Lower ratio = less work?

Hi Ladies,

I'm looking for some insight here. Some of you might remember my posts a few weeks back about how I closed up my daycare (on the spot) in an attempt to save my marriage when my husband said he wanted a separation. He had been completely ignored and neglected since my opening the daycare some 7 months prior (and to some degree since our child was born 17months ago).

Since closing up the daycare we've been doing couples therapy, we've been making huge gains and are spending a good amount of time both talking through our problems and going out on dates to resume some normalcy of life past.

Things are totally heading in the right direction, we have a vacation planned together (and our daughter) next week and many more therapy sessions booked etc.

What the biggest issue for me in moving forward is work. I will not do home daycare again because it clearly was not something that I can do while still having the time and energy I need for my family and husband and household. We are doing fine on one income but I have a strong need to be financially independent (I still have OSAP to pay off and I occasionally need to buy myself something whether it be clothes or a chocolate bar or whatever). My husband makes good money and can sustain our lifestyle on his own but he has the need for me to be able to pay for my own chocolate bars and clothes and for my own personal costs. He is fine paying for all costs for our daughter and house and all that.

So, I need to figure out what to do. ALL my education, experience and passion has ALWAYS been for working with children. But, working with children is just so emotionally draining that I can't do that right now. Not while our daughter is young. I don't know what to do. If I try to work part time I need to have childcare for my daughter...and the costs of that just don't make sense when I wouldn't be bringing in much money. The added stress of the daycare and all that just doesn't seem worth it. Plus, I'd end up in a job that I really have ZERO interest in since all my experience and passion is with children.

So...all that aside, my main question here is. Is it easier, less exhausted, less emotionally draining and all that to care for ONE daycare child in addition to my own child? I was previously caring for a total of 5 full-time kids (all under 20months). With my daycare it was completely separate from our living space so I was working 10hr days outside of the home...then doing 1-2 hours of daycare stuff after hours (meal prep, clean up, planning etc etc).

Is it easier to care for one more child up in our main house. Have some tv time, have them free play and self entertain and essentially 'baby sit'. Would I be able to do some house keeping, cooking and all that with 2 toddlers?

I am weary of making this move as I don't want to end up back where I was with the daycare...working endless hours and being so stressed and exhausted that I disconnected from my husband. But, I don't know how to move ahead as I can't really predict what it would be like.

Does this seem like a viable option? I feel like might would free me up to do all the 'house' stuff during the day. I would have only 2 kids so can use the car to go do groceries, go on playdates with my friends (who I hadn't seen when the daycare opened)...can have friends over for playdates etc. Obviously this would all be clearly discussed with the daycare families before they start. Their child would not be in daycare but would rather be here with me and my daughter as we go about life.

I think a HUGE factor of where I screwed up the first time through was I ran my daycare as completely separate from the house meaning I was working out of the home 60hrs a week, running my own business, with 5 young toddlers that I tried to give all my energy and emotion to. That left me to have to do all the house stuff, life stuff etc outside of daycare hours...but with a child of my own there just were not enough hours. I realize now that I am not capable of that. I just struggle with wondering how different it is to have less kids and to be actually in my home while watching them.

Any insight would be much appreciated.

I think that plan could work really well. Anytime I have 3 or less, it almost feels like a day off. If it was me and my kids, I would need to be fairly picky if I was only adding one child to our days. It would backfire on me pretty fast if the two didn't hit it off. I've seen my two year old play so well when it's a child she likes. But if it was someone she didn't get along with, and there was nobody else for her to go play with instead, it might make the days seem really long. Although my little one inherited a very stubborn streak, so it might not be as big of a problem with an easy going child.

I'm very happy to hear you and your husband are heading in the right direction. Thanks for the update!

So happy to hear your marriage is back on track!!

I find one child more work ( having to entertain them all day) but because you have a child yourself it should be fine. I love when I have 2 because I take them out in the car and do fun things. I also have taken them to do errands which frees up my off time.

What does your husband think?

First of all I'm glad to hear things are going well on the home front ..... Second I think your operating hours were too long .... I'm open 7-4:30...... The only prep I do outside of daycare is grocery shopping ..... I cook extra at dinner and serve the leftovers the next day or do sandwiches. Third ....I rarely do organized crafts .... Colouring glueing stickers finger painting that's all ..... Stager your ages .... 6 kids under two was way too much. Just let them free play ..... Gave outside time in the morning ..... Story time after lunch then nap .... Snack and diapers when they wake up and then free play till pick up.

If hubby is in agree and to having one or two then try it again .... Or try doing b and a ..,.. My daycare is in the basement too and hubby likes it better cause it's contained to one place instead of all over our house .....

Fourth .... I think if your married then your a family unit with family money and it would seriously rub me the wrong way if my hubby said "I'll pay for our child but not you". JMO.

Good luck

Hello Lee-Bee, I just want to say you sound like a very sweet and considerate woman.

Reading both of your posts I feel I have to add my thoughts regarding what you have written in reference to your relationship. I know it is none of my business and my opinion was not asked for, so I am prepared to take the criticism that may follow for "intruding" but since you did give us some insight into your difficulties........ ...

You say the marriage counselling is working, but it seems to be working because your husband has gotten his way and you are the one making the concessions, sacrificing and suffering the angst regarding giving up your thriving, successful business which you had educated yourself to do because your husband felt neglected and threatened the marriage. He obviously was very serious as you closed your doors immediately without thought for your clients...........yo u must have felt very threatened by his declaration of feeling neglected.
Now that you have given up your business and income and hubby is feeling happier, I read that you are not. Yes, you are happy that hubby is happy so you don't have to worry so much about a separation, but now you are being told to get a job, which would result in a daycare expense and will probably not be in your chosen field. So now you will be dropping off your child, going to work, picking up child and then going home to do chores. This doesn't sound a lot easier for you and certainly is a lot less lucrative!
Also, I get a sense you are responsible for most of the chores around the house. Could he help out more?
I completely agree with Crayola's observation and comment. I would be really insulted if my husband declared he didn't want to pay for my general needs. Did you separate your income from the household purse? I think this is the main comment that raised red flags for me.
So, this is my two cents worth. I hope you take my comments as a sign of concern. You are not responsible for your husbands happiness. If he felt he was neglected, maybe he could have worked with you to ease your burden of work so that would create time for both of you to enjoy each other. Please don't sacrifice YOUR financial well being and happiness for someone who wouldn't do it for you.
Good luck.

Hi
Glad things worked out with your marriage!!
10 hour days were the norm for me working outside the home. I worked 8 hours a day but travel time in the morning and back home were an hour each leaving me out of the home for 10 hours. I still had to come home, cook, clean, do laundry, homework with the kids, bath them, prepare lunches and snacks for the next day and so on. Even with my husbands (very little) help, I was exhausted and simply had no time for myself let alone my husband. I don't think the issue is so much the daycare you were running, but was the simple fact that are a wife and a mother. It's the same thing whether you work or run a daycare-either way it's hard!

I use to run my daycare as just "babysitting" and it ran amazing. I never had more then 3 kids at a time and had plenty of time to sneak in folding laundry or an hour conversation with my mom, etc.

Again, the problem doesn't lie within running the daycare, it's just the day to day life we all have to live!!

Thanks Ladies,

Everything is still being discussed and considered and such. My husband has the preference for me to pay for my 'stuff' but he has recognized that that may not be what is best. I really have the need to be financially independent and always have. I don't like having someone pay my way. When we married we kept separate accounts. My husband is an engineer he has this huge system. When either of us purchase something the receipts go in a pile, then get put in a spread sheet and funds get directed to it from wherever they are best from.

It's not so much that he is saying he is fine paying for our daughter but not me...he is paying for me in many ways (housing, phone, cable, trips etc etc). It's the extra spending money that I would use at my own discretion that is what we are worried about.

I am MUCH happier since the daycare closed. I will not open a new one because I know that I as a person will once again get lost in it. I would like to work in some manner to have some of my own money but I am at a loss for how to do that in the best way. I am happiest when I can best perform as a wife and mother...work isn't as fulfilling to me...especially at the expense of my family.

We still have a long ways to go and lots to sort out to see our path in the future. My husband is now in charge of all bedtime routine, all night wakings and much more childcare. He has always done a good amount of house keeping. the issue isn't that he doesn't help around the house...it's that he is an engineer and a neat freak so he NEEDS a clean house. Me, when stressed I could let house stuff slide with no care...for him it really, really bothers him. This makes more work for me, even when he does more house work than the average male. He scrubs toilets and all that. He is also using therapy to work on his 'issues' so it's definitely not just me making changes here.

I'm just trying to get a sense of whether taking on one child (in a shortened day) would increase my stress level so much that I'd be back to where I was running the daycare. In which case then we do need to further explore my being completely unemployed and if that doesn't work for him then divorce may very well be the best route. But, ultimately I'd like to have some money coming in while being able to balance my role as wife and mother and still have time for ME. All this would evolve as our daughter aged and I had less pressure there. Once she's in school I can work a lot more.

First...I'm very sorry you are going through a hard time.

I know you didn't ask for opinions but your husband is not a husband. He sounds like a control freak. He wants a super clean house....clean it himself or pay someone to do it!!!!! You are not a live in house keeper!!!

As for the money thing, ridiculous! We have separate accounts too but that doesn't mean my husband is in control of everything we spend. He makes more than enough to pay for everything so he does. I buy groceries and anything the kids need(clothes, activities etc.). If I think we need something I can't cover, I tell him and he buys it.

Please work out what you need for yourself. You are not a slave. You can't do everything and if that's what he expects he's sorely mistaken. You are a human being and a wonderful mother. You two are supposed to be in this together, no his/her's jobs or money.

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Originally Posted by Katskids

First...I'm very sorry you are going through a hard time.

I know you didn't ask for opinions but your husband is not a husband. He sounds like a control freak. He wants a super clean house....clean it himself or pay someone to do it!!!!! You are not a live in house keeper!!!

As for the money thing, ridiculous! We have separate accounts too but that doesn't mean my husband is in control of everything we spend. He makes more than enough to pay for everything so he does. I buy groceries and anything the kids need(clothes, activities etc.). If I think we need something I can't cover, I tell him and he buys it.

Please work out what you need for yourself. You are not a slave. You can't do everything and if that's what he expects he's sorely mistaken. You are a human being and a wonderful mother. You two are supposed to be in this together, no his/her's jobs or money.

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:-) I wouldn't consider him a control freak...neat freak -yes, anal -yes, obsessive compulsive -yes, wayyyy too in the box (like measured 1 million times from every angle to be EXACTLY centred in the box) -yes. But he isn't 'controlling'. He IS the man I married. I dated him 3 yrs before we married (4yrs ago), I lived with him for like 1.5yrs before we married (can't for the life of me remember how long I lived with him).

I knew the man I was marrying. We worked hard to get things figured out and he had to change and 'loosen up' up a lot to be able to live together. While he adapts and changes as needed he is who he is...and that is largely due to his engineering tendencies (or he is an engineering due to all his tendencies) and just based on his life growing up (which is a whole other story). As much as he drives me up the wall at times...those are the same reasons I love him. I have just as many quirks that drive him up the wall. The main issue here is that we had our roles when we married and it worked for us...then we had a kid, then I opened a business (with an infant). Neither of us really adapted our roles to account for the fact that live changed big time when we had a kid and life changed big time when I opened a business.

He's wanted to hire a cleaner and someone to cook and he has hired a gardener. I refused the cleaner and the cook because those the things I WANT to do. I don't want to work and have to have hired help do stuff around the house for me. I am certain that while it might have freed up a little but of time for me it would not have changed much for me and would not have been the solution. I need to be present at home and not be putting my all into my work.

But...I am also incredibly stubborn and I find it incredibly hard to seek help so I work myself into the ground trying to work full time and be a wife and mom (ignoring my own needs) and it also kills me to fully be a stay at home mom/wife with no incoming money of my own. Which leaves me stuck between a rock and a hard place...hence my trying to figure out my next move. My trying to figure this out is me trying to figure out what I NEED. I just have no idea what I need more...having zero work (and therefore zero money) or my working a bit in some capacity but thereby giving up some of my time and energy for my family/home/me.

I've got little to no doubt that we can work out our relationship and be married happily ever after...I just can't for the life of me figure out what I need to do on the work front to ensure that it doesn't just put me in a position here I am not happy long term or I am not drowning in trying to be perfect at too many roles.

I think you've got a really clear view of the big picture. It sounds like a great solution for you, taking one daycare kid. That fills the desire to make your own money, and it also leaves you the opportunity to make more money down the road. If it's going really well, and your own child is getting older, you may decide you want to take one more.

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Originally Posted by Lee-Bee

Hi Ladies,

I'm looking for some insight here. Some of you might remember my posts a few weeks back about how I closed up my daycare (on the spot) in an attempt to save my marriage when my husband said he wanted a separation. He had been completely ignored and neglected since my opening the daycare some 7 months prior (and to some degree since our child was born 17months ago).

Since closing up the daycare we've been doing couples therapy, we've been making huge gains and are spending a good amount of time both talking through our problems and going out on dates to resume some normalcy of life past.

Things are totally heading in the right direction, we have a vacation planned together (and our daughter) next week and many more therapy sessions booked etc.

What the biggest issue for me in moving forward is work. I will not do home daycare again because it clearly was not something that I can do while still having the time and energy I need for my family and husband and household. We are doing fine on one income but I have a strong need to be financially independent (I still have OSAP to pay off and I occasionally need to buy myself something whether it be clothes or a chocolate bar or whatever). My husband makes good money and can sustain our lifestyle on his own but he has the need for me to be able to pay for my own chocolate bars and clothes and for my own personal costs. He is fine paying for all costs for our daughter and house and all that.

So, I need to figure out what to do. ALL my education, experience and passion has ALWAYS been for working with children. But, working with children is just so emotionally draining that I can't do that right now. Not while our daughter is young. I don't know what to do. If I try to work part time I need to have childcare for my daughter...and the costs of that just don't make sense when I wouldn't be bringing in much money. The added stress of the daycare and all that just doesn't seem worth it. Plus, I'd end up in a job that I really have ZERO interest in since all my experience and passion is with children.

So...all that aside, my main question here is. Is it easier, less exhausted, less emotionally draining and all that to care for ONE daycare child in addition to my own child? I was previously caring for a total of 5 full-time kids (all under 20months). With my daycare it was completely separate from our living space so I was working 10hr days outside of the home...then doing 1-2 hours of daycare stuff after hours (meal prep, clean up, planning etc etc).

Is it easier to care for one more child up in our main house. Have some tv time, have them free play and self entertain and essentially 'baby sit'. Would I be able to do some house keeping, cooking and all that with 2 toddlers?

I am weary of making this move as I don't want to end up back where I was with the daycare...working endless hours and being so stressed and exhausted that I disconnected from my husband. But, I don't know how to move ahead as I can't really predict what it would be like.

Does this seem like a viable option? I feel like might would free me up to do all the 'house' stuff during the day. I would have only 2 kids so can use the car to go do groceries, go on playdates with my friends (who I hadn't seen when the daycare opened)...can have friends over for playdates etc. Obviously this would all be clearly discussed with the daycare families before they start. Their child would not be in daycare but would rather be here with me and my daughter as we go about life.

I think a HUGE factor of where I screwed up the first time through was I ran my daycare as completely separate from the house meaning I was working out of the home 60hrs a week, running my own business, with 5 young toddlers that I tried to give all my energy and emotion to. That left me to have to do all the house stuff, life stuff etc outside of daycare hours...but with a child of my own there just were not enough hours. I realize now that I am not capable of that. I just struggle with wondering how different it is to have less kids and to be actually in my home while watching them.

Any insight would be much appreciated.

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Oh my gosh, I would be exhausted as well with that many children under the age of 20 months. Maybe it would be better to care for a couple of kids over the age of say 2 1/2. I couldn't imagine watching that many young children (babies really) and having my own as well.when my children were young I worked part-time out of the home and even at that I was tired. I started my daycare when my kids were almost out of school. Perhaps you could nanny a couple of kids, that tends to pay better than "babysitting".

You sound a lot like I felt when our children were little but I think it was more me feeling like I wasn't contributing than my hubby making me feel that way. Now we've been married 28 years and we drive each other crazy at times but are very happily married. I now believe that I made a huge contribution to our lives together. It sounds like finances aren't an issue so could it be you put all this pressure on yourself unnecessarily?

Lee bee I'll take the cook if you don't want it ..... As long as she does the grocery shopping too !!!

How is your husband with your daughter in terms of taking care of her say one evening a week if you were to find a job - anything even babysitting which in some places is $7-10 an hour with no deductions. That would at least give you the spending money.

Glad that things are working out so far and hopefully in future sessions with the therapist you can address where you stand in all of the plans in terms of what part of keeping the household going is your responsibility and what is shared and what are the expectations as in determine with the therapist's help what are reasonable expectations.

As far as low ratio goes a lot would still be the same unless you were maybe taking only one other child same age as your own as a playmate and then visits to playgroup would save house mess some days, etc. You could also consider applying as a nanny in someone else's home and they often will let you bring your own child with you. Yes it means not being home but at the same time if you are gone from the home all day it isn't going to get dirty in the way it did when you did daycare.

I think that having one child, who is a good fit for your daughter, will be wonderful for you. They will play together and you will be able to get all your chores done during the day. Two little ones is certainly manageable to take out to do errands and shopping too.
I have my own two children and two others that I care for and I am able to get most of my chores done during the day. I don't do errands with the four of them but I definitely would if I had just two. Combine it with a stop at the park on the way home and the parents will be happy too.

Personally, I think one day care child or 6 makes no difference. Day care operating hours are the same regardless of the number present - and I have day care hours which I don't extend.

Just throwing a completely different idea out there..have you considered before and after school children only? Of course, shorter hours of care means lower income but it doesn't sound like the income level is a concern, more so the need to have independent funds.

If you think that would better suit you, determine your opening time for drop off, determine your closing time for pick up and don't be afraid to decline potential clients who want/need care outside of those hours. Depending on the hours your local school starts and finishes, it might mean working 4-5 hours a day tops, which leaves you time for your own child/your household responsibilities, and then once they leave at the end of the day, it's just your family time again. You might find the reduced hours would be less stressful.

Just throwing that out there as an idea.

That's a great idea ! Here before and after care is $375-450 a month !

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Originally Posted by Rachael

Personally, I think one day care child or 6 makes no difference. Day care operating hours are the same regardless of the number present - and I have day care hours which I don't extend.

Just throwing a completely different idea out there..have you considered before and after school children only? Of course, shorter hours of care means lower income but it doesn't sound like the income level is a concern, more so the need to have independent funds.

If you think that would better suit you, determine your opening time for drop off, determine your closing time for pick up and don't be afraid to decline potential clients who want/need care outside of those hours. Depending on the hours your local school starts and finishes, it might mean working 4-5 hours a day tops, which leaves you time for your own child/your household responsibilities, and then once they leave at the end of the day, it's just your family time again. You might find the reduced hours would be less stressful.

Just throwing that out there as an idea.

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I did consider the idea of before and after care...but it seemed like more work than taking on one child the same age as my daughter (18months). While it meant I had the middle of the day free it meant getting up early to get the before care going and being open later for after care. I wasn't really keen on that right now. But I do wonder if I will move into that next school year when my daughter is a bit older and will enjoy being with the older kids.

I had one of my old daycare families very keen to have me care for their child 3 days a week, I'll only be open 8-4:30 (8.5 instead of my old 10hr days) and they are providing a new car seat for me. So we will go out to library and playgroups and run errands. They will both nap in afternoon and the 2 girls were very good independent players and got along great (as great as 2 toddlers could). So I am pretty confident it will work out. I am excited to have less work load but still have a friend come for my daughter...who is very social. The family was great to work with in the past and are very receptive to my recommendations etc so I feel it is a good family to continue care with. The family knows it is no longer daycare but rather family care...so relaxed, informal days. I will be free to get some stuff done around the house when the kids play etc.

Hopefully it works out.

On a side note, things are going really well here. We've made great progress already with counselling. We just went on vacation (he travelled for work and took us then we went to a resort for 3 nights). We have made huge changes here at home in regards to who does what (shifting a lot of childcare to him and clarifying expectations).

I am doing great, feeling much more human and capable of my roles now that my focus is back to being mom and wife and not business owner (caregiver of 5 under 20months), mom and wife.

Lots of stuff to continue working on but we've made great strides already :-)

I would out playing on the driveway with my daughter today when a neighbor stopped to say hi...she asked where the daycare kids were. When I told her I close the daycare...she said good for me. Enjoy my family etc. it felt good to hear.

Awesome to hear that things are going well! Good luck to you :)