Birthday Idea for a Mom

I also think that just because a poster asked for ideas doesn't mean that the entire thread HAS to stay on the path....why can't discussions be discussions without leading to debates and arguments?

Every internet forum I have been on, has threads that start on one subject and end with another. I kind of like how that happens. I think it is good conversation. It is also a great learning tool for those of us just starting out in this field. It is great to see the different perspectives from different types of providers.

I don't think Judy is angry or bitter or a bad daycare provider. I think she is realistic, experienced and intelligent! I have never met her in person nor have I seen her daycare, but I would be willing to bet that she runs a fantastic daycare with which parents and kids alike are very satisfied. And I think she brings wisdom to this forum that is much needed. You don't have to agree with her or anyone else (I have had myself a good debate with Judy in the past about subsidies...didn't agree with her, but I certainly respected her opinions and experience as I do now). My point is, debate is not about being right or wrong, it's about having an open and honest conversation about things and possibly seeing things in a slightly different way at the end of it if you open your mind to it. It does not mean you have to accept everything Judy or anyone else says, but can we not at least think about it and come to our own opinions (which should be ever evolving as our knowledge and experience increases)? I also get frustrated sometimes when I see providers bending over backwards (I am not talking about the card necessarily) or lowering rates, not charging for stats or vacations, etc etc. Why? Because it lowers the bar for all of us. If everyone charges for stats, parents will have nowhere to go where they can get these days for free and they will much more readily accept that they have to pay them...it becomes the norm. Same goes for providers vacations, sick days, etc. When one or several providers decide to undercut others, it makes it harder for everyone. I am not saying we all have to be the same, but I am just responding (and agreeing) to what Judy has said about giving more and getting the same. I know we have now completely hijacked this thread and I apologize for that. I realize the OP intention was to get some craft ideas, not start a debate and I do respect that, but can't help wading further into the murk at this point.

I appreciate your point of view Judy. I agree with you to a point. I think if I offer something like... you don't pay for stats, I'm setting a new standard for the community. So when that client goes to the next provider and they charge for stats, they don't understand why. I'm raising the clients expectation. If I make a card then the next provider looks like they don't care because I did it and they don't feel they have to. I'm raising the expectations of the proffesion by offering more then what someone else feels is "there job".

I spent an hour last night price matching with 5 different grocery flyers in prep to do my shopping this week. So, if the superstore offers price matching, I go there to shop. And I take all of the cheap no frills and basics prices with me. But at the end of the day, The Superstore gets my business. Basics can be as ticked off as they'd like, they're just advertising for another store in my opinion.

I think it's called being competitive. I do these things for my clients and my kids because it keeps me competitive. It's a small thing that means a lot. My clients will stay with me because I do these extras and they will recommend me because I do these extras.

In response to your tim hortons/mcdonalds analogy. Things have changed. They work much harder to maintain that client and be competitive. Now they have starbucks, coffee cultures, fancier coffee's, latte's. Mcdonalds has harveys and wendy's along with the effort to stay healthy, combat new fast food trends like sushi etc. They have had to educate themselves because they're not just selling burgers and donuts anymore. Just like we've had to educate because clients expect more then free play and tv time.

So, I choose to stay competitive. I choose to LOVE my job and what I do. And I choose to come onto forums like this to gain advise, support and other views.

I appreciate your view Judy, I think it's a horribly negative way to look at life and our carreer choice, but I appreciate it just the same.

And BTW, I agree... sometimes threads do take a left turn. In this case it diverted the entire reason for the post. Maybe it would have been a good opportunity for someone to start a thread regarding opinions on going the extra mile rather then to throw your 2 cents in here with complete disregard to what the topic was to begin with.

Ding its my turn..... LOL.

I had a horrible first 6-8 months doing daycare...And here are some of the reasons why.

People in my building called early learning on me ALL THE TIME!! So did other providers in my community, I cried, I whinced, I worried and I wondered why. But you know what? As soon as I stopped worrying about people's thoughts on me being a wheelchair user...Suddenly my stress level went down and they haven't been here in a long time, hell you know what I have even had a lady call CAS on me (in my building) because she was worried for my son...Well guess what? They found nothing and the social workers who came said "sorry for bothering you" and the report has been shredded and nothing came of it. (that's what the social workers told me happens when no concerns are noted)

I used to post and post on here about how down in the dumps I was about how people just weren't coming. I lowered my rates, made myself work crazy hours, all because I WANTED THOSE FAMILIES so damned badly, and guess what it got me? Sub par familes who didn't give two s*i&s about the policies I wrote, my rates, or paying me what I deserved and what was fair for the subdivision.

I now offer contracted hours, get my fees on time, and have a great set of families (until I relocate) one family signed on to come with me when I move. I no longer work hours that intrude on my family..any overtime is offered at a premium fee...I chose to focus on the things I could offer like my ECE training exp. my job in the school system etc.

I know I made a boo boo when announcing that I was moving but it was a bit hard to hide considering things were disappearing off the wall and out of the house.

Anyway...The reason I am posting this is because I WANT EVERYONE READING THIS THREAD including YOU TO KNOW that going above and beyond always leads TO SOMETHING MORE AND RAISED EXPECTATIONS OF GETTING SOMETHING EXTRA FOR LESS.

Would I do a card for a family? Perhaps... If it was not implied that I HAD TO DO IT. But I would also say something to the parent like " Don't you think that you and "Jonny" should have done it together he would have been so happy to work with you!"

Here is what I would do...

I personally think that it was to much and rather rude of the dad to make a snidey comment to their child at the door, rather than having the balls to ask you to your face if you'd mind. He knows he's pushing his look and asking more from you than he should. That being said, it is a request easily granted in a few minutes at very little cost. But, to prevent this particular family from taking advantage of you in the future due to your good nature, but also avoiding them thinking you are cold and caluss for not doing something which to them seems to be a small request, this is what I would do.

I would get this child up from nap just 5 minutes early and let them choose some different craft materials from your supplies and but them into a brown paper bag or zippy. I'd let them pick everything from tissue paper scraps, to buttons and die cuts etc I would include in the bag a folded piece of construction paper for the card. When Dad picks up, I would hand it to him and say, little Joey put this bag of craft supplies together to make a card for mums birthday. I would quite clearly say to Dad, I had all my activities planned for the day and thought it more appropriate and meaningful if you made the card with your child. Not only will this be a better experience for you, but it will also put you in the good books with your wife.

It's showing that you care about the child and family, but that you can not and will not change your days plans to accommodate an activity which is his role not yours. If he says he doesn't have time, I would even push it so far as to tell him it will only take 5 minutes with his child to make and that it will be worth the effort. I bet he'll never make some snide request like that again lol.

OP, you do realize this is a PUBLIC forum, right? That means providers AND parents have access to it. Therefore if you post something that is not in the normal range for parental requests, some providers will feel the need to say that some of us would be offended by a request like that, especially in the passive aggressive way it was delivered by asking THROUGH the child. It is not negative to state an opinion on that and what it can allude to.

What was negative was this particular quote, posted by YOU:
I'm a caregiver. That requires me to CARE for the kids. And if I can't switch up a craft on short notice to include a simple card then I'm not much of a care giver. And if I automatically jump to the conclusion that the parent is "using" me to do their job then I'm not a very nice person either.

The assumptions that you made that those who choose not to do special for their families make them “not much of a caregiver” and “not very nice people” are very insulting to those of us who work very hard and just choose to run their business a bit differently. THAT is where your thread got nasty. You set the tone of the thread and a precedent by posting that expectation on a site where both providers and parents can read it and set their OWN expectations for their caregivers. The other posters are right to call you out on that.

For what it’s worth, if your post was truly just about wanting craft ideas and only input for craft ideas, why even add the reason or the manner/tone it was asked (i.e. HINT HINT)? It’s not needed if you just want craft ideas for a birthday. So, I am guessing you weren’t totally over the moon with the way you were asked either and that’s why that’s in there. Don’t jump on others for picking up on that.

A very creative way to be firm and avoid people taking advantage and still looking profesional. Thank you for your comment, Bright sparks!

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Originally Posted by ladyjbug

For what it’s worth, if your post was truly just about wanting craft ideas and only input for craft ideas, why even add the reason or the manner/tone it was asked (i.e. HINT HINT)? It’s not needed if you just want craft ideas for a birthday. So, I am guessing you weren’t totally over the moon with the way you were asked either and that’s why that’s in there. Don’t jump on others for picking up on that.

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I have to wonder if people are reading all of the comments in the thread before posting their comments. I have said several times that I agree that it was sneaky in the way it was asked. I didn't agree with what was being asked... however... that's not why I created the post.

apparently my opinions are not ok but everyone elses are? I posted my opinions just as everyone else did.

Wow ladies. I honestly feel really sorry for some of you. I really do. A&B, I think Judy's argument is coming from a place of genuine concern for you-- even if you don't read it that way. When some of us read your original post, it sounded like that parent was sort of ordering you to make a craft through his child. It rubbed me, and clearly some others the wrong way. Maybe you didn't take it that way and maybe the parent didn't mean it that way, we don't know, we weren't there. I'm going to go out on limb and assume that you, like most of us, plan your day. I bet you had yesterday more or less mapped out. You spent time (probably your free time) organizing your meals and your activities. It bothered me that a parent would come in and say to you (albeit through his child, which in itself is childish) to make a card/craft for his wife. That undermines YOU. You probably had a lovely day planned for your kids but this parent didn't acknowledge that. He made an assumption that he could throw yet another responsibility at you. I think a craft for mom's birthday is a lovely gesture that would be even better coming from the joint effort of father and child bonding time, not because you were given more work to do. This parent did what he did because he knew he could get away with it. He knew you would do it. If it doesn't make you feel taken advantage of then fine, all is well in your world. I know if a parent said that to me, I would be hurt. Hurt, that the day I planned was somehow not good enough or that I was already doing was not enough. I also know that the group of parents I have now would not ask me what this parent asked of you. Not because I don't care, not because I don't love my day care kids, but because they respect my the running of my day home. I felt like this particular parent was not respecting you and that is why I can see why Judy and the others are posting what they are posting.