Why do I find it so hard to "crack down" on parents?

Why do I find it so hard to really "crack down"? I feel like most of you guys have such an easy time being Tough when you have to. Are you all "blowing smoke":laugh: or do you REALLY "give it" to parents when it comes to...not following your rules, payment, drop-off, pick-up, behaviors and such. I just feel like if I tried to tackle every rule that was broken with a "term letter" or "verbal warning" I'd be like the angry teacher that nobody likes, always getting after the children. Honestly, all of your responses are so "straight forward and to the point", is that the God's honest truth? Do I have to take a class to be a real "nasty" when I need to be? I even send out reminders and they "mock" the few times I have tried to issue "late fees" they have gotten mad and left my care. What the heck! :unsure:

I have actually often wondered the same thing...everyone on here talks the talk, but do they actually walk the walk? I am pretty good at keeping things running smoothly and haven't had many problems with parents breaking my rules, but I do struggle with confrontation. I have often wondered if everyone who always says "terminate" on this forum actually terminates as often as they advocate others to...cause talk is easy ;)

I jump right on an issue, but via email first. I will not take being walked all over and disrespected. Email messages gives parents the time to read it over and if they are upset, gives them time to cool off and think it through. IF they choose to not respond, I will ask them first thing in the morning if they received my email last night, and ask them if they had any questions.

Thanks for verifying my "confusion" Sunnydays.:thumbup: It is just sooooo much easier to say..."I would terminate immediately" or "not at my house", how many of you REALLY follow through on your talk?

How many families have you terminated in how many years? Answer if you dare.

I'll go first. I can remember 3 in ten years. I have had almost 50 families through my door. NEXT!...

I'd have to say that about 95% of the time I walk the walk. I don't stand for BS in my dayhome and I don't take crap from parents. How many kids have I terminated? none! How many kids have I given a notice of behaviour issues to...a few. Those few parents chose to leave my care and go elsewhere instead of trying to correct the problem and work WITH me as a team. Do I care that they left? NOPE! My contract/package is pretty long, in depth and to the point with no sugar coating. The families I get into my care are all on the same page as me and abide by the contract/package I give them to sign. I charge late fees and parents willing pay them, I voice my optinions, etc. and for the most part have had VERY good families in care.

I'm a total sucker with parents and admit it freely. However, after 11 years, I've had to become more forceful, though I find it difficult. I've always run a very relaxed daycare (from the business end) and for the most part, it went well. Of course, there are always some people who will take advantage. I just always dealt with those situations as they came along and modified when I needed to. However, in the past couple of years, now that my business has moved into more people that I don't know, I've had problems. For the first time, I'm drawing up contracts and putting rules in place that I'm not comfortable with and will, undoubtedly, have to enforce them. I'm so glad to hear that someone else has a hard time with this end of things as well.

Thanks!

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Originally Posted by fruitloop

I'd have to say that about 95% of the time I walk the walk. I don't stand for BS in my dayhome and I don't take crap from parents. How many kids have I terminated? none! How many kids have I given a notice of behaviour issues to...a few. Those few parents chose to leave my care and go elsewhere instead of trying to correct the problem and work WITH me as a team. Do I care that they left? NOPE! My contract/package is pretty long, in depth and to the point with no sugar coating. The families I get into my care are all on the same page as me and abide by the contract/package I give them to sign. I charge late fees and parents willing pay them, I voice my optinions, etc. and for the most part have had VERY good families in care.

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Yup, same here. I've termed 3 families in 2 years. And let me tell you, it felt like so much weight lifted from my shoulders!

I run two businesses, so why should I feel out and stressed at the end of each day? You don't like my rules, then there's the door, and try not to let it hit you on the way out!

To be honest, I don't let it to come at that point. If they disrespect me I tell them on the spot. If they don't correct themselves and do it again then I tell them when they do it second time and prepare the letter that afternoon to give them next morning. They are not kids they are adults and they should know what is expectable what is not. Im not going to warn them again and again.

The thing is, if I'm upset and not happy about things then i wont make anyone happy and obviously it will effect my mood and I don't feel like doing this job anymore. So why should I let other people bother me and ruin my mood? I can take a lot of nonsense from kids cause they don't know what they are doing and they are being kids but if a parent doing this I'm sorry i wont take it. I'm not your mother to correct you.

I didn't have to term. Anyone as I said I tell them on the spot and they correct themselves immediately as they know what will happen next if they don't follow my rules.

I know our finances making us take these craps from parents but for me there is no amount of money worth for my sanity. I can perfectly go and find a cleaning job with no stress. Beside, my house my rules. So yes, I walk the walk :)

I think that it is a gradual process. When I first started daycare, I made sure my interview package was awesome, and yes, many of my policies are still the same. But I didn't take myself seriously. I didn't think I would ever need to use my late fee policy, because I thought all parents would rush to pick up their kids after they were in care from 7:00-5:30. Not always the case. I didn't think people would send their kids sick. They did! Surely, people would not knock and wake up my kid and try to come earlier than their scheduled drop off. Sure did. It was infuriating, and most of the times I let these kids in care, I was mad at myself for not standing up for myself and the kid. Now that I have been at this a little longer, I can see those experiences for what they were: learning experiences. It is never easy to "walk the walk". When I re-opened after a move and my mat leave, I ended up terminating two families that did not work. One was an immediate termination. And yes, both times I stressed and stressed before making the final decision and having a very difficult conversation, but ultimately I just kept telling myself that these families do what is best for them all the time - I need to do what is best for MY family. And what is best for my family is a Mom that is not stressed because people are taking advantage of her good nature. I still hate confrontation. I try to get most of it over with in the interview. Now I have a two interview process. I have the 1st interview and that lasts about an hour. If I like them, I give them the parent handbook and my list of references. And then we both take 24 hours to think about things. I don't sign people right away anymore. If I have a bad feeling, I don't sign them. The second interview, they must have read the handbook and then we go over the contract together so there are no surprises and they can ask questions so there is no confusion on any policies. If they are at all difficult during this interview, I just say it will not work out after all. I find doing it this way reduces the amount of difficult conversations I have to have once care has started. Once you give in once, it sort of sets a precedent and it is a slippery slope. I make sure to charge my late fee now even if they are a few minutes late without phone call. I don't unlock my door until opening time. I have turned sick kids away and phoned to pick them up right away. Once I started enforcing my contract, and had compatible parents in care, it gets easier. I know how it feels though. The first time you stand up for yourself is always the hardest. I wish you so much luck, because you DO deserve fair treatment and you will feel miles better once the people treating you badly are treating you better or out of your life altogether.

Haha, nope, I don't let a problem fester and drive me crazy, I tell the parents about the issues with the children daily. That way if it's an ongoing problem and they have heard it come out of my mouth a hundred times they know why I'm reaching the end of my rope. I've had parents really start to help me with a problem with their child after I have said the same thing over and over and they see my exhaustion and frustration. I'm one of those people who says exactly what I mean and what I'm thinking shows on my face. So when the parents say something so upsetting to me they can see that I'm upset. I'm honest, straightforward and my clients respect me for that. There is no hidden agenda or sarcasm or subtle hints. My words verbally and written are my thoughts.

To tell you the truth, I had horrible problems in my first year, but I implemented my contract and learned to be tough about it and now any time I have an issue arise I simply say 'according to our contract that you signed and read ............' I just had a Mom who had to be told to reread the toilet training part, but otherwise I haven't had problems in years with payment or anything to do with breaking my rules. I did get mad at a Dad who announced he was going to use 1/2 an hour extra a day for a while without ASKING me, but he stopped, because as I said, my face shows what I think and my face said 'WHAT?'.

I think most of us give good honest advice we would follow ourselves. We can freely state our respectful opinions so why would we bullsh!t a fellow provider. I don't believe we have to take a course in "nasty" to stand up for our policies and I think most would agree with that. If someone in this forum in always advocating the do or die approach, I am sure most of us would recognize that we should take the advice less seriously.:)

Haha! I am a little scardy cat when it comes to being assertive. But I know that it all comes down to inseurity. I am afraid of what they will think of me if I am assertive and stand my ground. I'm afraid they won't like me and will find another daycare. I am even more afraid now than I was after psycho mom. But I am also aware of just how serious it is to HAVE to be assertive. I generally take the "easy way out" and send home letter than do a face to face. And there are times that I let some of my families get away with things. Like tonight, my oldest kid's dad was 10 minutes later picking him up. But dad doesn't usually do pick ups and it was the very first time in 2 months so I didn't even give a warning. I KNOW they won't try to take advantage. But there are issues I also KNOW i can't let one of my other family's get away with. And honestly, I had the HARDEST time with them. They both have social issues - awkward and kind of weird, and I felt kind of intimiated by them, maybe cause they were my first family and we're very close in age so I know mom sees me as more of a peer, but I found that the more I cracked down, the more they respected me and took me seriously.

It's SO hard to "crack down" and I can tell you have a pretty big heart, so something like this would probably be really difficult to do. It's funny. We're with children all day long so we obviously have a much softer side than most people, but then we're expected to be assertive and "bossy" with the parents.

But you need to do it for you. If you feel you're being taken advantage of, you need to make a stand. Do it in a letter. I always say I do it in letters so that I can keep a written record in their file, but really, it's so I can avoid confrontation lol

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Originally Posted by kidlove

Thanks for verifying my "confusion" Sunnydays.:thumbup: It is just sooooo much easier to say..."I would terminate immediately" or "not at my house", how many of you REALLY follow through on your talk?

How many families have you terminated in how many years? Answer if you dare.

I'll go first. I can remember 3 in ten years. I have had almost 50 families through my door. NEXT!...

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I really should read all these BEFORE answering the initial one lol I have terminated ONE and...and we all know why...and I have WANTED - at one point or another - to terminate three (I've only have 5 families in and out lol). I feel the same way about people saying they terminate. Sometimes, I find some people seem really "hard" but I think it comes with the territory. I think that the longer you're doing this, the "harder" you become and the less you're likely to "put up with". But I honestly think, that given the opportunity EVERYONE would rather work on it then terminate. i think we all jump to terminations because in words it sounds like it's not working, but we're not living it. It's hard to actually DO. But if anyone every came on here and started going on about a psycho mom, then i would say TERMINATE hahaha but I have had my fair share of crazies, and parents that seem to "mock" but the more I "crack down" the better they become.
I started a daycare because I was a nanny before and I was tired of being treated as a second class citizen. Thus, I am a little more senstive when people try to take advantage of me and my rules. And I think we're ALL daycare providers because we ALL have a certain level of control issues. So then we want to make sure people are always following our rules. But like Reggio says (where is she anyways), it's a two way street and one respect deserves another respect. If we want them to respect us and not treat us like second class citizens, then we must do the same with them and be as patient as humanly possible :blink:

Sorry. I'm such a ranter!

Oh, I forgot to answer that part of the question too. Thanks Littledragon. I terminated 2 families in my first year and had one family take off without notice or payment, urgh!

So I learned to be really picky about the families I accepted into care but that came with my confidence in my abilities and my program and learning to run a great interview and read 'red flags'. And in the past 4 years I haven't had any issues.

I gage each parent seperately as to how I approach them. Most are very agreeable and understanding however I have a mom who is very nice but very defensive. No matter how you phrase something she hears a critisium (sp) and gives a defensive answer. I tread carefully with her and gently stand my ground with my policys. I have only had to terminate one family and it was after putting up with alot of policy infractions that I finally said enough. I still felt bad doing it as I loved the child.

I too do what I say.....but not as HARSH :laugh: I'd have no clients left if I said what I really WANTED to say!

I have to word it in more of a 'suggestion' sometimes and time it right too. Like they say you get more with sugar then vinegar (I think). Do I like doing it? NO I get all nervous lol but at the end of the day it has to be my way for me to from going crazy and continue doing my job.

I've termed two families so far...one was a nut job mother and another signed a contract for 2 days a week...then it started changing the days (tues-wed to mon, wed or thurs, fri) and it was too much work to change up my routine constantly. Then they went down to only one day a week....I don't offer drop in care so I asked them to honnor the contract. They said they couldn't commit to it so I said good bye.

Mamma Mia, you made a good point. If you tell the parents NICELY exactly what has to change and ask them for help and have discussions with them to explain that it's for their child's benefit to make a good start in life they will be very receptive. I never lecture parents but always let them know that it's their child that needs our help to learn good behaviour and I'm ready to do the work to help them. I have a good relationship with all my clients because of this and that makes for happy days for all.

I've termed one family in my year and a half and I am no longer afraid to do it again if need be...although I certainly didn't enjoy it! But I do think speaking respectfully with parents can often lead to solutions being found without having to terminate...sometime s however it is just not possible to work with people.

Thanks everyone for your responses, I sometimes view the majority of you as "harder than me" thinking "maybe I need to be more firm on my families?" but, after reading your responses, there are really only a few of you who seem to be "hard-core" Follow my Rules or Hit the Road! kind of ladies, the rest of you seem more like me, "work it out for the betterment" before terminating. :) I always address issues when need be, with a quick comment or universal letter to all. I do prefer to "terminate" on a last resort basis. I see eye to eye with cfred, and littledragon on the "hating confrontation" and have to say: I totally agree with Mamma-mia, I too "want to say" what I wouldn't dare have come out of my mouth. (that's what I come here for :laugh: or go to my poor Husband about!!!! So I don't "spew" how I really feel...otherwise, I'd lose all my families because at one time or another, I could have really said some BAD things to all of them (sure they could say some crazy stuff to me too) thank God for "self control" :laugh:
Even though I have only terminated 3, I have had many more "leave" by choice, "if the going got tough" (sometimes we didnt see eye to eye, or had MANY talks regarding not following contract or child/parent behavior) they made the choice for me...thats always the best, that way...you get rid of the "fruit cake and don't look like the "bad-guy".:D

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Originally Posted by Momof4

Mamma Mia, you made a good point. If you tell the parents NICELY exactly what has to change and ask them for help and have discussions with them to explain that it's for their child's benefit to make a good start in life they will be very receptive. I never lecture parents but always let them know that it's their child that needs our help to learn good behaviour and I'm ready to do the work to help them. I have a good relationship with all my clients because of this and that makes for happy days for all.

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This doesn't always work. I'm not mean when I talk to parents. I actually hate confrontation...A LOT...but I've learnt that I have to be assertive and stand my ground. I offer help, even go as far as researching and printing things off for parents to help them with things. I offer suggestions and research different strategies to work with a child to help their behaviour. BUT, you can only do that for so long before you have to do what's best for you and your group, ya know? I don't terminate over small things that can be worked on. I terminate over bigger things and things that just can't be changed even though I've tried my hardest. Hell, I worked with a child for almost 10 months to correct things but without the support of the parents, it's a loss cause and in this case, the parents were the ones who went else where instead of trying to work with me.

So, this is not always the case :)

Kidlove, I'm by no means a hard ass and I will try to work with a family in the case of a child's behaviour BUT I do stand by my policies and enforce them. After all, they're there for a reason right?

Fruitloop, I enforce my policies to the letter too. I just had to call a Mom to drop off her payment because Dad did the pickup about 10 minutes ago and (headsmack) I didn't get paid. And I was not in a good mood so the Mom is coming over when she finishes work. This is the kind of thing where I'm not so nice! I shouldn't have to ask for my weekly payment ever!

Everyone in life thrives with consistency .... IMO there is no point in having a contract or policies if we do not 'enforce' them and allow clients to just pay late or disrespect the rules and so forth .... however enforcing them does not mean we need to be nasty or aggressive ... you can be assertive while still being professional and 'warm' so to speak ~ I find humor goes a long way in getting my point across in a non-threatening manner ... I rarely have any true problems with clients either their parents or children because everyone knows what to expect and knows the consequences for any misbehavior which are clearly defined in my handbook and they trust based on my approach to my business that I will indeed follow through on them ... that and over the years I have gotten very picky in enrolling only people who share my key values so I am not having to deal with people who are working 'against me' with their children so to speak ~ my first and only 'mistake' in enrolling just 'anyone' who showed an interest just graduated out of the program after 5 years of struggling with different 'values'.

For example with my 'mistake' family I have in my behaviour management philosophy that we as adult needs to say what we mean and mean what we say when guiding the children this is a KEY value for me .... aka do not make an empty threat you do not intend to follow through on if pushed by the child ... so in the spirit of that practice I once sent this client and her 18 month old very rude / snotty child home for the day during a drop off because after having calmly and professionally 'reminded' the parent the day prior about the importance of this practice in ensuring we are establishing trust in a child to know the expectations and consequences of their environment to guide their behavior positively the parent during drop off 'threatened' the child again this time saying that if she was rude to one more child that she was going home to bed for the day ... and well the child was rude 10 seconds later as children will be with a challenge like that given so as a 'consequence' to help the mother and child LEARN that I truly meant that you need to say what you mean and mean what you say she was handed the child's belongings with a calm and professional 'well on that note I guess we will see you both again tomorrow and hopefully spending the day in her room resting will help to instill the skill you greet people politely tomorrow when you come back' and I sent them home ... and mother learned that you PAY for words so choose them wisely because she had to stay home with her kid who was not 'sick' and pay me for the day because I was open and able to work but she screwed that up by not respecting my advice and rules on guiding behavior ;)

I was not bitchy or angry or aggressive with that parent or child but I was certainly firm and assertive that I mean what I say in my policies ... sadly that parent never truly GOT IT cause instead of threatening the child she turned to bribing her instead which led and a challenging 4.5 years ahead for me in my program .... I have never terminated a client since doing home childcare because I have always maintained that as long as they pay on time, are respectful and are the child is not a 'danger' to the other kids I can work with anyone .... but in hindsight this is one where I wish I had have gotten angry over the above incident and terminated her for defying my policy cause it was a clear indication that the mother was just never going to 'get it' no matter how frankly I explained how her actions 'create behaviour' in her child cause it was a long arduous road of behaviours that were just 'annoying' but not enough to put the other kids in danger and well they paid on time and respected all my policies for the most part just were 'annoying' cause we did not share the same values over how to raise children to be productive members of society verses spoiled brats :rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by ladyjbug

I think that it is a gradual process. When I first started daycare, I made sure my interview package was awesome, and yes, many of my policies are still the same. But I didn't take myself seriously. I didn't think I would ever need to use my late fee policy, because I thought all parents would rush to pick up their kids after they were in care from 7:00-5:30. Not always the case. I didn't think people would send their kids sick. They did! Surely, people would not knock and wake up my kid and try to come earlier than their scheduled drop off. Sure did. It was infuriating, and most of the times I let these kids in care, I was mad at myself for not standing up for myself and the kid. Now that I have been at this a little longer, I can see those experiences for what they were: learning experiences. It is never easy to "walk the walk". When I re-opened after a move and my mat leave, I ended up terminating two families that did not work. One was an immediate termination. And yes, both times I stressed and stressed before making the final decision and having a very difficult conversation, but ultimately I just kept telling myself that these families do what is best for them all the time - I need to do what is best for MY family. And what is best for my family is a Mom that is not stressed because people are taking advantage of her good nature. I still hate confrontation. I try to get most of it over with in the interview. Now I have a two interview process. I have the 1st interview and that lasts about an hour. If I like them, I give them the parent handbook and my list of references. And then we both take 24 hours to think about things. I don't sign people right away anymore. If I have a bad feeling, I don't sign them. The second interview, they must have read the handbook and then we go over the contract together so there are no surprises and they can ask questions so there is no confusion on any policies. If they are at all difficult during this interview, I just say it will not work out after all. I find doing it this way reduces the amount of difficult conversations I have to have once care has started. Once you give in once, it sort of sets a precedent and it is a slippery slope. I make sure to charge my late fee now even if they are a few minutes late without phone call. I don't unlock my door until opening time. I have turned sick kids away and phoned to pick them up right away. Once I started enforcing my contract, and had compatible parents in care, it gets easier. I know how it feels though. The first time you stand up for yourself is always the hardest. I wish you so much luck, because you DO deserve fair treatment and you will feel miles better once the people treating you badly are treating you better or out of your life altogether.

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Well said ! I agree with your statement about the early "mistakes" we all make being learning experiences. Dont be too hard on yourself - it's always hard to have difficult conversations with people. Have you ever considered taking a course on assertiveness training or how to have difficult conversations ? My husband took a training seminar through work entitled "How to work with difficult people" and I learned a lot picking his brain after the fact. See if you can read some books that give you concrete strategies for managing these kind of people and situations - you need these skills to work in this field. =) (and keep your receipts - this is a business expense - you can write it all off on your taxes)