Just For The Record......

[Judy Trickett]

The thread has been closed to comment. I think we all know which thread I am talking about. Anyway, I want to make it clear that a dcparent coming on to a PUBLIC site and saying negative, defamatory things is not considered a "review" or "free-speech". According to Canadian Law (and taken from the Canada Law Society):

What is defamation?

Defamation is communication about a person that tends to hurt the person's reputation. Defamation is a strict liability tort, which means that the intentions of the defamer are not relevant. The communication must be made to other people, not just to the person it's about. The statement must be false to be classified as defamation. If it is spoken, then defamation is termed “slander". If it is written, it is termed “libel”. It can also be a gesture, which is a type of slander.

The law protects your reputation against defamation. If someone defames you, you can sue them to pay money (called “damages”) for harming your reputation. You have to sue in Supreme Court, not Provincial Court, and you have to sue within 2 years of the defamation. It is not relevant the timing of when you discovered the defamation. Rather, the limitation period commences on the date the defamatory statement was made or published. For more on the court system, check script 432, called “Our Court System and Solving Disputes.”

The law doesn't protect you from a personal insult or a remark that injures only your pride; it protects reputation, not feelings. So if someone calls you a lazy slob, you might be hurt, but you probably don't have a good reason to sue. If he goes on to say you cheat in your business dealings, you probably do have a good reason to sue, as long as he says it to someone else, not just to you. If he says it only to you, you can't sue because he has not hurt your reputation.

As providers we need to start standing up to parents who go out on a limb to purposely hurt our livelihood. We ALL know that the truth usually lies somewhere in the middle and NO parent, regardless of how upset they are, has the RIGHT to publicly defame a provider. If the problems incurred at a daycare were THAT bad then there are proper authoritative entities to contact and report to. Taking grievances to a public forum is ILLEGAL. And as providers we need to start tagging parents for doing this. They do it because we LET them do it. We need to stop being pushovers.

It's NOT okay.

[mamaof4]

Here is the issue- "Must be false"

How do we know if the problems were false or not?
We all know that kids get colds (as do adults), the get diaper rashes, and they get dirty (playing is hard work!)

It is not illegal to post what actually happened as she perceived it too. Someone withdrew her kid from a daycare because she got diaper rashes and posted about it? Fine. As long as the rashes actually happened it is not slander or libel or defamation.

Same goes for colds or being dirty. If it actually happened its not defamation.

[dodge__driver11]

Yes Judy THANK YOU SO MUCH!!

Free speech? So you're telling me that if someone posts a one sided bad review of my dc using my business name that it will be left up???? Because they did not use my first and last name?? Its not like term'ed parents or some that leave do not have an axe to grind!!

That was not free speech, that was a post intending to hurt this lady and her livelyhood, and because you allowed (mod) her post to remain up, I am not sure if I can enjoy this site anymore...

[jammiesandtea]

I agree 100% with Judy, and I strongly feel that the moderators of this forum should edit and remove all references to the specific daycare name from the review/defamation post.

When the daycare name is searched/googled online, these threads are coming up on the first page, and that is shameful. Moderators, do the right thing and remove the daycare name from the posts. Locking the posts or closing them to comments while leaving them publicly viewable is NOT a "solution".

I will also add that IF the daycare provider and owner of this business chooses to pursue her legal options against this parent, AND daycarebear, I will support her in any way I can, by providing my recollections as someone who followed the whole thing closely and saved COPIES of every post in the thread.

Remove the daycare business name!

[sunnydays]

WE do not know if it is false or not, BUT the provider in question DOES know. If these claims are indeed false as it would appear, then she has a case and can sue if she has documented these posts. It may be hard to prove though...how is the judge going to know for sure who is telling the truth? Unfortunately, I am sure there are all kind of "reviews" out there of businesses (using the name of the business) that may or may not be "true" or may be just one point of view. I don't think it is illegal to post reviews online of businesses. I hope that parents who have read the thread will also have read the provider's eloquent post and can decide for themselves...go and meet the provider...call her references, etc.

Here is the issue- "Must be false"

How do we know if the problems were false or not?
We all know that kids get colds (as do adults), the get diaper rashes, and they get dirty (playing is hard work!)

It is not illegal to post what actually happened as she perceived it too. Someone withdrew her kid from a daycare because she got diaper rashes and posted about it? Fine. As long as the rashes actually happened it is not slander or libel or defamation.

Same goes for colds or being dirty. If it actually happened its not defamation.

[mamaof4]

If it is posted in the forum- I am able to edit and delete things- anywhere else on the site is beyond my control..

Prior to this incident, we did not have a policy on naming names- obviously now we are working on one that will protect both sides- providers and parents. When it is finished we will post it as an announcement to the board as a whole.

[momofnerds]

Here is the issue- "Must be false"

How do we know if the problems were false or not?
We all know that kids get colds (as do adults), the get diaper rashes, and they get dirty (playing is hard work!)




It is not illegal to post what actually happened as she perceived it too. Someone withdrew her kid from a daycare because she got diaper rashes and posted about it? Fine. As long as the rashes actually happened it is not slander or libel or defamation.

Same goes for colds or being dirty. If it actually happened its not defamation.

just because the provider came on and said all those things doesn't mean she's telling the truth either. There are threads every day about how bad parents are, heck there is one about diapers right now. There are bad providers too, they look and sound all nice on the outside but when the doors close its a different story.
also, maybe the mom was frustrated we DON'T KNOW. I can't believe how many providers ASSUMED that the mother was wrong. We were not there at the interview, we don't know what is in the contract either.
Yes we need to stand up for what we do, but in this situation there are way too many missing parts.

[mamaof4]

We do have copies as well from every edit made to posts.

The name of the dayhome was removed from the thread title.

[sunnydays]

While I am with you on the not jumping to conclusions one way or another, I do have to say it is different when providers complain about parents because I have NEVER seen any of them use a parent or a child's name on the forum...and I am sure it would have been removed if they had.

just because the provider came on and said all those things doesn't mean she's telling the truth either. There are threads every day about how bad parents are, heck there is one about diapers right now. There are bad providers too, they look and sound all nice on the outside but when the doors close its a different story.
also, maybe the mom was frustrated we DON'T KNOW. I can't believe how many providers ASSUMED that the mother was wrong. We were not there at the interview, we don't know what is in the contract either.
Yes we need to stand up for what we do, but in this situation there are way too many missing parts.

[jammiesandtea]

We do have copies as well from every edit made to posts.

The name of the dayhome was removed from the thread title.

That is a start, but I don't think removing it only from the title is enough to make it disappear from google/yahoo searches. Removing the name from each post where it appears would accomplish it though.