educational! They are kids and under the age of 5! Let's have fun and learn as you go!

We all parent differently and we all run our daycares differently and as long as our spots are full, kids and parents happy then that is all that matters.

[Suzie_Homemaker]

Those of you who are "on" your whole day must be exhausted! I am and I don't do a pile of provider led activities. My kids love their independance and have amazing imaginations.

No more so that employment in past. But I would go into office, put head down, work for duration of day, often have sandwich at desk, and come out at end of day - later if deadline need meet.

During nap time, prep for afternoon and it one task at time, and no multi tasking for 2 hours. So much longer break than used to.




Parents need to be responsible for things too. Why do we need to focus so much on things being educational! They are kids and under the age of 5! Let's have fun and learn as you go!


Agreed. Parent can teach about boredom on lined up bank and grocery shop. Learning through fun incredibly important. Free play with supervision until all here, into yard for more play, sensory activities, snacks, singing ABC's, counting sheep in field, counting eggs in basket, noticing this weeks colour on walk, seeing wildlife around, dance party using colour mats, finding the cars in play foam, "chiselling" action figure from ice block (co-ordination, goal focus), math through measuring ingredient for lunch, set up lemonade stall for toys for math and money skills for paying and change. Real learning through real play.


we all run our daycares differently and as long as our spots are full, kids and parents happy then that is all that matters. Exactly. My measurement is if parent followed me around all day, would they be getting the service which promised. I just not sure all provider to shop, go bank, wash dog, clean house, prep supper, clean up dander from day care children, would be so comfortable if parent able to see level of personal errands they suggesting they do.



We all parent differently and we all run our daycares differently and as long as our spots are full, kids and parents happy then that is all that matters.[/QUOTE]

[33 Daiseys]

Once again, who says that my dc parents are kept in the dark????? Or that we are not forcoming about what we do. The amount of 20 25 years old that don't know who to cook , or how to budget is insane.
And really whats the difference between teaching children about fruits and veggies and money/math/ budgeting, and taking the child to the store, saying we have 50 dollars this is what we are going to make, what do we need? and having the children take part in planning?

[crayolamom]

ummmmm not to stir the pot but i run errands all the time. as well as take kids to the doctors and yes the dentist. if my kids have a cleaning, im still there to read a book to them color ect. We run to the grocery store when the kids help pick out which fruit and veggies they want for the next week. It is a block from where we go to play group so why not?
We also go to the bank every friday morning. It takes less then five minutes, and it is right beside the library, where we go to story time.
I also cook and do laundry, paper work during nap time. I have some clients that are here at 7 am, and others that can stay as late as 8 pm. On those days, they also come to soccer, Dance classes, ect.
This is a major part of why all of my families come to me. The fact that we are out of the house and in society every day. Just a question, When children in day care get older, will they not have to get up and go to school, work, ect? So why is it viewed as harmful that they start learning these things at an early age.
Could this mentality of shelter everything for children be why the 20 year olds of today don't know how to do anything? Could it be from their daycare providers and parents doing everything with out their children? Not picking a fight but after speaking to a few child shrinks this has come up time and time again.

So why are you even getting paid. Your on the Suzie band wagon but look at what you do. You drag other peoples children around for your own personal errands that you think you are entitled to run on someone elses dollar lol I didn't realize that running personal errands is part of the preschool curriculum. Then you want to add 2 cents in about what we do. Give me a break! What 5 Little Monkeys was talking about I get that. But me personally I would go to bulk barn in the evening and just do it the next day.

I want to know why providers feel entitled to run their errands on someone else's dollar?

Children have their whole lives to work and go to school..we provide a daycare atmosphere for these children and hauling them around to your dentist appointments isn't going to do anything for them. Give me a break!

Also for people complaining how we must be so tired from following a schedule and doing daycare related activities all day blah blah REALLY that's your one and only job and if you can't handle it don't do it!

[superfun]

I really think it's great there are so many different programs for parents to pick from. Some parents want the kids to stay on the property, some parents want their kids out on field trips and excursions. So, we each run our program how we want, and get families that like what we offer. Isn't that one of the reasons we're self employed instead of working in a centre? To provide the experience we want to provide?

[33 Daiseys]

HOW IS IT MY ERRANDS I WOULD LIKE TO KNOW?????? With the exception of a five minute appoint once every 3 minutes which the office is located right next to a local park, and a once a year cleaning for my children, how is it personal??? Everything that I do with them is for their benifit, and I guess i'm just lucky to have parents that are able to see that.
And once again how I am dragging anyone around????
And honey, my opinion is worth a lot more then two cents.
And still I ask you, what is it to you what program I follow, when my children love what we do, and are happy and healthy , and do EXACTLY what my parents that employ me, want.
And before you counter on the dentist thing, cuz i know you will, MY parents have no issue with it, and in fact book their children appoints after my children's appointment, due to the fact i have a great dentist that allows the kids to see what they are doing. They get to sit in the chair, see the tools ect.
So you have never taken your dc kids to your local police station, fire station, building of parliament, local school where band a kids go???
My families come to me due to the fact we are out in the community EVERY DAY.
If its not what you choose to do, or what your parents want fine, fair.
If you are just wanting to fight grow up, and move on. As has been said 10000000 times we each run a program that we want/need to run.

[5 Little Monkeys]

Well for me, I don't think it's a big deal to go out in the community if it is related to daycare or if it's something the kids enjoy. I don't see the difference between picking up some groceries and doing things like laundry, dishes, cleaning, supper prep, sewing family members clothes, weeding the garden, going online during the work day, reading a personal book, paying a bill online, making plans/schedules for your own family etc etc etc. I just fail to see why some think it's okay to do some errands but not others??

Aside from Suzie, I don't know any providers who are ON all day long and NEVER use the washroom while the kids are awake.(how many times have I read on here that nap time is sacred for most and some don't even take kids if they don't nap) I am sure there are things that we all do that others wouldn't agree with but that doesn't make it wrong IMO. If you want to say running errands is bad than I'm assuming you don't use naptime to do anything for personal use or gain EVER?? Because even though they are sleeping you are still being paid...so you should only be doing daycare related things right?

I don't take the kids to the doctors with me but I can almost guarantee that if it came down to me closing or taking them with me, most parents would be 100% fine with me taking them! lol (thankfully, I am able to go to appt's during the day as my husband is my back up when needed, this is a huge selling point with parents)

Again, I am just confused as to why doing some unrelated daycare things are okay and others aren't?

And I know some think it's a load of crap but there really is a lot of learning going on during these outings :) My time in the store is doubled because of it but it's what I'm paid to do (teach the kids) so I'm okay with it. It would be a whole lot easier to do my shopping by myself but I enjoy it just like the kids do. I get that some teach with pretend stuff but why is it so bad to teach them with the real thing from time to time too?

[mickyc]

Totally agree 5LM. If you are being paid to work from the second you open to the second you close then why the paid days off/stats? Why are you online during the day? Do you not answer your phone?

It's all part of the luxury that comes with working from home and running my own business! I am the boss. If I want to take the kids to get groceries then I will.

And if you have to pee - good grief- GO!!! Lol

[dodge__driver11]

Well for me, I don't think it's a big deal to go out in the community if it is related to daycare or if it's something the kids enjoy. I don't see the difference between picking up some groceries and doing things like laundry, dishes, cleaning, supper prep, sewing family members clothes, weeding the garden, going online during the work day, reading a personal book, paying a bill online, making plans/schedules for your own family etc etc etc. I just fail to see why some think it's okay to do some errands but not others??

Aside from Suzie, I don't know any providers who are ON all day long and NEVER use the washroom while the kids are awake.(how many times have I read on here that nap time is sacred for most and some don't even take kids if they don't nap) I am sure there are things that we all do that others wouldn't agree with but that doesn't make it wrong IMO. If you want to say running errands is bad than I'm assuming you don't use naptime to do anything for personal use or gain EVER?? Because even though they are sleeping you are still being paid...so you should only be doing daycare related things right?

I don't take the kids to the doctors with me but I can almost guarantee that if it came down to me closing or taking them with me, most parents would be 100% fine with me taking them!

Ok, I am late to the game, but here is my take on it. When I interview families, I let them know that there is a mix of educational programming, family like activities, and GOD FORBID PERSONAL ERRANDS, AND OR MANAGEMENT OF MY HOME.

I let parents know I am a one man show who needs to wear many hats, and that my own child and husband rely on my to shoulder some of the errands and home management tasks, because if I did not my home would be a disaster. I offer care to shift workers and my hours vary, because I offer hours that are contracted. If I was "on" for all of the hours contracted I would be long dead, and never get anything done that was not daycare related.

If parents want a different type of environment they are free to continue looking, no one is making them choose me. And, if we are honest about how we choose to conduct our programs, what difference does it make?

I actually had one family leave me because they did not want their child setting foot outside the door other than to the local park, and that's fine, her choice, but I quickly found another family that was all to eager to take their space. I was not going to change the way I did and do things in MY HOME.

ETA: For me, it is also about being reliable for the families that chose me, as most of my clients are nurses, etc. If that means having a quiet day in front of the tv with popcorn, and free play because I am sick than so be it.

Here again, I am one person who cannot be "on" all of the time, and if they need a place that never closes then they must wait the average 2 years it takes to obtain a centre space. And, most dayhomes and centre's here have operating hours of 7:30-5pm M-F. So... shift workers are shafted. I fill a much needed niche, and that works for me.

I am pretty sure that if that bulk of us were honest, we all know that we are not 100% "with it" every daycare day, and we all know that we come to forums like this for a break, even Suzie does that. LOL.

ETA again, LOL: Even though I chose to work from home to be with my child, and because I was tired of someone else being the boss... I chose to work from home because of some of the perks that go with it.

Because I am not paid extra for the time it takes me to write ads, email, call current, past and perspective families, develop contract policies, meetings about child progress et all. I figure that doing "My errands" on the daycare clock, are a fair trade off for all the extra time I devote to said tasks.

If another provider is going to lecture me about what I don't do and my lack of professionalism because of that; go nuts, be the coolest keyboard warrior ever. I really don't care, in the end, I sleep well at night knowing that my clients leave happy, and are all to anxious to recommend me, and my "mixed bag" daycare.

No one provider is better than the other, and as long as you are providing safe, honest care, there is no need to put your "I am better than you hat on" just accept that there are different ways. End. :)

[fivelittleones]

Wow, very interesting to read these posts. People are very passionate about their views. lol.

We are not robots, if everyone in the world did things the same way, it would be a very boring place! Different families prefer different things. I know a family who prefers the dayhome to have pets, because they love animals and want their child to feel comfortable with pets/animals. It's the same for shopping/errands. Although, I don't run errands I do think it COULD be used as a learning experience. And for those single mothers who run daycares, they might not have a choice, I can't say that if I was a single parent running a daycare I wouldn't do the same thing. Just a different point of view. Not sure if there are any single parent providers on here, but that is something that would change my view when it comes to running errands.

Bottom line...if the parents are informed about it during the interview and are comfortable with it and the liability issue has been discussed, that's all that matters. The parents are paying for the care and it's up to them. :)

[adaycarelady]

I wasn't feeling very good this morning and didn't know how I was going to get through the day. I'm just a bit burnt out from the school kids being here all summer I think, it's not the flu or anything. I let the kids play first thing in the morning and I relaxed and watched a documentary on cruise ships. That's way better than closing for the day and making parents scramble for daycare. I will now make it through the end of the day feeling much better :) Anyone who can be 'on' every minute they are open deserves a medal cuz it sure gets exhausting at times. That's why I don't make a big deal about parents dropping their kids off on their days off anymore since I know the feeling when you just need a break. I know we are getting paid to be 'on the clock', but it works out to $2-3 per hour per child. Being able to enjoy life is important too. That's the main reason I get chores/errands done during business hours, so I can be free on my off time. I don't want to be scrubbing my toilet on a nice sunny day, I want to take my dog to the park! When I browse through ads for local daycare, I always seem to see new daycares pop up. Older daycares must get burnt out and close down I'm thinking. I've seen 2 daycares close down just in my area since I opened. That's why I like to have a balance of child-adult interactions and peer-peer interactions so I don't deplete myself to the point of no return. Burn out is a serious issue for daycare workers and we need to take precautions before it's too late. I'd have no problem running my dayhome like a classroom from open to close if I had the holidays like a teacher to recharge. But when my dayhome is open for 10 hours and I only take a week off per year (and stats of course) that is not going to happen. All my family and friends wonder how I have been doing what I do for 6 years since they understand how exhausting kids can be. Sometimes you just have to take care of your own needs and that's how I do it. I wouldn't be doing this still if I was 'on' all day. I hope to be one of those rare people (that I have noticed anyways) that can say they have had their dayhome for 20 years + so can't get burnt out.

[Van]

I don't go out with my children as I have 4 infant/toddlers but I understand why someone would and yes I agree with all of you who do, as we only have so many hours in a day and if you can fit a bit of shopping in the day that helps free up your time when you are off the clock

[daycarewhisperer]

http://www.daycare.com/nannyde/transporting-daycare-kids.htm

[TinyTwigs]

That was a really good thread but what works for someone may not work for someone else. Reading through this thread and the past post I fee like a lot of people complain about being stuck in a house and doing daycare related activities/education all day long. I don't get it because I use to be a police officer in the past and I use to see they worst of the worst on a day to day basis now that job was hard and exhausting. Give me some crafts a pepa the pig and we are good for the day! Our jobs a really amazing and compared to other jobs that people do it's really not that bad.

I think it's awesome that people run errands if they can get away with it. But for me there's no way I am going anywhere! I love working from home and the thought of driving around with 5 kids gives me shivers ugh!

I know some people say we work really long hours. I work a 12 hour day and yes it is long but it use to be the name thing in my previous jobs when I worked 7:30-4:30. With getting ready and transportation and dropping kids off to daycare than picking everyone up it was all in all around 12 hours once again!

[5 Little Monkeys]

It was a very one sided view on it though. I think a better article would be from someone who has done both and could provide pros and cons to both sides of the coin. JMO

I'm sure there are providers out there like the article talks about but I do really believe (or maybe hope!) that most aren't like this. We do a bit of outings (car outings definitely more in the summer) with the odd errand thrown in whereas the article is talking about a provider who does errands with the odd dc outing thrown in.

Just an observation I've noticed....dcp's who use vehicles don't really care if those who don't, don't but the ones who don't use vehicles are so against those that do.....reminds me of when parents talk about breast feeding or bottle feeding lol

[Crayola kiddies]

Keep in in mind the article was written 8 years ago