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Thread: Just a vent...

  1. #1
    Euphoric ! bright sparks's Avatar
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    Just a vent...

    I'm tired, close to burn out...xmas break off can't come quick enough, and really I just need to offload. I know there is no quick fix and I'm doing everything I can but some days, like today and most recently every day, I'd gladly trade this job in for anything else. Funny how 1 child can make or break the day, for everyone.

    I have a 3 1/2 yr old boy, lovely kid who I have 4 days a week which for me is full time. I have been with this family for 5 years as I had their daughter, now in SK since age 1 also.

    This family split a year ago and it has definitely had a significant impact on both kids. Father is very unstable and mom is having a hard time. I am friends with this mother and spend time with the three of them outside of daycare hours. She has never been a good disciplinary IMO, obviously everyone has different ways, and I think I am more sensitive to this as I have obviously invested a lot into these kids to see it almost always get undone. On my head be it for having a personal relationship with them too. I generally manage it but now her son is causing so much conflict, I've just about had it. He is your typical 3 year old and he is just acting out, I understand, but no matter what I do it's not getting better, in fact its actually getting worse. Mom is at a loss, and I think she is overwhelmed by so much guilt with the separation of the family it ends up preventing her further from putting her foot down with the kids. When the siblings are together they are so naughty, and need a good telling off, but she never does so they just carry on.

    Here, he is running and bulldozing kids down. 22mth old bit a chunk out of his tongue last week because he got knocked down and yesterday the 3 yr old smacked his lip on the stare gate. Now whenever I leave the room to use the bathroom or prep drinks/snack or lunch, he has to come with me because I can not turn my back for a minute. He takes toys from other kids, usually involving an elbow jab to them and then doesn't play with the toys just holds on to it so no one else can have it. He wont take turns and after an hour today of asking to take turns, I said isn't it nice to share with our friends, and he turned around and said to me "no, it isn't"!! He is fantastic when he is one on one, or in a group he is centre of attention, but I'm not going to set every situation up like that because it's avoiding these situations not dealing with them by helping him learn. He is a little hyper so I try to take them out daily to burn some of that energy off, but I know this child really well and he is hyper, not just high energy. He is basically angry, grumpy or starts crying for a parent if he is not the centre of my attention. At pick up times he literally shouts over me talking to other parents, trying to gain my attention and I politely remind him to sit quietly on the step with the other children while I'm talking to someone else, but less than a minute later he is shouting again, resulting in grumpy child who then shouts and growls at the other parents. I've managed to get that under control but some days I find that he gets so much of my attention because of these things. Today I asked him to play independently, giving him some options which didn't involve me and he proceeded to shout that he doesn't want to play and doesn't want to read, and sat glaring at me, which I ignored but then because he isn't getting my attention, he starts to terrorize the other kids as mentioned above which then makes them cry and get upset.

    Now I am not a push over, I am strict and very consistent with discipline. I give lots of positive reassurance and recognition, but I also don't let them get away with anything. Rules are rules and all kids seem to get with the program quickly. He has been great up until the separation and then in the last few months its becoming increasingly difficult and behaviour is becoming more of an issue. I'm sure its a combination of his age too and testing limits, especially when he has so many people he can manipulate and try to get his own way with due to them feeling guilty.

    This whole situation makes for an incredibly difficult day and is starting to negatively impact the group as I have a nearly 2 year old who copies everything he does. I can't even do an activity with the group at the moment without him causing some kind of havoc. This kid stuck calculator buttons up his nose on Saturday and was in the hospital...he is 3 and a 1/2 and knows the difference between right and wrong but seems to be totally out of sorts in so many areas right now. It's like he is defiant just because. We manage for the most part, but this morning was particularly difficult.

    When I relay back to his mother she is genuinely upset and disappointed but I think our differences in parenting are sometimes an obstacle because when she asks me what she should do, she doesn't take my advice. Don't offer the kid stickers and a freezy for sticking calculator buttons up his nose. That is not something worth rewarding because you feel mothers guilt about your son doing this. Don't repeat yourself a million times when your children fight with each other. Use a stern tone, physically remove them, offer consequences for there behaviour, not passive verbal pleads and bribes....I could go on and on. Up until recently he behaved differently here to at home because he knows I have zero tolerance, now he couldn't give a crap and while he is a lovely boy and I know it is obviously a rough time he is going through, it is growing more and more difficult to do this, day in and day out.

    I just keep trying and hoping that each day will be better.

  2. #2
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    Yes !! Some days are just too much ! Sounds like you have a good handle on his behaviour and like you said just needed to get your frustrations out ! I've had days like this for sure !! I'm closing in less than two weeks and will really miss it !!
    There's not a lot that can be done if the parent is not on board but stick to your rules and make him mind them . I've had parents say they wished their child acted the same at their house as mine !
    I get frustrated with the treat thing !! Right now I have siblings that get a lollipop every day they behave at my house ! Why this bothers me ? They aren't my kids and it has helped in their behaviour but it's ....??
    I've had days like yours too !!! Just telling it to others that "get it " makes you feel better !!!

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  4. #3
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    That sucks bright. It really does only take one child to make things difficult. I had a difficult child this summer who made me want to quit this altogether. Then he left...and everything changed. I only wished I would have given him the boot sooner. His mother was also the type to seem genuinely concerned yet would turn around and not do much to help me out.

    Maybe it's time to have a heart to heart with mom about everything you listed and start throwing some options at her like preschool, different daycare etc. maybe she would take you more seriously if you hinted or flat out told her how miserable he is making you?

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  6. #4
    Euphoric ! bright sparks's Avatar
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    I spoke to mum. Didn't get any real idea of how she was going to help manage his behaviour and I really didn't know what to suggest aside from zero tolerance, but I get the impression it was just a sheep staring back at me nodding. My idea of zero tolerance is in all likelihood different from hers. She said that when he is very grumpy she sends him to play on his own in his room. In some situations I'd be okay with that. Everyone has the right to be grumpy and directing a child to take some alone time is a good thing versus punishment for feeling that way. That being said, is she doing this after an incident too...who knows, but then there is the problem, there are little to no consequences. Being sent to your room to play with toys isn't a negative consequence in my opinion. Mum was really just speechless a lot as I told her while her son was walking round her in circles trying to rip her keys and lanyard out of her hand, while she clung on to them, instead of getting down to his level and taking control of the situation by telling him firmly that he must stop, and making him stop. Everything is a bribe or negotiation. And then every other weekend that they are dads place they pretty much spend their time being paraded round toy shops and return to mums place on the Sunday like its Xmas or birthday time with a bunch of new toys and sore bellies from junk food. It's no wonder the kids are all over the place, but mum needs to try something different to curb this behaviour with her son when it's effecting the others. She left my front porch saying, lets hope this phase passes quickly. Doesn't sound like much of an investment to work on behaviour changes SIGH!!

    Lets just hope that today is a better day. It felt mildly better to vent but I'm unfortunately feeling pessimistic about it being any better today. I'm up early after a late evening at my daughters grade 8 high school open house and feeling zapped already. I'm going to rotate some toys and move the room round a little and have playdoh set up for arrivals. Hopefully just a simple change like that may start the day off more positively and hopefully we wont all be terrorized by him.

  7. #5
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    "Let's hope this phase passes soon." That is your red flag right there that she isn't admitting there is an actual PROBLEM here she just thinks she can wait it out. It doesn't sound like she is planning on doing anything at all....

    Waiting around hoping that today will be better doesn't sound like a healthy option either bright. I don't know, but if it were me I would start thinking of an exit plan for this family...

  8. #6
    Expansive... Other Mummy's Avatar
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    Vent away...that's what we are here for to support each other and bounce ideas of one another. I see how you are caught between a rock and hard place. You are friends with the family which makes it a whole other ball game.

    You are not going to get any help from this family with his behaviour. If its really horrid, I would be tempted to end the friendship and let the dcb go. What else can you do?? Is he starting school in September? can you hold out until then? If his behaviour gets worse and he is hurting children then you might be forced into terminating him regardless.

    Sorry you are dealing with this.

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  10. #7
    Euphoric ! bright sparks's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Other Mummy View Post
    Vent away...that's what we are here for to support each other and bounce ideas of one another. I see how you are caught between a rock and hard place. You are friends with the family which makes it a whole other ball game.

    You are not going to get any help from this family with his behaviour. If its really horrid, I would be tempted to end the friendship and let the dcb go. What else can you do?? Is he starting school in September? can you hold out until then? If his behaviour gets worse and he is hurting children then you might be forced into terminating him regardless.

    Sorry you are dealing with this.
    Yes he is off to school in September. Today has been much better, but it is frustrating not knowing what kind of day I'm going to have with his inconsistency.

  11. #8
    Euphoric ! bright sparks's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fun&care View Post
    "Let's hope this phase passes soon." That is your red flag right there that she isn't admitting there is an actual PROBLEM here she just thinks she can wait it out. It doesn't sound like she is planning on doing anything at all....

    Waiting around hoping that today will be better doesn't sound like a healthy option either bright. I don't know, but if it were me I would start thinking of an exit plan for this family...
    I think after investing so much into this child, just because its hard now doesn't really warrant giving up. He would benefit from two caregivers working together not being shuttled off to someone else when the going gets tough. He isn't intentionally setting out to hurt the other kids so it's not like that is his goal and I'm fighting to correct that behaviour. Yes obviously a red flag, which I acknowledged, when mom said she hopes it just passes. So what I ask you then, is what exactly do I say to this parent to get her on board with doing something beyond wishing it will get better? Any suggestions? She is at a loss and I'm not entirely sure what direct advice to give her beyond what I've already said. Something that just popped into my head was how so many people say "we don't have the right to tell a parent how to parent their child" which I tend not to agree with for the most part for these situations precisely. I do have the right to request and advise you that you should try x, y and z if your child's actions are effecting the wellbeing of others. So I'd love some advice on what folks think I should say because I am not about to throw the towel in on a rare 3 yr old spot for starters, a child I've had for nearly 3 years and a family I've dealt with for over 5. I think it would be much better to try and get through to her than looking for an exit plan. At least being friends with her means we can have a bit more of a frank conversation, that being said though, if she says she is trying her best, who is anyone to call her a liar? I ask her what she does in these situations but she basically lets them do what they like as long as they are happy and rough housing in her house is acceptable whereas in my daycare setting it is not. He is getting mixed signals from left right and centre. This child needs consistency not someone else to adapt to. I also need to figure out how to make this work, because financially I can't lose that much money so I'm not looking to terminate just yet.

  12. #9
    Euphoric ! bright sparks's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Other Mummy View Post
    Vent away...that's what we are here for to support each other and bounce ideas of one another. I see how you are caught between a rock and hard place. You are friends with the family which makes it a whole other ball game.

    You are not going to get any help from this family with his behaviour. If its really horrid, I would be tempted to end the friendship and let the dcb go. What else can you do?? Is he starting school in September? can you hold out until then? If his behaviour gets worse and he is hurting children then you might be forced into terminating him regardless.

    Sorry you are dealing with this.
    She is the only daycare parent I have ever been friends with. It happened very gradually and we have terrific boundaries which I am forever grateful for. She has never asked anything extra of me. This is just where we butt heads a little, although not by way of exchanging words but just our styles are different. I am strict and consistent and she totally respects that I do things my way at my house, but she seems to be constantly trying to appease her kids and feels guilty all the time. I can only give her advice, which may in fact not be right for her, but I can not make her change her ways. Even with her best intention she is human and not perfect. She likely is trying her best with everything that is going on but I'm just not sure how to word it when I talk to her about handling him and next steps with this current phase.

    This little guys is very good when he has consistency. The minute daddy fails to collect as promised or its back to mums after a weekend of being spoilt rotten, it all hits the fan. How exactly can mom do anything to control her sons reactions to that stuff. I know she tries hard to maintain consistency but it's like she thinks damage control by way of bribery and pacifying them is her only option. Rarely does she say no either. Tough love I say, but everyone has their different way. Nowadays, parents don't even shout at their kids. Obviously for every little thing, shouting isn't helpful, is cruel and becomes the predictable norm, but when he is super naughty why can't she try the shock effect. Put a bit of fear into him, maybe that's what he needs, maybe he doesn't but what she is doing now sure as hell isn't working.

  13. #10
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    Since you are friends, have you tried talking honestly about how you think her parenting (or lack of) is a result of guilt from the separation as you mentioned? That because she has not stepped up to the plate your days are very difficult with this child?

    I feel for you. It sucks that you are stuck like this for financial reasons and because of the friendship.

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