Time to discharge her from care?

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Originally Posted by mickyc

Although this child is being difficult I don't believe in terminating over everything. Where do all these children end up? bouncing from daycare to daycare is not the answer either. This child needs to be taught what is acceptable behaviour and quick. I do not allow those sort of tantrum's. Children who act this way have been allowed to act this way at home. Kids learn fast what is acceptable at home and what is acceptable in a daycare home even if the rules are totally different. The difference is the provider. If you are firm and strict then the child will learn quick. They likely won't enjoy coming to your house for the first bit while they learn what is expected of them. I always say if some of my parents saw how I interact with their child they wouldn't keep their child here. It isn't that I am mean but some kids never hear NO at home and I have rules and do not allow tantrums, talking back, negotiating etc which I find so many parents allow these days.

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I agree with what you say for the most part, but no, some kids do not learn fast even with firmness. Each child is different and personality type plays a part I think. Also if the parent's are the polar opposite of the provider then some children are worse because of this and although they may learn there are two sets of rules, may very well not adapt to them and follow them if they have a strong and stubborn personality. That is a real and common occurrence, and can be counter productive resulting in continued poor behaviour while resulting in a negative environment for the majority of the group which is completely unacceptable. I don't believe in terminating on every whim, but to not terminate because you don't like to terminate, at the expense of the majority of the group is doing the other children and their families a disservice so if that's the case then it is in the best interest of the majority to terminate. It may mean this child goes from provider to provider but that is the effect on 1 child versus another 5 or 6 and potentially more, Also another child may be more receptive to another provider. Some children are not responsive to a strict firm approach, it doesn't mean that they should be given special treatment or be tip toed around by any means, but the harshness towards them could result in awful negative consequences. It is important to remember that every child is different and should be approached as such otherwise the only one who suffers as a result in the long run is the child. This is a common problem with school age children as they are taught only to one model and if they can't get in line then they are classed as being the one with something wrong when really its not the case, it is the teachers and caregivers. Not quite the same but on the surface it is and obviously way more complicated and difficult to accommodate but in a small setting such as home care in some cases could be easily accommodated if all parties are on board and resources are made available. If the parents are not working in line with the provider and the child can not adapt to the providers way of doing things, then they really should leave. This is also the responsibilities of the parents too. If they are not doing their part then it makes things more difficult for the child and as a result the whole daycare suffers including the provider. I do not like to give up on a child but if sticking with them is at the expense of others then the best thing to do is actually cut that one child loose.

I guess we will agree to disagree for the most part bright sparks. I just find everyone on this site is so quick to say terminate. Kids are work and dealing with other's people's children can be exhausting when the rules are not the same at home. Kids learn to adjust but the provider must be consistent. I have the same rules for all my kids. Yes they are all individuals but I am not about to make exceptions for any particular child/family. The rules are the rules and they are for all no matter what. I always take the same approach with my daycare kids as I did with my step kids growing up. I couldn't control what went on in their mom's home but I certainly can control what goes on here. The rules were polar opposite but after a few days the kids adjusted back into what was expected of them here. When it comes to daycare we have to give the kids a chance to adjust, hopefully get the parents on board (some situations I don't even bother with because you know it will land on deaf ears) and deal with the situation. If the provider gives it a fair shot and then doesn't see improvement and feels the need to terminate then so be it but you can just terminate just because it is difficult. Just my 2 cents.

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Originally Posted by mickyc

I guess we will agree to disagree for the most part bright sparks. I just find everyone on this site is so quick to say terminate. Kids are work and dealing with other's people's children can be exhausting when the rules are not the same at home. Kids learn to adjust but the provider must be consistent. I have the same rules for all my kids. Yes they are all individuals but I am not about to make exceptions for any particular child/family. The rules are the rules and they are for all no matter what. I always take the same approach with my daycare kids as I did with my step kids growing up. I couldn't control what went on in their mom's home but I certainly can control what goes on here. The rules were polar opposite but after a few days the kids adjusted back into what was expected of them here. When it comes to daycare we have to give the kids a chance to adjust, hopefully get the parents on board (some situations I don't even bother with because you know it will land on deaf ears) and deal with the situation. If the provider gives it a fair shot and then doesn't see improvement and feels the need to terminate then so be it but you can just terminate just because it is difficult. Just my 2 cents.

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I agree but it doesn't sound like this provider is just terminating because the child is difficult. Also I never said have a different set of rules but simply that each child is different and no matter how hard you persevere some children just will not work. At that point it is okay to terminate versus putting all the children through the stress of the tantrums ongoing if their is no sign of progress. I think on here it goes through phases of people wanting to terminate, but the people who generally post saying terminate are not the OP and the OP's are generally looking for support and advice on how to help the child NOT saying that they will just terminate because they have had enough. It's healthy and necessary to set boundaries. At some point you have to know when enough is enough and its best to know your boundaries prior to taking so much that you can't manage any more. It will be different for different people. Like those who have termed after just a few days of crying during transition because they couldn't handle it anymore. That's absolutely fine as they know their own limits whereas others can some how manage to put up with the screaming for weeks and sometimes months. I don't believe there is 1 single right way of doing something which means that 1 model of discipline for all children doesn't always work. If the provider isn't able to be adaptable to other methods, which doesn't in any way imply different rules or leniency for the child, then it is likely in the child's best interest for the provider to let them go to another provider who may have more luck with the child.

I would go right to removal from the table if she acted like that. Right to time out until everyone is finished. No second chances.

She is 4. She is old enough to know better.

I would have a frank talk with mom, tell her that this behaviour cannot continue. Pick a point on your calendar where you expect to see improvement. If no improvement, then decide to either try something else or move on.

Kids are able to understand that there are daycare rules and home rules. She needs to know that these are your rules and she needs to follow them. She will need consistency from you and an immediate consequence. Maybe a reminder of expected behaviour before getting up to the table. Then if she starts acting up, immediately get her down. "We don't scream at the table." Right to a quiet place to sit until snack, lunch, whatever is finished. No second chances.

She won't starve. If she's hungry, she'll behave.

I have a girl in my care who says "yuck" to everything.

Every time I hear it I ask her "Have you tried this?" If she says no, I have a one bite rule. 8/10 she finishes her whole plate/bowl without incident, saying that it was really yummy. My second mission with this dck is to try my best to get her to say "no thank you" as opposed to "yuck." I cannot stand that word...(I have my reasons, lol)

I also have another girl who just sat there without eating. I set a time limit on when lunch was over, and she quickly learned that after 40 mins, (Sometimes a bit more if it was harder to eat, like pasta or something) that plates were taken away, and that she would get water instead of milk if she didn't finish.