Update on AP child...or should I say parent lol

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03-18-2014 10:53 AM
bright sparks

Update on AP child...or should I say parent lol

So some of you may remember me posting back in January about a little boy I took on who was being Attachment parented and how his parents had no plans to transition him ready for group care. I had asked for people opinions on how this would work. I would never have interviewed them in the first place if she had been open and honest about her parenting style to begin with but after signing them on back in the fall, I only found this info out a couple weeks prior to starting.

Well after 3 weeks of transitioning and this child SCREAMING constantly, not crying, and the boy wouldn't let up for a second even if I picked him up I gave the parents 2 weeks notice of probation for him to transition, otherwise the spot would come to an end. That's where I was up to in my previous related post and I thought I would offer an update of how things went.

So I had a letter typed up for pick up on the Thursday (I only work M-Th). The letter was intended as a document to take home for dad to read and I planned to talk to mom obviously to be much more personable about the situation. Well dad picked up which doesn't normally happen but made the conversation so much easier as he isn't like the mom at all. Totally understood that this was not something to be taken lightly as we needed to work together to get over this, but he didn't blow it all out of proportion like the mom would have done. Well actually she kind of did. Well I got a text about 530 asking if we could meet for coffee. I agreed as I thought it would be in my best interest to have a conversation with her about things. We went for coffee for nearly 3 hours and had a great conversation and I got a much clearer understanding of who she is and the type of parent she is which I found very helpful. At no time did I tell her what I think is the right way to parent, in fact I didn't really mention AP as a method, I simply gave her some ideas on how to deal with her son with regards to successfully transitioning him into a group setting and this was just based on my experience.

Well Monday morning was like night and day. This child was an absolute angel. I was SHOCKED! At pick up I asked mom what had changed and she said that from Friday they stopped AP all together and started leaving him to cry it out and self sooth including sleeping 100% independently. I never asked, told her or implied that she should do this as its not my place to do so but I was so pleased she chose to do this on her own and learnt from this that this was the reason for change.

This little guy is by far one of my easiest kids now and has been here about 10 weeks. If he is ever off his game, he has had a rough night and his parents have co-slept which once again just proves my point in this particular child's case and how the co sleeping approach does not work positively for him.

Now for just a little offload of some of the ridiculous stuff that comes with dealing with this family.....definitel y could be worse, but having such stupid things bottled up drives me mad at times :)

Mom is very neurotic and laid back at the same time to an extreme too. Child literally has 2 sets of clothes for the week. He always comes clean so its not that it matters, I've just never seen this before. Kind of makes sense keeping him in set clothes just for daycare so they can get stained etc with no issue. I don't think that's the case with this child though from other things. He always comes in odd socks. EVERY day....she said she really struggles to make pairs...god help her in the future then if she cant even manage it now lol It doesn't really bother me now and doesn't effect her ability to care for her child obviously but I just think its a little bit silly that she cant manage something so basic as this.

This boy is 13 1/2 mths and is still in a baby carry car seat. He was 11 months when he started and it was far to small for him then. If he was in a car accident, I doubt he would survive as his legs would just be crushed on impact he has such a major overhang from his legs. Initially I didn't have to say anything because after 3 days I got him ready for pick up and put him in his car seat and had to alter the straps and head rest so they were aligned properly. As a result when the parents collected they couldn't understand why the left over for pulling tight was only an inch long. I explained that I altered his seat as the straps were not in the right positions. At this point they said oh maybe its time for a new seat and we got to talking and I said that most kids are out of these seats by 6 months and sometimes a few months beyond if they are petite. She laughed it off and told me that I need to tell them if they are doing something wrong, to which I replied as politely as possible that this wasn't my job to tell them and she just said feel free to tell me.....SIGH! This child is still in the car seat although apparently the new seat will be here this week. I have my own seats so if we go out in the minivan he goes in one of my "safe" seats.

Last week I had sickness go through my daycare. Fortunately none of my family had it including me, but we were sick in the new year so I think that might be why. Tuesday night I get a call 7:30ish from this mother saying that her son had just been sick and can he come tomorrow. I said no and reminded her of the policy. She went on to say that he doesn't have a fever and he is happy and playing now. She went on to tell me that she gave him two bites of fajitas and that she thinks he was sick because he doesn't like Mexican food. OMG I struggled not to laugh down the phone at her. I am very patient and understanding, even more so with first time parents as I totally get that they can overreact a lot, but this was the stupidest thing I had ever heard. I said that this would not be the cause when you consider that other kids were sick in the daycare. I understand that some kids are sickly and vomit easily but that is not what's going on with this child. I make a curry from scratch weekly that is spicy and all my dckids wolf it down. So.....she topped this theory by asking me if he had banged his head at daycare that day. I was puzzled by her question but answered her with an absolutely not and it is my policy to always call and notify of a head injury no matter how minor so if she had to ask me that question she already had her answer. She said she was asking in case he had vomited due to a concussion!!!!!! Give me strength lady, this is beyond normal levels of anxiety for goodness sake. I didn't find that funny anymore, just bloody stupid. I reassured her that he just had this stomach bug. She said she would keep him home the following day and that was that. He was off for 2 days due to sickness and so his parents have been co-sleeping with him ever since so now he is a whiney little thing again and I am working very hard to get him back into a routine although his parents are apparently not trying as hard but I think we will be fine to be honest as this can happen with most kids when they are unwell. I'm not totally unreasonable lol

Yesterday he was high need. Clingy, naps were short and lots of crying/screaming. Mom had told me that for 3 days, while he was sick and after, that he refused food and had straight breast milk for 72 hours....SIGH......I ts a one off, I get it, but now she wonders why he is so off his game. He isn't 6 months old he is totally playing her and now has this attachment issue going on. She said this morning that he had been up all night crying unless someone was with him. I asked how long she left him and she said 10 minutes....well there you go then. She said she thinks he has an ear infection. I asked why and she said because he stuck his finger in his ear....seriously??? He hasn't been pulling his ears, no fever, not cranky like he is unhappy or in pain, just whiney because he wants the boob all day and wants to be babied. He is teething so that's IMO the cause of the up in the night and excessive crankiness along with the co-sleeping which probably wont be helping. She called at 10 to ask if he is okay, to which I replied that he was fine. He is teething and biting/chewing everything very hard but no sign of anything else.

High maintenance much LOL
03-18-2014 12:25 PM
Lee-Bee

Now a days most of the infant carry seats are rated for up to 35pounds and a pretty high weight limit. They work until age 2, on average sometimes even age 3. Not sure if that seat was, but most are fine to keep using. There legs are perfectly safe rear facing even if very squished. Research data shows there is very, very minimal risk of ever injuring the legs in a crash.

I would think (hope) most families stop carrying the kid in them long before then though. After the kid is past the newborn stage the seat can stay in the car and be used like any other rear facing car seat.
03-18-2014 12:26 PM
Samantha33

Quote:

Originally Posted by bright sparks

So some of you may remember me posting back in January about a little boy I took on who was being Attachment parented and how his parents had no plans to transition him ready for group care. I had asked for people opinions on how this would work. I would never have interviewed them in the first place if she had been open and honest about her parenting style to begin with but after signing them on back in the fall, I only found this info out a couple weeks prior to starting.

Well after 3 weeks of transitioning and this child SCREAMING constantly, not crying, and the boy wouldn't let up for a second even if I picked him up I gave the parents 2 weeks notice of probation for him to transition, otherwise the spot would come to an end. That's where I was up to in my previous related post and I thought I would offer an update of how things went.

So I had a letter typed up for pick up on the Thursday (I only work M-Th). The letter was intended as a document to take home for dad to read and I planned to talk to mom obviously to be much more personable about the situation. Well dad picked up which doesn't normally happen but made the conversation so much easier as he isn't like the mom at all. Totally understood that this was not something to be taken lightly as we needed to work together to get over this, but he didn't blow it all out of proportion like the mom would have done. Well actually she kind of did. Well I got a text about 530 asking if we could meet for coffee. I agreed as I thought it would be in my best interest to have a conversation with her about things. We went for coffee for nearly 3 hours and had a great conversation and I got a much clearer understanding of who she is and the type of parent she is which I found very helpful. At no time did I tell her what I think is the right way to parent, in fact I didn't really mention AP as a method, I simply gave her some ideas on how to deal with her son with regards to successfully transitioning him into a group setting and this was just based on my experience.

Well Monday morning was like night and day. This child was an absolute angel. I was SHOCKED! At pick up I asked mom what had changed and she said that from Friday they stopped AP all together and started leaving him to cry it out and self sooth including sleeping 100% independently. I never asked, told her or implied that she should do this as its not my place to do so but I was so pleased she chose to do this on her own and learnt from this that this was the reason for change.

This little guy is by far one of my easiest kids now and has been here about 10 weeks. If he is ever off his game, he has had a rough night and his parents have co-slept which once again just proves my point in this particular child's case and how the co sleeping approach does not work positively for him.

Now for just a little offload of some of the ridiculous stuff that comes with dealing with this family.....definitel y could be worse, but having such stupid things bottled up drives me mad at times :)

Mom is very neurotic and laid back at the same time to an extreme too. Child literally has 2 sets of clothes for the week. He always comes clean so its not that it matters, I've just never seen this before. Kind of makes sense keeping him in set clothes just for daycare so they can get stained etc with no issue. I don't think that's the case with this child though from other things. He always comes in odd socks. EVERY day....she said she really struggles to make pairs...god help her in the future then if she cant even manage it now lol It doesn't really bother me now and doesn't effect her ability to care for her child obviously but I just think its a little bit silly that she cant manage something so basic as this.

This boy is 13 1/2 mths and is still in a baby carry car seat. He was 11 months when he started and it was far to small for him then. If he was in a car accident, I doubt he would survive as his legs would just be crushed on impact he has such a major overhang from his legs. Initially I didn't have to say anything because after 3 days I got him ready for pick up and put him in his car seat and had to alter the straps and head rest so they were aligned properly. As a result when the parents collected they couldn't understand why the left over for pulling tight was only an inch long. I explained that I altered his seat as the straps were not in the right positions. At this point they said oh maybe its time for a new seat and we got to talking and I said that most kids are out of these seats by 6 months and sometimes a few months beyond if they are petite. She laughed it off and told me that I need to tell them if they are doing something wrong, to which I replied as politely as possible that this wasn't my job to tell them and she just said feel free to tell me.....SIGH! This child is still in the car seat although apparently the new seat will be here this week. I have my own seats so if we go out in the minivan he goes in one of my "safe" seats.

Last week I had sickness go through my daycare. Fortunately none of my family had it including me, but we were sick in the new year so I think that might be why. Tuesday night I get a call 7:30ish from this mother saying that her son had just been sick and can he come tomorrow. I said no and reminded her of the policy. She went on to say that he doesn't have a fever and he is happy and playing now. She went on to tell me that she gave him two bites of fajitas and that she thinks he was sick because he doesn't like Mexican food. OMG I struggled not to laugh down the phone at her. I am very patient and understanding, even more so with first time parents as I totally get that they can overreact a lot, but this was the stupidest thing I had ever heard. I said that this would not be the cause when you consider that other kids were sick in the daycare. I understand that some kids are sickly and vomit easily but that is not what's going on with this child. I make a curry from scratch weekly that is spicy and all my dckids wolf it down. So.....she topped this theory by asking me if he had banged his head at daycare that day. I was puzzled by her question but answered her with an absolutely not and it is my policy to always call and notify of a head injury no matter how minor so if she had to ask me that question she already had her answer. She said she was asking in case he had vomited due to a concussion!!!!!! Give me strength lady, this is beyond normal levels of anxiety for goodness sake. I didn't find that funny anymore, just bloody stupid. I reassured her that he just had this stomach bug. She said she would keep him home the following day and that was that. He was off for 2 days due to sickness and so his parents have been co-sleeping with him ever since so now he is a whiney little thing again and I am working very hard to get him back into a routine although his parents are apparently not trying as hard but I think we will be fine to be honest as this can happen with most kids when they are unwell. I'm not totally unreasonable lol

Yesterday he was high need. Clingy, naps were short and lots of crying/screaming. Mom had told me that for 3 days, while he was sick and after, that he refused food and had straight breast milk for 72 hours....SIGH......I ts a one off, I get it, but now she wonders why he is so off his game. He isn't 6 months old he is totally playing her and now has this attachment issue going on. She said this morning that he had been up all night crying unless someone was with him. I asked how long she left him and she said 10 minutes....well there you go then. She said she thinks he has an ear infection. I asked why and she said because he stuck his finger in his ear....seriously??? He hasn't been pulling his ears, no fever, not cranky like he is unhappy or in pain, just whiney because he wants the boob all day and wants to be babied. He is teething so that's IMO the cause of the up in the night and excessive crankiness along with the co-sleeping which probably wont be helping. She called at 10 to ask if he is okay, to which I replied that he was fine. He is teething and biting/chewing everything very hard but no sign of anything else.

High maintenance much LOL

I'm glad they were so eager work with you and that it worked out great. As far as the clothing, socks and car seat, I'm wondering if they could just be very frugal. Kids grow out of clothes so quickly, if all she has are mismatched well, they are socks, and car seats can cost a lot. On the other side is it possible she has no family, friends or her parents to talk these things over with or to help her along. I've seen this before. It's sad when you have no one when your children are young and you could use some advice. I know it's hard to not overstep our bounds. Really hard sometime. I'm glad things have worked out. They sound like they will be great parents and clients.
03-18-2014 12:47 PM
bright sparks

Quote:

Originally Posted by Samantha33

I'm glad they were so eager work with you and that it worked out great. As far as the clothing, socks and car seat, I'm wondering if they could just be very frugal. Kids grow out of clothes so quickly, if all she has are mismatched well, they are socks, and car seats can cost a lot. On the other side is it possible she has no family, friends or her parents to talk these things over with or to help her along. I've seen this before. It's sad when you have no one when your children are young and you could use some advice. I know it's hard to not overstep our bounds. Really hard sometime. I'm glad things have worked out. They sound like they will be great parents and clients.

They drive an Acura crossover and VW crossover so I don't think its frugal, I just don't think these are things they think are worthy of worrying over which is fair enough. The mother is very close with her mother and sister who has kids. Again I think its just something they dismiss as not important and as long as it doesn't cause the child harm then I don't really care but wanted to just offload the silly things in my head lol. I think she is super anxious and that's why she totally overreacts to illness, or underreacts by claiming an illness as a dislike to Mexican food lolol I actually like them, just seems that there list of bizarre and strange keeps growing :)
03-18-2014 12:56 PM
bright sparks

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lee-Bee

Now a days most of the infant carry seats are rated for up to 35pounds and a pretty high weight limit. They work until age 2, on average sometimes even age 3. Not sure if that seat was, but most are fine to keep using. There legs are perfectly safe rear facing even if very squished. Research data shows there is very, very minimal risk of ever injuring the legs in a crash.

I would think (hope) most families stop carrying the kid in them long before then though. After the kid is past the newborn stage the seat can stay in the car and be used like any other rear facing car seat.

As I mentioned though this isn't a weight issue at all. His legs are hanging out dramatically and regardless of weight there are height restrictions and there should be at least 2.5 inches between the top of the head and the top of the car seat otherwise it isn't safe. Rear facing seats are always the safest option but not in a stage 1 car seat in the case that a child is hanging out of it. A multi way car seat, rear facing is dramatically better. I would hazard a guess that most people only think about weight with their car seats not height of the child. Really the issue I take is the fact that I have to parent the parents in the safety of their child. If during our discussion they had mentioned any of what you said as being the reason for him still being in the seat then it would have been fair enough, but they didn't. Even if the weight and height is within guidelines for any car seat, improper use can have horrific consequences in the event of an accident which is definitely the problem here.
03-18-2014 01:20 PM
Fun&care

I am so glad the parents changed their tune and the child is doing better. The Mexican food excuse followed by the concussion comment would have really bothered me though. As for the car seat I know some ppl who leave their kids in car seats far longer than they should and they actually do it on purpose because of "safety". I understand, and heck I had to do the same with my DS because he was tiny for his age, but there definitely comes a point where the child is obviously too big/ too long for their seat and they need to move up. Legs being squished or hanging out cannot be comfortable for the child. Not to mention that I personally could not wait for the kids to be forward facing so I could actually see them better and they also felt less "left out".

I totally get that you feel you are parenting the parents. It sucks when they just don't seem to have a clue overall.
03-18-2014 01:56 PM
5 Little Monkeys

Glad to hear that things are working out well....despite the odd comments and behaviours from time to time haha. One of the things I like about this job is seeing the different types of parents even if some of them make me shake my head and go "WTF??" lol.

I have a child who also only wears a few outfits to dc. Dad gets her dressed in the mornings and drops off and mom picks up. Mom has told me that she folds all the clothes that are outfits and puts them in one drawer and than all the other clothes that aren't matching outfits get hang up or in drawers. Dad has no fashion sense so he just picks a matching outfit and there are only a handful of them LOL I can always tell when mom dressed her because she comes in clothes I haven't seen her in. Mom and I laugh about this often.

For the car seats, it must be confusing for a parent too because it seems like the laws and regulations change a bit from time to time. Also, you read one article that says rear facing until they are older is better than switching too early because broken legs are better than brain damage but than you read another article that says to switch to forward facing when they reach the right height and weight. I don't keep that up to date on the car seats because we don't go out often anymore but when we do they are all forward facing. My friend's husband is a firefighter so she usually keeps me informed if there is a major change I need to know about or if I have a question.
03-18-2014 02:01 PM
bright sparks

Quote:

Originally Posted by 5 Little Monkeys

For the car seats, it must be confusing for a parent too because it seems like the laws and regulations change a bit from time to time. Also, you read one article that says rear facing until they are older is better than switching too early because broken legs are better than brain damage but than you read another article that says to switch to forward facing when they reach the right height and weight. I don't keep that up to date on the car seats because we don't go out often anymore but when we do they are all forward facing. My friend's husband is a firefighter so she usually keeps me informed if there is a major change I need to know about or if I have a question.

Confusing for sure but it's not the case for these guys. It's one thing to look into things and be overwhelmed or confused by conflicting info but these guys haven't even given it a thought and have no problem telling me so either :-/
03-18-2014 02:05 PM
5 Little Monkeys

That is odd for sure! Do they rely on you and their family to tell them all this stuff? They don't do any research on their own?
03-18-2014 02:23 PM
bright sparks

I really have no clue, just there personality types and parenting style combination perhaps?? It's strange that they would be so laid back in so many ways and so anal in other ways. Two extremes.

Something my husband and I always say when we come across certain folk is this....
"There's nought as queer as folk"
03-18-2014 02:42 PM
5 Little Monkeys

The 2 extremes are odd but I guess if I'm honest about myself, I am like that too!! LOL

I'm having a dumb moment...I don't understand the saying you and your husband say?? haha
03-18-2014 03:18 PM
bright sparks

Quote:

Originally Posted by 5 Little Monkeys

The 2 extremes are odd but I guess if I'm honest about myself, I am like that too!! LOL

I'm having a dumb moment...I don't understand the saying you and your husband say?? haha

We are English and Irish so blame that not yourself lol Nought means nothing and queer folk means strange people. We say this when we can't rationalize a persons behaviour/opinions/actions. It usually puts a close to our surmising over things we don't understand and cant do anything about :)
03-18-2014 03:22 PM
5 Little Monkeys

ahhh gotcha!

PS. I would LOVE to just listen to you and your husband speak. I am in love with accents LMAO and English and Irish are my top 2! (yes, I realize that probably makes me sound strange haha)
03-18-2014 05:04 PM
Judy Trickett

It sounds like they initially did the work needed to not get turfed from care. And now that has passed and he is still in care they are not in a state of urgency to please you and they are slipping into their old ways. Usually when parents make a 180 turn on their parenting style as a result of daycare problems it rarely works or lasts because, well, if the parent really believed in a different style they that is what they would have started with. They are just placating the provider to get you "off their case" and now they are slipping back into their AP ways.
03-18-2014 05:23 PM
bright sparks

Quote:

Originally Posted by Judy Trickett

It sounds like they initially did the work needed to not get turfed from care. And now that has passed and he is still in care they are not in a state of urgency to please you and they are slipping into their old ways. Usually when parents make a 180 turn on their parenting style as a result of daycare problems it rarely works or lasts because, well, if the parent really believed in a different style they that is what they would have started with. They are just placating the provider to get you "off their case" and now they are slipping back into their AP ways.

You may very well be right. I am in constant communications with them and if this does take a turn for the worse, I have no issues terming them.

I don't think she made a conscious decision to AP in the first place. I think she co-slept out of convenience and ease of breast feeding and getting a better night sleep, which she has made very clear was a big thing for her, and after I said at the interview about sleep training him, she likely did some research and came across AP and found a theory that reinforced that what she was doing was okay. Don't misunderstand me, I am respectful of people's choices to parent a certain way, so for those on here, and I know there are a few who chose to AP, this isn't a sweeping statement against AP, simply an opinion based in this one case and the individuals involved.