Judy Trickett - help me out here :) - who is correct regarding daycare closure & pay

Hi everyone,

Can I get everyone's two bits on this issue? I'm hoping Judy T will see the post and reply too because I really appreciate her sense of reason, humour and no nonsense "sensible thinking". (I love your blog, Judy....lol, I'm a fan!)

I have a contract stating that I am closed from December 24th onwards to the first opening business day in January. I ask for no payments during this time except for the three stat days (Christmas/Boxing Day/New Year's) at full rate pay, regardless of when they fall on the calendar year (ie even on a weekend) or if the child is regularly scheduled to come.

I have a few teachers as clients and this year because of how the holidays work out, the board of education has asked teachers back to work on January 9th. I am open as of Tuesday, January 3rd (or is everyone back on the 2nd? Maybe I should switch that! let me know too). The parents want me not to charge them for that week of January 2/3rd at all because their business is not open (ie. the schools)...I'm asking them to use either their holiday or pay half day rate if they are out of holiday time.

I was surprised that school is off for an extra week this year...my husband is back to work on the 2nd of January....aren't most people out there too?

Am I wrong? Am I right? What should I do, Judy? LOL Let me know what you guys think....Thanks in advance!

I'm not Judy, but I'm pretty sure that January 2nd is a stat holiday.

yes, that is why i am keeping closed until january 3rd,....are you open on the 3rd too? thanks for your input too alpha! :)

Other than some schools, most stores and businesses will be back to work on Jan 3. Some of my parents actually start Jan 2 adn instead were given the Friday before as the New Year's stat which means using Tuesday for Christmas so off Dec 26, 27, and Dec 30. Then allowed to use two days of annual leave to cover the Wed and Thurs for a whole week off. Since most of my parents are taking time off between Christmas and New Years but still paying me I am starting back to work for Jan 2 too.

Well the stat is actually the first of Jan but because it is a Sunday you get the Monday in lieu of....the school board is not giving an extra week there is still two full weeks off it just depends on what day of the week Christmas falls on. So I guess it would depend on how you originally set up their particular contract.... I had a teacher once before and our agreement was they had to pay for Christmas and march break and two weeks summer holidays and if they wanted to come back in sept they had to take their chances that I would have space or pay for a part time space.

My kids are not back to school until the 9th also. But, they also stay in school until the 22nd! So its the same timeframe, just later.
Personally, I get paid for stats, 10 holiday days and 4 personal days in the calendar year. The way that Christmas works this year, I will be off between Christmas eve and New years, and only need to take 2 days of holidays. I will reopen on Jan 2nd. Any parents that are off after that will have the option of bringing their child. I should hope that if they are home, they would like to spend time with them. If they do not bring their child, they will still pay the fee.
When it comes to holidays, I explain to parents that I charge a regular, flat rate that is slightly LOWER than I would if I was to take UNpaid holidays. That way, we can all budget, instead of paying fluctuating fees. It's easier for everyone.

Can I just say ...WTH???????

Why do THEY get to tell YOU when they will pay?? No way in HELL........They pay or they are GONE. Period.

Yes, most people are taking off January 2nd in lieu of the stat of New Years Day.

Seriously, where do these people get off telling you they won't pay for it just because THEY aren't working?? Would they call and tell the gym they aren't paying for their membership one week in July because they are going on vacation and won't be needing it?

This is ridiculous.

They pay or they no longer have daycare.

ETA: Oh, and BTW, if you are having issues with then then demand that they give you a post dated cheque for the amount they own the week of Christmas when you are closed. Because I can see them coming the week after that and refusing to pay for it. Get it in advance.

I am surprised they didn't discuss this issue with you when they first signed up with you! It's usually the first thing teachers ask, whether or not your require to be payed when they are off work.
It's our business, so we get to decide what kind of deal to offer to teachers. I offered my one teacher parent that she didn't need to pay me for the Christmas break and March break because I was desperate to fill one of my spaces, but I don't think I will ever do that again. There are lots of different ways to handle teachers and their breaks, most of which are discussed on different threads. If you have the rule that when you are open, they pay, then you should stick to this rule or you could work some other deal out with them.

Right on, Judy! Thanks for knocking sense back into me....of course, you are completely correct - thanks again! :) Love the gym analogy! Ok, I gotta ask, is that really a picture of you? I find your writing extremely witty and entertaining and have laughed outloud so many times reading your blog and no-fluff zone! Thanks for the entertainment! :)

Thanks to everyone that responded - I feel much, much better about the situation. I really appreciate all of your comments and advice.

I spoke to both sets of teacher parents tonight and they both backtracked when I pulled out the contract which states clearly that I am closed from December 24th until the first business day in January, which they both signed off on.

Unfortunately all the holidays are on weekends this year and we don't get any days "technically off in lieu" and it just works out this year that its less time overall. Judy, I am truly confident that both will pay as they do already both upfront in monthly installments, so I am not worried that they will run out on me.

You guys are all right - yes, teachers get two weeks off in total - its just how the holidays fall that the non-teaching world has to go back to work on January 3rd. Its time to think about applying to teacher's college sooner than later! Have a great night and thanks again for all the replies! ((hugs to all my fellow daycare providers!))

I can see though where the wording of your contract is open to interpretation. Whose return to business day. They return to business Jan 9 and could assume that is the day they pay from. I would be ammending the wording of the contract for the future. If you take off only a week at Christmas then state it that way that you will be open the first day following the stat.

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Originally Posted by lori123

Unfortunately all the holidays are on weekends this year and we don't get any days "technically off in lieu" and it just works out this year that its less time overall.

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Doesn't matter that the stats fall on a wkd, you still get three stat days off WITH pay.
I'm taking dec 26th off-for boxing day, dec 27th off-for christmas, and dec 30th off-for new years-all paid. Than I'm taking the wed and thurs off w/o pay. I open the following week, but the way my parents schedules work I will only have one child in care as the rest are staying home.

Lori, just so you know, if your contract says you get paid for stats, you DO get stats in lieu off, WITH PAY.

That is how the rest of the country works - why wouldn't it apply to us?

Actually it doesn't work this way in Alberta if a stat falls on the weekend companies actually do not have to pay or give days of in lieu(most do though) also I am 98% positive boxing day is not a stat here.

True true playfelt - I should change the wording of my contract to open after the stat day and not the first business day of the year....time to rework my contract for sure....though its always nerve wracking to give out a new contract with some changes to it and see how the parents will react. I'm going to be down one child (after months of advertising, I found one that fit in well and then Mom got a promotion and needs much longer hours than I can give) and will be a bit nervous to give the others a change in contract....bills have to be paid!

definitely alphagetti - i will be getting paid for those days, no worries....its just how i wrote my contract about returning to work on the first business day of the year is a little vague, i suppose - i should have said the day after the stat holiday instead. not all business open up on the same day, ie the schools, lucky ones!

A good reason to make Sept the date for contract renewal than Christmas. It is a busy expensive time so not the best time to hit up parents for more money. And because it is busy it is easy for the parents to forget to actually read the contract, etc.

Also if they object to the changes and decide to leave there is a chance of filling the space before Christmas and not having an opening just as your holiday bills start to come in.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by playfelt

A good reason to make Sept the date for contract renewal than Christmas. It is a busy expensive time so not the best time to hit up parents for more money. And because it is busy it is easy for the parents to forget to actually read the contract, etc.

Also if they object to the changes and decide to leave there is a chance of filling the space before Christmas and not having an opening just as your holiday bills start to come in.

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Just a point - I have NEVER lost a family due to a fee increase and/or contract change. Most families, if they value what you offer, will NOT leave over an increase.

[QUOTE=lori123;6971]

I was surprised that school is off for an extra week this year...my husband is back to work on the 2nd of January....aren't most people out there too? [Quote]

In Ontario this year the school board holidays are Dec. 26 - Jan 6. In the past it's always been earlier, but not this year. So school is not off for an extra week, it's still the two weeks they get a Christmas probably. But if you are open then they have to pay and I wouldn't offer reduced rate of pay. I have a teacher as well and she always has to pay me regardless. For instance, this spring I'm taking a week in April as opposed to March break. She will have to pay me for March break, even though she is off.

Also, Jan. 2 is a stat in lieu of New Years day...which means you get it off with pay.

I tell my dc parents at the interview: if the daycare is open and available to you, you pay. If I am not available to you, you don't pay. If your teacher parents have the option of bringing their children, if they choose not to they are still responsible for the space that is reserved for them. THEY are getting paid for those holidays, you are still working, so you should too

momplus, Wow. I had NO idea about Alberta being different like that. I can't believe that Boxing Day is not considered a stat in some provinces. I am seriously blown away.

Having said that, I'd still put it in my contract :)

My contract is worded that I get all Federal Holidays off - since my hubby is military he gets those days and it included Boxing day, Easter Monday, Remembrance Day which not everyone gets.

I also listed all the stat holidays in my contract and included Boxing Day but not Remembrance Day. You can take any stats off that you want to as long as it is clearly stated in the contract. Listing the dates in your contract avoids confusion or debate over this.

I changed my contract from 'paid stat days' to 'paid closed days' because I added in Family Day, Christmas Eve day and Easter Monday, none of which are stat days for many companies. However, I send out a quarterly newsletter with important dates stated with closed dates so that my daycare families remember all my closed days, including my vacations (3 weeks per year), but those are unpaid days. I always make sure to remind my families about all the closed PAID days so they don't forget or argue. I haven't had any problems at all.

I'm actually closed the week between Christmas and New year's this year and include the New Years holiday in there but I still have some families who are keeping their children home with them on the Mon. Jan. 2nd because they have the day off. Then of course, I have a couple of families who are bringing their children to daycare because I'm technically open and they want to get their money's worth or whatever! Since I'm 'technically open' what can I say! I'm just grateful to the 3 families out of 5 who are keeping their children home with them that day. PARENTS!