Finger sucking and non-talking 3.5 year old ( venting!!!)

[Momof4]

I have to say that I do believe we have a certain responsibility to the child. While we aren't the parent, as a caregiver, we have a duty to the child to pass on our observations to the parent's. What they do with that information is entirely down to them but then we have played our role to is fullest by passing this info on. If we don't say anything, then we aren't helping but potentially making it worse IMO. I imagine that a lot of parents who lash out at people saying something is up with their child, or implying there is, are being given opinions and feelings versus just supplying them with the fact. They do not want to hear from an unqualified person what they think is wrong with their child. I'd be defensive and bitchy with that person too. This obviously is easier said than done, but what if nobody brings it up till the child goes to school. It is that much harder to deal with the later it is caught. Also very early detection of learning disabilities, e.g autism, can be treated easier.(I am not saying that is what is going on with this child) In the US, paediatricians who are trained in this area can refer the child to a specialist who works on retraining and reprogramming the brain. I hope this can be implemented in Canada too as it will make a huge difference to the lives of the children and their families. If caregivers didn't report these things, then the parents who were open to exploring extra help would not have an opportunity to do so. I feel staying quiet does a disservice to the child. I could still sleep better at night after getting an earbashing from a parent knowing that I did everything I could than if I stayed silent. I've just learn't that there is an appropriate way to get this info across.

Oh, I completely agree with you and I have a verbal update of our day and chat with the parents about any and all of my concerns but what I mean is that if the parent, as in the case here where mlle.c. is pretty sure the Mom is not going to help out, should she make the Mom mad at her by talking about the problem? Like I said you have to know your audience. Yes, we should always tell the parents what we see and explain that we see things from a group care perspective and they see things from a parental perspective. But we have to be careful not to insult their parenting or we are going to be the bad guys, you know?

Once I've told a parent about a problem several times and see that they don't really agree with me I just keep doing the work during daycare hours and hope to see progress and pat myself on the back because I'm never going to get any appreciation from a parent like that.

Case in point: I have a little boy turning 2 this month who is not making progress in one area and I told the Dad about it over the course of a few months at pickup and last week his answer was: he's just a baby. So I am not bringing it up to him any more. This boy is 'being babied' at home which is a big part of the problem, but I'm continuing to show him that I expect great things from him at daycare and he's becoming more and more self-sufficient for me. I think we all can relate to this case.

[bright sparks]

But we have to be careful not to insult their parenting or we are going to be the bad guys, you know?

Absolutly! Unfortunatly, we will always be the bad guy. Generally the first to report these types of things are the ones to bear the brunt of the initial defenses the parents throw up, and It's not usually pretty. Even if this happens though, its part of the process for the parent. They may need to hear the same things brought up from numerous different people before they are able to accept it or let their guard down long enough to think, wow this isn't the first time this has been brought to my attention. Hence why I use the screening tests. Its not me telling them, its a piece of literature based on observations made and has nothing attatched to it which comes from my opinions, experiences or feelings to make it complicated. I think if a parents screams and shouts at me initially its not nice, but I put myself in their shoes and it's the most natural thing to do and initially, yes their judgment will be clouded. Its part of the difficult process of being a parent of a Special Needs and/or LD child. Whats the saying?? "No that could never happen to my child"

[Inspired by Reggio]

Brights ~ have you found that with using the screening tool as the buffer you are still having parents who gets 'upset'?

I have not had any issues with sharing concerns with a client via the checklist approach ... denial sure but never in a conflicted manner where they are made a ME or anything for example it is more of a 'oh we do not see that at home ~ at home he says all those words just fine' even when the kid is standing beside us earlier that day 'mumbling' words incoherently the parent is 'hearing' what they want to hear cause they are use to the 'incorrect speech' as that kids normal but at least that than leaves me doing the 'oh really well that is good to know he has mastered that in the home setting ~ perhaps it is an environmental issue where it is harder to master that in the group setting as his friends and I struggle to understand him still so we will keep working on that here than and keep you informed of changes ~ if you keep working on clear pronunciation of words at home than hopefully it will help him master them here here too'.

After all we can only lead a horse to water we cannot force them to drink!

[bright sparks]

Brights ~ have you found that with using the screening tool as the buffer you are still having parents who gets 'upset'?

No upset parents at all. When they sign their contract and find out that I do this, they are generally suprised as its not expected for me to do this. It's as though they think I am going above and beyond as its a rarety that providers do this.(obviously because providers don't know that these resources are available.) They are extremely thankful, even the parents who don't seem like they give two hoots. It really skips a lot of stress on my part, worrying how I would word things to people and what their reactions would be. Some parents will then talk more in depth and press me for more information and thats great while others don't say much. I send a copy home with them and keep a copy on file. I then email or send letters home from time to time with regards to "areas needing attention", so they know I haven't forgotten what came up and to let them know that I am working on them with their child and whether or not progress is being made. If the parents aren't enthusiastic about working with me then I just stay focused on the child and give them 100%.

[mlle.coccinelle]

Well, little update on this, I had a talk with the mom a week ago about a week ago about the finger sucking. I told her that it had to stop because its first not sanitary (... she is always sick!!) and that my son and other kids started to suck on their fingers ( and we didnt have this problem before..) So we agreed that everytime she put's her finger in her mouth... she has to tell her : No S.. you are not a baby, dont put your fingers in your mouth... Since she understand very well that she is not suposed to do it... ( she hides now...) we are telling her 3 times then its a time out.

Now, I don't think that her mom is doing it at home... Usually by the end of the week... she only does it 2-3 times a day... but when monday comes back around we have to start all over again! it is so frustrating!

the mom explained to me that when she was younger, they had to tape her hands while she was eating because she would put her fingers in her mouth between every mouthful... So that's probably why she doesn't close her mouth when she eats, and it explains the drool!

She is gone on holidays until December 1st so i will do the developmental screening chart when she comes back...

Thank you ladies so much for your help! maybe I will stop having Gray hair about it eventually! AHAH!

[playfelt]

I was going to say that just because a child does a certain behaviour at home does not mean we need to let them do it at daycare. Kids even that are very young will master having different rules at different places as long as whatever rules we have are always consistent for us. This includes things like having a soother all day, or not taking a nap or not banging hot wheels cars together or whatever rules we want to make.

Sometimes that is where I start as in to see if I can break the habit at daycare and as long as there is some improvement over the week even if it gets undone on the weekend then I relax a bit. It is when that doesn't work that I am more likely to bring it up with the parents. Often I will change the behaviour at daycare and then bring up the fact that the child can go without the soother all day or the fingers in the mouth or hold their own bottle. I like to go under the assumption that I don't know the child does this at home - or conveniently forgot and just dealt with it at daycare. Often too once the habit is gone at daycare the child weans themselves at home assuming the parent lets them ie doesn't stuff the soother in their mouth as soon as they walk in the door at pick up and realize the child doesn't have it. That is when I step in and can say oh we are a big girl now and we don't use a soother at daycare anymore. I don't mention that it has been a month since we used it. It is then up to the parent to do something about it at home. Once the child starts school the teacher will have the same expectations as daycare so again two systems will work.

It may take a few months once the hand is gone before you notice more use of sounds. So come January if you still see issues then that is the time to mention something. I often use the JK registration time to mention issues as it gives me an excuse to have been thinking about things either for those going to school in Sept or the following year as in gee we will have to think about getting ready.

[Momof4]

Playfelt is right. The second my hand sucker comes in the door with his hand in his mouth I start pulling it out and reminding him that he's putting sick germs in his mouth, please don't do that. Does his Mom ever do that? I doubt it, but at least she's seeing my example and that's all I can do. But at daycare his rule is that hand sucking and finger sucking is not a good behaviour. I talk to the children a lot about all kinds of safety and cleanliness and keeping germs out of your mouth is actually safety in my opinion.

[playfelt]

Making the habit inconvenient for the child works sometimes too. Such as for the hand sucker set up a dish with a wet cloth in it and a towel and every time you catch him send him to wash. After a few times it gets old quickly and he misses out on things and well too bad you missed your turn. He is old enough to be made to miss out - sorry XXX I can't let you have a turn to hold the book or touch the felt pieces because your hands are wet. You need to stop putting them in your mouth. They are not food. Keep it very matter of fact but it draws it to the child's attention. A lot of times the child just forgets and does the behaviour instinctively. Always being on top of him and sending him to deal with it and wash hopefully will associate something negative with the behaviour and over time he will start to self correct. I don't however praise the child for not doing something like that because I find that has the opposite effect and puts the idea back in the child's head. You don't praise the other children for not sucking on their hands so why this child.

[sunnydays]

I don't have any better advice that all of the excellent advice the ladies here have already given you, but I just have to comment on what the parents told you. They actually taped her hands down?????!!!! This is the kind of parenting that has probably made the problem worse. They have made a huge issue of it and created a lot of negative emotions around it. Does she eat okay now? I would think taping hands down would create a very negative eating environment among other things Very sad!

[mlc1982]

I have a little one who I truly believe he is behind in many ways. I have the screening tests and have answered 'no' to many of the questions here for him. I've mentioned little stuff to mom but nothing in great detail. He is very babied at home and I wonder if that's part of the problem. From a friends experience, I don't want to be the one to falsley 'label' him as having an issue, but from reading this post I feel like I need to say more.

What would be my best way to go about introducing the screening tests to parents so that this kid is not singled out? Overall, I think it's a great idea for all the kids and something the parents should be thankful for, but I just don't want it to seem weird that I'm all of a sudden starting this.