Agency: yes or no

I am just starting up my home daycare and was wondering if I should go with a agency or not.

These are the options I have come up with.

A) be private (no agency)

B) be with an agency only

c) be both private and with an agency

d) same as "c" but only for a year or two well I get started

I have already signed one family (privately) which is nice.

I do have an appointment next week with an agency (The Children's Village) to see what they offer

What do you all think about the agency's here in Ottawa, are they worth joining or should I just do it all on my own?

You have to write out a pros/cons list for yourself after you meet with the agency. Depends on what YOU want.

Personally, I would NEVER go with an agency, but maybe its because I have the experience from working in a variety of centers. I have seen what my nephews' one provider went through, and didn't want that for myself.

IF you go with an agency, you have to adhere to THEIR rules! I don't know how it would work if you went private and with an agency for numbers; but I'm going to assume that you will have to abide by the agency's numbers. So 1 under the age of 1, 2 under the age of 2, etc. Whereas if you go private, YOU decide on what age groups YOU want!

I found with agencies, is that usually (and I know it's not always the case) these are families that no one usually wants. They're the parents that don't listen, and the kids that are little shits.

Again, it's all up to you! Good luck!

The biggest advantage is that an agency can offer families subsidy. If you live in an area with a lot of families with low incomes that require subsidy then it might help to fill up since it gives you a bigger pool to draw from. Realize the agency will take some of the money so you will end up making less than with the private families. The agency also has their own rules and does monthly inspections which I found intrusive in the sense of they are surprise so you never knew when meaning any day could be disrupted.

A big con is age restrictions with an agency which you don't have if you are private. Depending on the ages of your own children or how many will be the deal breaker. Your own children count so if you have 2 of your own you can only take in 3 other children for care to equal 5. Privately your own don't count so you can have 5 daycare plus your own. Also with the agency the age restrictions will become an issue as the older kids move to full time JK but you can still only have 2 under 2, 3 under 3 or whatever the rule is.

In some areas fewer families are looking for subsidy so they don't see the benefits since the parents end up paying the agency more money then they would have to pay a provider directly. This means the agency has fewer children to place so the caregiver still ends up with spaces she needs to fill privately but now has to also live under the agency restrictions even though even when no agency children are placed.

I agree - you need to way the pros and cons depending on the area you live in.

I started out doing your option C) chose an agency that allowed you to have private clients as long as you adhered to the 'restrictions' on age groups on no more than 3 children under three and of those three no more than 2 could be under the age of 2 years and you had to count your OWN children under the age of 10 in your ratios which did not matter to me cause well I have no wee ones at home.

However I found that there was no 'benefit' to the agency for me as a provider - in my area there is a waitlist a mile long for 'subsidy' so even if a client qualifies for it does not mean they GET it - they have to pay normal fees until they move up the waiting list for a subsidized spot ... so I was able to find and maintain private clientelle and none of them were interested in 'agency' model because the fees are higher than what I charge privately cause no 'middle man' and none of them were eligible for subsidy anyway. And while the agency provided professional development and networking support as well as toy lending library I can access all those things through an Ontario Early Years Centre anyway and for a low membership fee.

I still follow all the same 'rules' for the most part as far as safety in the house, Canada food guide, first aid and CPR trained and so forth although I dropped the no more than 3 under three aspect of the ratio restrictions - I still do not care for more than 2 children under the age of two because I physically know that is my limit of wee ones however my other 3 are of whatever age mix works for me cause I find there is little difference between caring for 3 two and a half year olds or 3 kids who are 2.5, 3 and 4 ... the level of independence and learning needs is pretty much the same there until they hit 'school age' and get some more challenging attitudes ;)

Good luck in your choice for sure ... great thing about this field is options - you can always start out with an agency and if you do not enjoy it or find it beneficial you can 'let the agency go' and remain a private home childcare will little to no transition ;)

I have decided to join an agency for the first year or two of my daycare and see how it goes. I really don't like having someone "watching over me", but it has been over 12 years since I have worked as a nanny and even though I have two kids of my own, I feel that the extra training would benefit both me and the kids. But I am also going to have private dck's as well.

Also must of the people calling/emailing are asking if I have subsidy spots. I have had an interview with one agency so far and have another lined up in August.

I was just wondering if anyone preferred one agency over another here in Ottawa? And why?

I think you have come up with a great plan. Since the first year is always really difficult you will have the agency behind you to get you established. Personally, I wouldn't want to go with any agency because that means I would not be self-employed, making my own rules and choosing who can stay and who must go if the rules aren't followed. Maybe the year with the agency will be exactly the transition time you need. Good luck!

All of you from Ontario are lucky that the age restrictions don't apply to you if you are private. Here in Saskatchewan it doesn't matter. Either way, you are supposed to follow their age/ratio regulations. I know a TON of providers who don't but you are supposed to.

I was with an Agency in Alberta. The agency was awesome and I loved the people that worked for the Agency. But there are drawbacks to being with an agency. We moved to Saskatchewan and am planning to re-open my dayhome here this fall (after my baby is born as I'm pregnant right now). I'm planning to go private.

The agency I am meeting with in August, said that they don't like opening daycare's in apartments, but after reading my application she just had to come and meet with me. I'm not sure what I said to impress her.

All I wrote was:

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Hours/days of daycare:

7:30-5:30pm. Monday to Friday

Planning on starting home daycare:

October/November 2012, as I am currently on mat-leave.

What ages would I prefer:

1 year old to 5 years old. My youngest son is 7 months as of July 2012. Once he is older I would conceder a younger child.

My Qualifications: Education & Experience

I worked as a part-time nanny (evenings, nights, and weekends) for three years during college. I have babysat on and off since I was 13 years old (now in my mid 30's).
I am a mother of two boys, 3 years and 7 months old.

What kind of activities do I plan for the children

- We do lots of fun educational crafts, and special projects for the Holiday's and special occasions.
- We have circle time, where we read stories and sing songs.
- We go on walks to one of the three parks close by. The children get to play freely.
- We go to a splash pad near by.
- We also take time on these walks to check out / talk about all the nature around us.
- There is a big yard in the back, which we run around in. We play baseball, golf, ball, tag, etc.
- We have special outings to the beach for picnics.
- We have group play/activities as well as independent play/activities
- We go to a free playgroup one to three days a week.

What I teach...

- ABC's
- 1,2,3's
- Colours
- Shapes
- How to share
- To be respectful to others, animals, property and the
environment.
- Please and Thank You's, because politeness counts.
- Using our words. Throw simple signing or verbally depending on age.
- Using sentences (depending on age)
- How to use an inside voice, a respectful outside voice (playing in the back yard, walking down the street), and a loud outside voice (at parks)
- What to do if there is a fire.

Where would the children play?

Inside: in the living area
outside: in the back court yard of my building, one of three parks near by, or at the beach (not in the water)

What kind of lunches and snacks would I serve?

I provide nutritional homemade snacks and lunches.
example: fresh fruit, homemade Mac and Cheese etc.

How do I handle children's misbehaviour?
Depending on the situation, a warning is usually given and the child is reminded of acceptable behaviour and re-directed to a different activity.
Next step would be a timeout. This timeout is not a punishment, but rather a time that they may calm down, remember what behaviour is acceptable, and decide when they are ready to rejoin the group with the appropriate behaviour. Time outs last 1 minute for each year of age.
If timeouts are not effective, some sort of consequence will be imposed. This may range from a favourite toy being taken away for a short period of time to being excluded from a favourite activity.

Basic description of my home:
A two bedroom ground floor apartment. The apartment is across from a exit and has windows that we can get out of if needed. The apartment is SMOKE FREE at all times. The apartment is NOT peanut free. There is a cat, who gets his shots yearly. There is a nice court yard in the back with a wall around it. The court yard has picnic tables and there usually has a nice cool breeze.

What kind of toys/equipment do I have:
I have lots of toys, ranging from 0 months to 4 years. Example: Toy kitchen and food, doll stroller, dolls, trains with wooden tracks, blocks, Mega blocks, trucks and cars, balls, golf set, etc.
For equipment I have, a high chair, sleeping mats, kid size table and chairs, bumble set, single stroller, and a double stroller. I am also slowly picking up more items.

Where do the children sleep?
The children will sleep on floor mats in the living area, or in a play pen in the master bed room.

Why do I want to be a caregiver?
I have always loved children. I love watching them learn and play. I have always planned on starting a home daycare when I was done having my own children.

What qualities do I think I can offer to private home day care?
- a happy, friendly, safe, and positive environment.
- a chance to help child learn

Other information:
I have a current police check. My husband will be getting his before October 2012.
I will be getting a medical certificate from my Dr. in mid-August.
I have three people (non-family) who are working on writing references for me.
As I am in an apartment I only take on three children, besides my own two, at this time. When my children go to school, I will be willing to add more children within the 5/1 rule.
My husband and I are planning on moving into a house sometime in either 2013 or 2014.
I do plan on having private clients as well.
I have never worked with a home daycare agency or have been associated with one, as I have never had a home daycare before.

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basically all I did was answer the questions they asked.
I am glad that they like it enough to want to meet.

I'm glad they want to meet. I hope everything works out for you!

I forgot to mention before that even though I'm going private now, I am very thankful that I went with an Agency when I first started out. I now know a lot more about how to run a quality dayhome, what to expect in the business, what my policies and forms should look like, I learnt a lot about regulations and safety measures, I learnt a lot in the Early Childhood Education course I had to take, etc.

I wouldn't go with an agency. Why give someone a cut of your pay? IME agencies promise to refer you clients to keep you full but that rarely happens. If your heart is really into daycare then you can be successful without an agency.

I personally wouldn't ever go with an agency. I have been a parent (non subsidy) through an agency and resented having the pay the additional money when I felt they did very little for my provider. There was a TON of problems with that agency. Not sure if all agencies are like that but it left such a sour taste in my mouth that I didn't want to be an agency provider when I made the decision to open. There are lots of people in my area not requiring subsidy so getting clients wasn't an issue.

Plus some of the agencies in my area have odd rules. The most recent I've heard about is a no TV rule. And not that you can't have TV running during the day, but that there is to be no TV's in the house at all. :blink: I also have a friend here locally that was through an agency. The agency set the fees and hiked fees by close to $100 per month but didn't pass any of that raise on to providers. In fact they didn't even tell providers, my friend found out through an upset parent. Those providers made than $500 per month for FT children, the lowest paid in the city for agency.

I do this partly because I enjoy setting me own rules and parameters, why let someone else govern you? That being said you need to do what's best for you. I would go into a meeting with a list of requirements yourself.

ie: Do they let you set your own fees or are they preset by the agency? How many client referrals is average in your area - they need to help you stay full. Will the agency provide or help you enroll in any schooling to become certified? Also ask for a list of rules and policies so you can review them and decide you agree PRIOR to making any agreement or decision. Make sure that the agency will be helping (not hindering) you and that you can feel 100% comfortable adhering to thier regulations.

The main reason I am thing about going with an agency is that I have not formal training. The agencies say that I will get free training. Yes I have worked as a nanny years ago, and I am a mother but I feel that it would be in the best interest of the kids and myself to at lest start off with getting the training. Also out of the 15 emails/calls I have received only 4 did not ask if had subsidy spots and out of that four, three wanted discounts. Only one family was willing to pay my fees.

I am interviewing more then one agency, and will review all the info on both very carefully, before making up my mind for sure. If they have any polices that make me uncomfortable or are just plain stupid than I will go on my own.

In regards to training ~ in Ontario we have Early Years for young families to take a part of a place free to get your babies out and meet other Moms ~ in my city they offer free daycare provider courses. See if you have something similar to that.
Yes you have been out of the business for a while being a Nanny a while ago but, the instinct and caring you have to get into this business doesn't go away. I know many providers who have all the training behind them and not the 'soft skills' to do the job and should get out!

If your feeling uncomfortable with some policies, listen to what your gut is telling you.
Starting up a daycare is tough...the first year of getting clients can be rough- we struggled a bit but it does get better as your reputation spreads through word of mouth. As you gain experience you can built on your website (webs.com is a great free site- ask the ladies what sites they use and you can check them out)
Good luck on your choice. Since you asked, I'll give you 3 cents worth ;) and tell you that I wouldn't go with an agency either. This is your business and being able to control how things are run is the perk of the job Micro managed is something that doesn't suit me at all.
Good luck~ remember we are here to help if you need any suggestions, advice or as we all do, vent on those tough days

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Originally Posted by Valerie E. M-C

The main reason I am thing about going with an agency is that I have not formal training. The agencies say that I will get free training. Yes I have worked as a nanny years ago, and I am a mother but I feel that it would be in the best interest of the kids and myself to at lest start off with getting the training. Also out of the 15 emails/calls I have received only 4 did not ask if had subsidy spots and out of that four, three wanted discounts. Only one family was willing to pay my fees.

I am interviewing more then one agency, and will review all the info on both very carefully, before making up my mind for sure. If they have any polices that make me uncomfortable or are just plain stupid than I will go on my own.

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You would get just as good training from attending the workshops at the CCPRN and in many cases better training because it will be practical and hands on information from actual daycare providers with experience. That kind of support is hard to find in other places. At the same time you can get the support you need to remain private and in control of your environment.

What about the amount of people wanting subsidy or a discount. My building is in an area where there are lots of rent to income housing. with so many people asking for subsidy, wouldn't it be wise to go with an agency at lest to start? or am I just panicking/worrying that I wont find any reg fee paying families by Sept/Oct? I will be officially quitting my two retail jobs on September 7th.

Valerie, I would never go with an agency either because I don't want to work for anybody else. Being self-employed is wonderful 99% of the time in my opinion. We like to give our best advice on this forum based on our experiences.

HOWEVER, you take all of our good advice and weigh it and do what is best for YOU! If starting with an agency is best for you then go ahead and do that. You will learn a lot about having people on subsidy in your care I'm afraid. I was on subsidy when I was a young single Mom and my children were well behaved, clean and well-fed. However, that is not always the case, especially in the low rent housing. I vowed when I was a hard working young Mom never to let us get that low that we needed low rent housing because those people actually frightened me. I'm not being prejudiced, I saw it all with my own eyes and lived in poverty scraping by with 4 children, just barely making ends meet. I've been there.

Now, what about advertising and interviewing and give yourself a chance to start up with working families who can pay your fees and see how that goes for a couple of months before you join an agency? Do you have that kind of time? It takes a while to get up and running sometimes.

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Originally Posted by Valerie E. M-C

What about the amount of people wanting subsidy or a discount. My building is in an area where there are lots of rent to income housing. with so many people asking for subsidy, wouldn't it be wise to go with an agency at lest to start? or am I just panicking/worrying that I wont find any reg fee paying families by Sept/Oct? I will be officially quitting my two retail jobs on September 7th.

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I started out with an agency for the same reason ~ I was with them for two years and they were not able to refer me ONE client because while there is lots of people ELIGIBLE for subsidy the actual WAIT LIST to GET IT can be long depending on your area .... and for clients who are eligible but not able to GET IT paying the agency inflated full market fees is impossible ~ they tend to seek out private clients in the meantime while sitting on a 'waiting list' for subsidy somewhere and for people who are not 'eligible' for subsidy they are going to prefer to pay the lower private fees that does not have a middle man taking a portion of it ~ none of my clients I found privately had any interest in going through the 'agency' so eventually I just gave up the contract with them cause there was no real benefit to ME and it was actually causing a financial loss for me because finding kids 'over 3' is hard and I had found a child who would be only 3 weeks short of turning 3 when they needed care to start and they would not allow me to take her if I wanted to stay with them until she was 'over 3' and well the mom needed care to start and could not wait so I would have lost her ~ so I gave up the contract cause to me '3 weeks to young' according to their ratio rules was not worth loosing a client over who was not going to be any more 'independent' in that time frame :roll:

As for the training ~ yes in your area you have the CCPRN and Ontario Early Years centres ... I know my community offers a Home Childcare Training program for $60 to cover the cost of manual materials and guest speakers and so forth that is quiet helpful for new providers! Way cheaper than going through an agency cause not sure about in Ottawa but in my area agencies pay LESS per child/per day than you can get privately so if you are able to get PRIVATE clients you can use that extra income to engage in your own 'training' in whatever level that you feel will help and motivate you in your business ~ tailored to YOUR needs and strengths verses some agency 'group training for the masses' .... honestly I never attended any of the agency stuff and preferred to seek out my own PD and networking anyway!

If you are looking for training there are the family daycare training modules - think it is three modules divided into sections. The CCPRN offers these as group sessions. The units start from the very basics as in should I open my home for daycare and how to set it up, goes through budgeting, child development, dealing with parents, etc. and the great part is that is geared specifically to home daycare providers. Worth looking into whether you are with an agency or not.

I was a nanny (10 plus years) before I opened my day home. I would not give a decent chunk to an agency. And to teach me what? I know how to look after children and dealing with parents is not diffucult. You just have to force your contract if there is any problem.

Just be confident( not saying you are not) and start. There is a lot of information on this web site and if you need help for particular situation ask here. We all are lovely people :) who are willing to help. The best part is it is free! :)
Think of what you can do with the money you are willing to pay to an agency. Give you a hint. Shooooopppinggg :laugh:

Wow, you have all given me a lot to think about. My husband and I have decided that after my meeting with the agency on Wed. We will sit down and go over everything form both agency and my plan if I solo go private. We will then decide what will be best for your family at this time. Thank you all for all your advice.

So, I had my meeting with the other agency. I really liked what the lady had to say. My husband and I sat down and reviewed everything form both agency's and about going private. And after a lot of talking and many more phone calls/emails asking if I had any subsidy spots we decided that at this time the best thing would be going with an agency as well as doing private (if I can find any one).

My husband and I thank you all for your advice, but in the end we had to do what we fill is best for your family at this time.

Valerie you have to do what is right for you ..... there are pros and cons to both models depending on the providers needs, location and so forth .... if your region has subsidy for clients to access without long waiting lists and your being with an agency will allow you to fill up with clients through them as a result and they will allow you to take on 'private' clients if they are not filling you up ~ than it cannot hurt to do both.

As I stated this is how I started out ~ it just did end up being a beneficial relationship for me or them cause I have always been able to find private clients due to the subsidy shortage in our area and well clients who are not eligible for subsidy do not want to pay the marked up rate of 'agency' care when they can get the same service privately ;)

Congratulations on your new adventure ~ may your program be full before you know it!

Good luck!! :thumbsup:

I have called several of the other caregivers in my area and almost all have subsidy spots. Which leads me to believe this is a subsidy area. We plan on moving in a year or two, I am going to do lots of research to find an area where I can find lots of private clients.

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Originally Posted by Valerie E. M-C

I have called several of the other caregivers in my area and almost all have subsidy spots. Which leads me to believe this is a subsidy area. We plan on moving in a year or two, I am going to do lots of research to find an area where I can find lots of private clients.

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Ok just to clarify ~ if you are calling other programs and the providers are saying they have SUBSIDY SPOTS does that not mean that they have OPENINGS in their programs because they cannot find clients to fill those subsidized spots cause that is how I would interpret that statement?

This is the issue here ~ there are lots of families who are 'eligible' for subsidy as per the criteria and are 'approved' for it but are on a 'waiting list' because there are just no new funds ~ they have to wait for someone currently ON subsidy to get off of it and free up $$ or for the government to choose to infuse NEW money into the system? I know there are lots of licensed centres and day homes with SPACE for those clients in my area because they work with agencies who do not allow you to take on 'private' clients.

Sadly in my city the system is CAPPED out with no new money to provide so those eligible clients are sitting on a 'waiting list' to actually GET subsidy and are either having to figure out how to pay FULL market fees in a licensed setting until it 'kicks in' or since they likely cannot AFFORD that which is why they are eligible for subsidy they are seeking a solution that is within their 'budget' such as a free family member helping out in a patchwork system or seeing a private home childcare program where the market value fees are much LESS than licensed care tends to be and than waiting for the call that there are now funds available to move them into a 'licensed' space.

I would definitely make sure I chose an agency that supports the provider taking on private clients so that you have control over being 'full or not' verse relying solely on them!

Reggio- sorry I wrote it wrong. When I called the other providers, I explained that I was starting up and was decided to go with an agency or not. from the answers I got, it sounds like the agency's are very helpful, although there are times when there are subsidy freezes, over all they are good at helping to fill you up.
The agency I am trying to join does let me have private clients as well.

Hi BlueRose,

Did you end up going with agency or started the daycare on your own? I am in a similar situation.

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Originally Posted by Shiny

Hi BlueRose,

Did you end up going with agency or started the daycare on your own? I am in a similar situation.

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Yes I ended up starting off being with 2 agencies. For about 2 years then went private.

I found that the agencies where very controlling. They say you are in charge, but you really are not. They didn't care if they families walked all over me and treated me like dirt, in fact when I complained I was told that if I didn't like it they would remove the child and not give me another. I would find clients on my own who wanted subsidy, they said they wanted to go with me then once they talked to the agency the agency would send them to another provider (with them longer). There where good things about being with an agency as well. I did get free arts and craft supplies, and workshops/first aid. I did get an advisor to talk to when I was having problems or unsure of something. I am glad that I got the experience of being with and agency and since I am not an ECE or have any real training in child care I don't think I would have made it through my first year without them. I have been private for a year now and I am doing well. I have more confidence and am loving owning my own business and working with kids.

I would interview with the agency's in your area (each one can operate differently from the others) and see if you feel one would work for you. With an agency, you can always leave. I had to give a two weeks notice. So if there is one you feel might work for you then you can always try it out.

Remember this is ONLY my experience with two agencies. I know others who have been with agencies for 20 plus years and love it and have had totally different experiences.

I might have had problems with them, but I am glad I had the chance to be with them when I started I wouldn't be still doing home daycare if I hadn't. They where a great learning experience.