Strange form of discipline

[Inspired by Reggio]

To spank or not to spank is a VERY personal journey ~ however I will admit that I do love listening to debates about why people think it 'works' and why others think it is not acceptable or damaging to children's psyche ~ I learn so much about other peoples logic of their decisions!

IMO the discussion and reflection on all our practices in life are imperative to the personal journey that is life ... from spanking to health and nutrition, our spirituality, education, relationships and so forth ~ asking ourselves WHY and reflecting on our past and where we want to be in our future is all part of us perfecting this journey called life

I often wonder back in history how similar debates unfolded in communities, town halls, dinner tables around the country ... debates of 'changing views on social acceptableness' .... back when we decided to free the slaves and the debates on would that be good or bad and how they must have sounded ~ it seems so 'normal' for us to see this practice as wrong now but I cannot help but wonder how did one argue that it was 'acceptable' practice back than cause it must have seemed normal for them that this was an OK thing to practice?

Or back when women stood up and demanded to be seen as 'people' under the law verse property and demanded the right to vote, to work outside the home, to hold office and so forth and those who fought against that change because of fear that allowing it would result in chaos to their way of life ... the number of women who were beaten and ostracized for daring to stand up against the 'norm' and demand more for themselves and yet here we are in 2012 we cannot imagine not having the rights and freedoms we have or living in a society where we were allowed to be treated with so little dignity.

Or over the past 40 years the repeated revisiting of discussions over the use of corporal punishment in various scenarios as society started reflecting on what worked or did not work or what was 'right or wrong' or socially acceptable or not to do to another human being so to speak as we created the laws that govern us as a society ... thinking back to not too long ago in our history when it was common practice in our society to use spanking as discipline not just in our homes but in our schools, in our churches, in our prisons, in our mental hospitals, in places of employment .... this was something legal to do and ANY adult could do it to someone they had power/authority over teaching / educating / supervising because it was seen as the most effective way to 'correct behavior' .... but now a days if a teacher spanked your child even the 'spankers' amongst us would likely be livid because we do not see that as acceptable any longer.

So the debates and shifts in thinking that took a long time coming to stop those practices as people clung to what they 'knew' to be effective regardless of if it was 'best' ... I am sure we can all agree that we could not honestly imagine that it would be ok if you did not starch your spouses work shirts properly that he could turn you over his knee and give you 5 spanks with his hand or a hairbrush or whatever or that if you were working in an office setting and forgot to refill the photocopier that it was acceptable for the boss to spank you in an effort to help you learn to perform properly .... for us this now seems ludicrous logic to think that this was 'needed' in order to control women cause we know we are fully capable of learning through consistent expectations and TIME to master skills but our ancestors this was common practice for women to be expected to disciplined in this manner .... just like in many households we still hold true to this logic for children that they 'need' this physical punishment to help them 'get it' so to speak.

I think we can agree that as women we've come a long way since those days in Canada where we as women were not seen as individuals with rights but rather the property first of our parents and than of our spouse, where it was legal to use corporal punishment on us to 'teach' us how to properly run a house, to not talk back to our spouse and so forth basically for us to be continually treated as we treat children well into adulthood because we were not seen to be able to grow in any other way .... IMO we still just have a long way to come in how we view the children in our society and what rights and protections they should have in comparison of other members of society .... we are all human after all and there should be some rights we all share regardless of age!

So IMO just as our ancestors in eras past had a long way to come on their personal journey of how and what was 'best' the reality is there was no 'right or wrong' back them they were all doing the best they could with the resources and science and other factors they had available to them at the time and as they grew and their knowledge evolved so did their practice and while initially some resisted eventually the new way become the 'norm' for all .... and so we are still growing and evolving in regards to how we treat ourselves, our children, the animals, the earth and so forth .... these are all just other 'lessons' we are all still learning together as human beings

Look around the world to see all the varied levels of 'self discovery' and 'social accountability' to each other that you can see ... we are so vastly on different paths still and sometimes we find it hard to imagine how other countries cannot be in the same places as we are in some areas ~ like the treatment of women in Middle Eastern countries and how we as a North American often 'judge' them for being so barbaric in their treatment of women and children and heck we even have gone to war to prevent that treatment ... but the reality is that it is not so very different from how we were treated back in the 1700, 1800 and early 1900's and yet we already find it hard to imagine that ever being tolerated or condoned in our society and cannot imagine how they do not 'see' the wrong in how they treat women and so forth but yet for THEM they are steadfast in their logic as to why they do what they do and they are willing to fight to maintain their way of life despite our evidence that there is a 'better way' to treat women?

And these are the reasons why discussions around 'why' are so important because each time we have them more light gets shed on truly reflecting on our practices and we move along our journey.

In my life there were so many times I 'resisted' change because I was comfortable with the way things were and they worked for me so why change .... for example I resisted the computer for ages because I felt that handwritten was more personal but eventually the more discussions I had with others over the benefits the less afraid I become of the change and now I do everything on the computer

[Sandbox Sally]

I am sure we can all agree that we could not honestly imagine that it would be ok if you did not starch your spouses work shirts properly that he could turn you over his knee and give you 5 spanks with his hand or a hairbrush or whatever or that if you were working in an office setting and forgot to refill the photocopier that it was acceptable for the boss to spank you in an effort to help you learn to perform properly

This is an excellent analogy. I wish I could figure out how to multi quote, because I am in love with this entire post. Very eloquently said, Reggio.

[fruitloop]

I am sure we can all agree that we could not honestly imagine that it would be ok if you did not starch your spouses work shirts properly that he could turn you over his knee and give you 5 spanks with his hand or a hairbrush or whatever or that if you were working in an office setting and forgot to refill the photocopier that it was acceptable for the boss to spank you in an effort to help you learn to perform properly

This is an excellent analogy. I wish I could figure out how to multi quote, because I am in love with this entire post. Very eloquently said, Reggio.

This in NOT something I would spank for though. Something that I would deem neccessary for a spanking for example would be...my child running out into the street for the 50th time and no talking/reasoning is getting through to them. I then...on the 51st time would smack their butt. Not doing something properly (like the examples in Reggio's post) in my mind do not warrant a spanking. I reserve spanking as a last resort thing when NOTHING else is getting through to them in a serious situation where harm could come to the child. I would never spank because my child didn't put something away properly, or clean their room right, etc.

A parent who chooses not to spank but USES other forms of discipline THAT WORK are just as good of a parent as someone, like me, who chooses to spank when it is deemed neccessary. Just different parenting styles, that's all.

[kidlove]

Thanks for your view Reggio. Was nice (and long) to have another opinion. You have some great points, respect girlfriend. Still doesn't change my mind, I will continue to spank (if neccesary) and hope my kids will raise their kids the same and on and on for generations to come. I respect and honor my Grandparents and Parents ways of life and will continue those "ways" passing on to my kids who will pass to theres. I understand your view point and respect it...it's you right. However the more we try to analyze and fix the world IMO the more "screwed up" it will be. "Just leave well enough alone", that's my motto. God gave me the intelligence to do what I do, I didn't have to further my education to become a good Mom, just have to rely on the good Lord and I have all the know how I need. Some call it "street smarts" some call it "common sense" what ever you call it, thats all you need to do a good job at being a Mom and a Good Wife. No womens lib, no reading this book or that, just down right common sense. and a good role model....my momma was awsome. (so was my grammy)

[kidlove]

I don't know alpha, the only thing I got out of that, was missing my hubby......wish he wore white shirts so I could leave out the starch on purpose.....I always welcome a few "spanks" keeps things "alive" if you know what I mean!
TOO "DEEP" LADIES!!!!! Lets have a little fun!!!!!!!!!!!