Is Discipline Non-Existent These Days?

[daycarewhisperer]

I would have to disagree somewhat. No I don't think we are busier per say but the lives we lead are so very different than that time it's comparing apples to oranges. No we don't have to chop wood, and wash laundry by hand but in the same token neither did they have 1.5 hour long daily commutes or parent teacher meetings. Society itself has also changed and life is less family/home-centric. Gone are the days of 6 kids at home HELPING mom wash laundry and dad chop wood. Parents nowadays balance tasks that are just as time consuming and do it without help because it's things kids can't do. Grandparents are less support because they themselves are often working.

Raising kids is tough regardless of if you were doing in now, 50 years or or 100 years ago. It's just tough in different ways.

Gone are the days of parents having to MAKE 6 kids at home HELP mom wash laundry and dad chop wood. For every bit of survival and living chores that were given to the children to do there was a parent there saying you MUST. Telling them NO they can't not do it. Telling them you won't HAVE food if you don't do this. And remember too that the kids who worked at home had school also and often a very long hike back and forth to school. They had LONG days of family work, school, and family work. Also the mom of six HAD infant, toddler, preschooler (kid one, two, three) without any older kid to help. We have parents who have infant, toddler, preschooler for the most part.

So yes... this generation has it WAY easy compared to our foremothers and forefathers. We need to get a grip and stop saying how HARD this is. It isn't. It's work but it's not HARD work compared to our grandparents, great grands, etc.

[Toregone]

Gone are the days of parents having to MAKE 6 kids at home HELP mom wash laundry and dad chop wood. For every bit of survival and living chores that were given to the children to do there was a parent there saying you MUST. Telling them NO they can't not do it. Telling them you won't HAVE food if you don't do this. And remember too that the kids who worked at home had school also and often a very long hike back and forth to school. They had LONG days of family work, school, and family work. Also the mom of six HAD infant, toddler, preschooler (kid one, two, three) without any older kid to help. We have parents who have infant, toddler, preschooler for the most part.

So yes... this generation has it WAY easy compared to our foremothers and forefathers. We need to get a grip and stop saying how HARD this is. It isn't. It's work but it's not HARD work compared to our grandparents, great grands, etc.

Sorry but I'm still going to have to disagree. Yes I see your point but it's still apples to oranges. I'm sure that just as I look back through history and say to myself "Holy crap that seems hard!" if my great grands were able to peek into the future and comprehend the lives we live they would say the same.

But that's a discussion for a different post. This thread is about disipline and yes I feel that whatever the reasoning (societal pressure, lack of time, laziness.. whatever you think the reason is) disipline has slacked considerably since even I was a child and I'm only 26.

[mumstheword]

I totally feel that there is a lack of discipline today. It's not just discipline though, it's a lack of involved parenting. Kids are not taught respect and manners and acceptable behaviour. Some, Parents have decided they want to be their kids friend. Some are just unaware I think. Some are too busy with work or too into themselves to take the time with their kids.

One of my dc moms is so afraid of a negative reaction from her kid (crying, temper tantrum, hitting, yes a 5 year old that hits her parents), that she pretty much gives into everything. She bargains with the kid, or bribes her or begs her. It's absurd to watch. Sometimes I just sit back and watch in awe. Sometimes I step in and take control of the situation. First, I want them out of my house and can not stand listening to them, second if the other kids are still hear they watch and learn from her and try to pull the same shit with their parents or worse me.
This Mother is a teacher! Wow, hope she can control her class better than she can her own kid. It blows my mind how an educated woman who works with kids can let her daughter act the way she does. Can't wait to see how charming this girl will be as a teenager. Oh and this mother also picks her child up at the very last minute before I close, even though she has been home for an hour and a half. The parents went on vacation and sent the kid to the daycare the entire time. They just don't want to spend time with her and she knows it.

I have another Mother that is completely clueless as to how to discipline her son. She is so overwhelmed with his behaviour that she is still sending him to me for full time daycare while she is on maternity leave with her new child. She is always surprised when I tell her that he was good for me, or that he didn't pull the crap with me that he pulls with her. She says that he won't go to bed or he won't eat or he won't listen. I said "what do you mean he won't? Does he have a choice? Who is in control here?" she laughs and says him. I said, yes and he knows it, that's your whole problem.

My children are not perfect by any means and either am I. But I put in a full effort (most of the time, I am human and have bad days or moments). I teach them manners and respect and do not tolerate them not using them. You will only see my kids pull a temper tantrum in the store once because they will get the message loud and clear that temper tantrums are not acceptable and will not be tolerated. My dd tried one once when I wouldn't buy her a treat. I was halfway through my shopping with a load of stuff in my cart. I was also in a hurry as we had company coming for dinner. I warned her once that if she didn't stop that behaviour immediatly that not only was she not getting a treat when we shop, EVER again , but she will also be taken home and put to bed and will miss out on the visit with friends. Well she kept going so I took her out of the cart, drove her home, put her in her room and she did not get to come down and play with the company, she only came out for dinner (which ended up being order in because I didn't have any food after leaving it at the store.) I explained to the company that I was sorry but teaching my child a lesson was priority and they laughed about it and were fine. My dd has never again pulled a temper tantrum in a store and now she's not allowed to ask for a treat, she has to wait and see if one is offered.

[kidlove]

I do feel....people MAKE their lives ,busier and more hectic than they need to be. The ONLY reason parents today are "strung out" "tired" "stressed"...... ..is exactly what sunnydays stated above. parents are BOTH EMPLOYED (not all NEED to be) , rushing home, fast food dinner (no more family time), then change and off to "extra-curricular activities" (too many these days) and bring work home on "blackberries/computer" (enough is enough) work can't be left at work? kids can't be kids? Moms can't be Moms? That is what is wrong, lets get the world back to basics and off the highly advanced, highly educated "over drive". spend more time "spending time" and less time "waisting time". Then WE wouldn't be "so tired" that we can't even muster the energy to raise our kids proper.

[Momof4]

I'm sorry, but I also disagree with you daycarewhisperer. I grew up in the days when I came home from school, got supper on the table because my parents were farmers, so I think I can speak to the example you are using. We all worked together to keep home and family together, picking tomatoes and hoeing the soya beans. But we played outside with our friends all the time because it was before the age of technology and had lots of free time and family time too. All my clothes were made by my Mom and our food was healthy because we grew our own garden, canned, pickled, you name it.

Ok, then when I raised my children here in the city I was flabbergasted as technology took over in the 80's and 90's and I didn't have a clue how wild city kids can be either. I grew up a sheltered hick kid! So as my children learned new and interesting teenage issues I learned them too.

Now, my daughters are protecting their sons because they know how bad it can be growing up in the age of technology.

Mumstheword, I love that you said this:

I totally feel that there is a lack of discipline today. It's not just discipline though, it's a lack of involved parenting. Kids are not taught respect and manners and acceptable behaviour. Some, Parents have decided they want to be their kids friend. Some are just unaware I think. Some are too busy with work or too into themselves to take the time with their kids.

[daycarewhisperer]

I'm sorry, but I also disagree with you daycarewhisperer. I grew up in the days when I came home from school, got supper on the table because my parents were farmers, so I think I can speak to the example you are using. We all worked together to keep home and family together, picking tomatoes and hoeing the soya beans. But we played outside with our friends all the time because it was before the age of technology and had lots of free time and family time too. All my clothes were made by my Mom and our food was healthy because we grew our own garden, canned, pickled, you name it.

Can I ask what would have happened if you and your siblings said no to the work? What if you all refused to do it? Was it an option to "help" or not "help"? Did your parents tell you to do it and you could then decide for yourself if you would or wouldn't?

[kidlove]

We live a "farm" life, as much as you can in this world. Ha ha, my kids are "hick kids", we love the fact that they are not influenced by "city kids" (the ones you speak of momof4) I love the fact that my kids get off the bus and ride their bikes together (sister and brother). I choose who comes over to play...I control the friend list. My children also "help out" around the house and with our animals and in the garden. They are not worked to the bone, but they understand it takes all of us to have this life, and 9 times out of 10...they "do" with out an arguement...1) because they are told to and they have respect for us. and 2) because they understand, Mom can't do it all....and they have respect for us. 3) they enjoy this life, really enjoy helping out. My children are not given a "choice" when asked/told to do things around the house, please make your bed, please pick the tomatoes, please set the table, please feed the animals. A family is a family because they all work together. The Mom doesn't cater to all, (all the time) the children need to pull their weight too.......in todays world maybe too many parents aren't making their kids responsible, in turn, making their kids think, THEY are the one in control?

[daycarewhisperer]

We live a "farm" life, as much as you can in this world. Ha ha, my kids are "hick kids", we love the fact that they are not influenced by "city kids" (the ones you speak of momof4) I love the fact that my kids get off the bus and ride their bikes together (sister and brother). I choose who comes over to play...I control the friend list. My children also "help out" around the house and with our animals and in the garden. They are not worked to the bone, but they understand it takes all of us to have this life, and 9 times out of 10...they "do" with out an arguement...1) because they are told to and they have respect for us. and 2) because they understand, Mom can't do it all....and they have respect for us. 3) they enjoy this life, really enjoy helping out. My children are not given a "choice" when asked/told to do things around the house, please make your bed, please pick the tomatoes, please set the table, please feed the animals. A family is a family because they all work together. The Mom doesn't cater to all, (all the time) the children need to pull their weight too.......in todays world maybe too many parents aren't making their kids responsible, in turn, making their kids think, THEY are the one in control?

I love this post.

[Momof4]

Can I ask what would have happened if you and your siblings said no to the work? What if you all refused to do it? Was it an option to "help" or not "help"? Did your parents tell you to do it and you could then decide for yourself if you would or wouldn't?

I don't think any of us ever considered not helping or doing our chores. That happened with my children a lot though. I respected my parents completely and knew how hard they worked. My children were asking for supper before I even got in the door and took off my high heels & set down my briefcase. But when I was a child if you misbehaved at school you got the strap across your hand. My children were told at school that I wasn't supposed to discipline them. That is the difference. Also, it was the four of my little monkeys against me alone.